You and Your Glasses

Hi Ron

Hi Ron

I believe that individual variability, regardless of the culture, or country has a lot to do with the level of myopia, especially school onset myopia.

Do you ever go on field trips or attend your kids class? See variations in behaviors, skill sets, heights, weights, skin colors, and all kinds of variances of traits we know to be of mixed genetic and environmental factors, whether you believe the latter to be 30% or 90% for myopia?

I agree with your last sentence. The interesting thing to me, and maybe to you is the variances between Asian countries like mainland China, Singapore, Japan, and Malaysia. We know that some of these countries have a lot of other things going on besides vision than English speaking countries (or countries using a primary Romanized language for writing in elementary school). There is learning of languages that use different part of the brain (kanji is graphical, right side, roman is more left, analytical) - Japan uses Kanji, but also two phonetical languages, Hiragana and Katakana, China has different levels depending on age and region.

Most languages taken in elementary schools in north America use roman languages. Some of the studies involving Asian students have taken rise in heartbeat as a measurement in addition to myopia changes.

I think we agree on a lot, but time will tell what factors early and overly frequent corrective solutions to myopia have on children around the world. I'm sorry this is a sore spot with you, but it's something I strongly believe.

Also, regarding the kid on the farm, I do not think he has myopia and doesn't know it as you alluded. I agree he would likely be in the range as he entered schools with constant close reading/viewing, but before he has done this, he does not have myopia, and that is also the view of some of the studies that measured rural Asian childrens vision.


visiondr said:
Excellent! Thank you for the summary.
Again, near work and a close in environment are likely the major triggers to myopia but the bullet it genetic. If environment were the 90% factor you suggest, why then wouldn't 90% of kids in school for 8 hrs/day become myopic and to exactly the same degree? A varied genetic propensity to become nearsighted explains all the findings described above. The authors suggest the heritability of myopia triggered by near work or a close-in environment is the basis for increased myopia in many societies. I wholeheartedly agree. In other words, it is often not the myopia itself which is inherited, but the reaction to specific environmental conditions — and this reaction can be the onset and the progression of myopia.
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AshenLight said:
I had successful Lasik surgery last October. My vision went from needing a -6 correction to 20/20 uncorrected. Actually, under the right conditions I'm 20/15 uncorrected. It has really made a significant difference in every area especially photography. For anyone who may have been thinking about it but were hesitant, the new blade less, wavefront correction is really amazing.
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I've booked mine for next Wednesday. I chose microkeratome over "bladeless" as the latest technologies for both appear to have very simliar results. I have been wearing glasses for the last 30 years, so it will soon be the first time I will be using a camera without glasses.
 
I'm lucky, in that my glasses are for reading only. Thus, they don't interfere with small rear RF windows, such as that on the Fed. However, to see and change the Fed's shutter speeds which are tiny and etched into the small shutter speed dial... I do have to use my glasses. It is for this reason, that I prefer the Bessa R and the very user friendly Oly 35 RC: I can adjust speeds and apertures without the glasses.
 
I was just about to put my 40mm Nokton up for sale because of how hard it is to see the framelines in my Bessa R3A with my glasses on (I'm VERY near-sighted... -5 diopter). At about that moment I was talking to the local Voigtlander dealer and mentioned my frustration with the 40mm framelines. He suggested I try a diopter lens that Nikon (Cosina actually) makes for their FM bodies. I found one at the local camera shop and it works GREAT! Alright... I'm walking around with my glasses hanging out of my mouth a lot now, but I LOVE seeing the 40 framelines and I REALLY love being able to keep the 40 Nokton! 🙂
 
I've worn glasses for 50+ years. I can compose with the glasses off, but need them to focus accurately. I use a boaters harness to allow my specs to hang around my neck when they are off my nose. There are many versions - roughly it's a 12" length of fabric or ribbon that goes behind your neck, with loops or tubes on the end to grasp your glasses earpieces - designed to keep your sunglasses from falling into the aqua..
I've had no scratching problems with my Canon P. but have added rubber "O" rings to the eyepieces of my 7, my Kievs and several SLRs.
 
Great to hear

Great to hear

I've had great success using my Nikon diopter from my F3 on the Epson RD1. Good to know that the R3A uses standard Nikon diopters.

Jamie Pillers said:
I was just about to put my 40mm Nokton up for sale because of how hard it is to see the framelines in my Bessa R3A with my glasses on (I'm VERY near-sighted... -5 diopter). At about that moment I was talking to the local Voigtlander dealer and mentioned my frustration with the 40mm framelines. He suggested I try a diopter lens that Nikon (Cosina actually) makes for their FM bodies. I found one at the local camera shop and it works GREAT! Alright... I'm walking around with my glasses hanging out of my mouth a lot now, but I LOVE seeing the 40 framelines and I REALLY love being able to keep the 40 Nokton! 🙂
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I've worn glasses since I was about 11 or 12 years old and always photograph with them on. I've found it's helped to get smaller and smaller frames each time, so the lens sits high on my nose and I can get close enough to see just about all of the finder image.

Lately, as my vision has been changing, I sometimes take my glasses off to look at the groundglass when I'm shooting large format. Close enough, I can focus pretty well without a loupe, but I still do better with a loupe and my glasses.

The only time I take my glasses off to focus is in the darkroom with a grain focuser, because it has enough room for adjustment to accommodate my natural eyesight.
 
So – it looks like different solutions for different people, influenced by many things – correction needed, style of shooting, viewfinder lines, love of eyeglasses, etc. I’m still working through this, but here’s what I’ve found so far. YMMV.

To calibrate, I’m –3.5 in my shooting eye (right eye), mild astigmatism, wear progressives in hard (thin) plastic with titanium frames. Tried contacts a long time ago; no go. So I needed something that dealt with scratches, clear vision, and view of the viewfinder.

Currently shooting mostly with Leica M2, M3, RD-1, Xpan, Canon F1, Olympus OM as well as some others.

Spent time looking at the various add-ons to the Leica eyepiece ring – many of them created greater distance from the eyepiece, or involved the DIY (liquid rubber) or barrel distortion (0.85x). What worked best was DAG plastic cover that fits over the outside diameter of the eyepiece ring – very thin, protected eyeglass lens.

Eventually, however, I found that getting a –3 diopter (or relevant equivalent for the individual camera) worked best. I’ve tried both the Leica and the HK Supplies –3 on my Leicas. Perhaps there’s a difference but not large enough to hit me between the eyes (can’t tell whether that pun was intended). Head Bartender’s –3 on the RD-1 (one of the Nikon’s fits and uses your prescription number, rather than requiring additions/subtractions, but is not rubberized so no help in preserving glasses). Equivalent is a –4 on the Xpan. Zorki 4K has a diopter correction. Various brands of SLRs have their own native correction in the viewfinder and label the diopter on the basis of the total, not just what you add.

The procedure I use is this. When I want to shoot, I put the camera to my eye with the left hand while pushing my glasses to my forehead with my right (very little delay), then right hand goes to camera to operate. Haven’t lost/dropped the glasses yet; but that may be easier to do with plastic frames.

Added advantage of this process, higher contrast, fewer reflections in the viewfinder, easier to focus.

As for variations, I have read, but not verified, that greater astigmatism than mine may disallow using the commercially available diopters.

Finally, there are eyeglass frames made so either eyepiece can be moved out of the way to shoot. Your dispensing optician will find them under “make-up glasses”.
 
ampguy said:
So for the R3A, does one have to use CV diopters, or will Nikon made and branded diopters work?
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Don't remember the Nikon body, but as indicated in the longer post above, ordered both Nikon and Cosina diopters for the RD1. Both work optically; the Nikon ones I ordered were metal, w/o rubber protection. The rubber was worth the extra $9 (Nikon $16, Cosina $25 to me). Besides, the camera looked better that way and, as we all know, that improves the quality of our pictures.😀
 
Like Tom, I have worn glasses since I was 5 with astigmatism and myopia. As I aged into my retirement my eyes finally improved to -4 and the astigmatism is gone. As it is now, I too have to put my glasses right up to the finder, suffering the grease marks and all in order to see the entire frame lines, and only if I move my head around. In shopping for a diopter correction lens for the Leica which is not adjustable like my SLR's I found to my dismay that the strongest made for Leica is a -3. I almost gave up until a few days ago. I found that the M8 has a -0.5 bias. So I happily ordered a magnifier and a -3 diopter correction lens that will fit it from a vendor in Hong Kong; both for about $70. They claim that the glass is Japanese, so maybe I'll luck out. A -3.5 (including the -.5 of the M8 finder) should be close enough to work. Incidentally, I also sight with my left eye, but I assumed that it was related to the fact that I am also left handed. What about the rest of you poor myopics? Are you also left handed? It's probably best not to answer because that will start a whole new thread.
Cheers,
Jim Evidon
 
bcostin said:
After a while you do get a feel for the part of the finder you can't see, and you can to move your eye around a bit to take more in. Not perfect, but good enough for me. I've finally stopped worrying about the inevitable scratches on my lenses, and I don't even notice them most of the time. I'm due to get a new prescription later this month and have been thinking about relegating the old pair to special camera duty, but I doubt that I'd stick to that arrangement for very long.
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This is pretty much how it's been from the beginning for me (bespectacled since age seven; see avatar). I struggled a bit, way back, with SLRs until I got hold of a pair of Nikon F3 HPs, then struggled some more until getting a pair of Minolta 9xi bodies, then onto my current Hexars. I was expecting real problems with the Hex's 28mm framelines, but it's not nearly the issue I imagined...not perfect, but quite manageable. I've been lucky that most all the cameras I really grokked with had rubberized/plasticized eyepiece surrounds, minimizing eyeglass lens scratching (can't really afford twice-annual lens replacements like Tom). Being nearsighted, I'm lucky that my vision has steadily strengthened in the last decade (one of the handful of advantages of hitting what we call Middle Age, at least if you're nearsighted), and, if absolutely necessary, I can focus my Hexars sans spectacles, though it's not quite a fun experience.

And, now that Tom mentions it, most of my photographer friends and associates do have some sort of vision "defect." Yep, that must partly explain my near-lifelong fascination with all this stuff. 😉


- Barrett
 
I do OK wearing my glasses with my Bessas and SLRs. The only camera that gives me problems is the Yashica Electro 35 Gxx. I have to remove my glasses to clearly see the RF patch on both of my GSNs.
 
that should work

that should work

btw, m film bodies and many SLRs also have a negative bias (~ -0.5) built-in.

I use my right eye, and am slightly myopic ( < -2.0 in both eyes). I think there's something to Tom A.'s mention of correlation between left eyed photographers.

Some interesting links on L/R brain activity and switching are here and here.

Jim Evidon said:
Like Tom, I have worn glasses since I was 5 with astigmatism and myopia. As I aged into my retirement my eyes finally improved to -4 and the astigmatism is gone. As it is now, I too have to put my glasses right up to the finder, suffering the grease marks and all in order to see the entire frame lines, and only if I move my head around. In shopping for a diopter correction lens for the Leica which is not adjustable like my SLR's I found to my dismay that the strongest made for Leica is a -3. I almost gave up until a few days ago. I found that the M8 has a -0.5 bias. So I happily ordered a magnifier and a -3 diopter correction lens that will fit it from a vendor in Hong Kong; both for about $70. They claim that the glass is Japanese, so maybe I'll luck out. A -3.5 (including the -.5 of the M8 finder) should be close enough to work. Incidentally, I also sight with my left eye, but I assumed that it was related to the fact that I am also left handed. What about the rest of you poor myopics? Are you also left handed? It's probably best not to answer because that will start a whole new thread.
Cheers,
Jim Evidon
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f/stopblues said:
I found this picture a friend took of me while shooting with my sadly departed R2A and Ultron 35/1.7 <sigh>

This is my usual shooting stance I think.. scrunched up face, glasses in my mouth. Yummy!

camera1.jpg
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Usually I leave my glasses on. (Works well with the 40D with its adjustable eye piece.)
I might have to remove my glasses with the M6TTL or the M8 depending on what lens I'm using. When I do that I put my glasses in my mouth.
 
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