Another "reliable" m6 problem

[denizg7]

Not trying to troll here but I am pretty much sick of the problems i've been having with my "mint" m6..

so when i was looking at my slides today , I saw 20 pictures that were underexposed...

I thought the problem was from me somehow , but I went to Nippon and they said the shutter speed of 1/1000 was actually 1/2000 and anything after 1/124 was extremly off , even 1/124 was a little off..

So i asked the very helpful gentlemen how much would it cost and he said 280 dollars, but he said this also includes CLA of the entire body..

So frustrated i am looking online and I found this thread

http://feuerbacher.net/photo/repair/LeicaMP/LeicaMP.html

It looks helpful but I still can't see how he can precisely make 1/1000 sec count and doesn't write on how to do that , just opening it up..


So my question is has anyone fixed their shutter speeds by their self as a success?

thanks,

Dennis

 

[Pablito]

Sounds like a reasonable price for the repair....
You need a shutter testing machine and a whole lot of specialized tools and knowledge to do this sort of repair..

 

[Ranchu]

I would not recommend trying that, the person makes it sound a lot easier than it is. The tiny wheels that he's turning with the caliper are under tension (the shutter springs). If you let that tension go the shutter curtain goes entirely slack. You can wind it up again but you won't know where to stop. This is precisely how cameras get hacked up.

 

[crispy12]

Sounds like a very complicated repair, especially if you're not familiar with camera adjustments. There's a risk of making it worse, I've attempted it on a cheap Canonet and I think I'd have more peace of mind getting an expert to repair my $1000 camera 😛 Not to mention the CLA also includes a complete check of the camera and usually includes some warranty if additional problems arise. You'll have a great camera for the next 50 years!

 

[Iestrada]

I highly recommend you let a professional do it for you. Give Youxin a try. His rates can not be beat.

http://www.yyecamera.com/price_m_body.html

 

[bugmenot]

Funny, after 22 years of rigorous use, my Nikon F3 has never needed a CLA (other than a damp cloth to clean the exterior, and a air blower to clean the interior), and I took it to a repair shop in San Diego this past summer, they tested the Shutter Speeds and Meter, and it was spot on.

You can find hundreds of threads about CLA and Overhaul in this forum with regards to Leica cameras.

Nothing against Leica as I have owned a Leica M3 and M4 in the past and loved them, but so much for reliability.

 

[nobbylon]

Dennis,
the 1000th speed is one of the common problems as are the slow speeds.
The first curtain bearings are dry causing too narrow a slit width as the curtains travel. It needs the core removing from the shell and the bearings of the curtain rollers and the drum shim lubed. It's not a DIY job unless you are familiar with M strip downs as the light shield needs to be removed to do this work. I would not advise changing any settings of the tensions on rollers or the timing mechanism as these were set at factory and once lubricated should work as normal. I've had this in many M's and first call is to clean and then lubricate. Once I have done this the shutters nearly always return to spec.
Messing around with factory settings will make it a bigger job than necessary.
I would recommend sending it to someone who knows what they are doing. If on the other hand you are familiar with seperating the core and shell it's an easy fix.

 

[denizg7]

Funny, after 22 years of rigorous use, my Nikon F3 has never needed a CLA (other than a damp cloth to clean the exterior, and a air blower to clean the interior), and I took it to a repair shop in San Diego this past summer, they tested the Shutter Speeds and Meter, and it was spot on.

You can find hundreds of threads about CLA and Overhaul in this forum with regards to Leica cameras.

Nothing against Leica as I have owned a Leica M3 and M4 in the past and loved them, but so much for reliability.

yeah i know right .. Rangefinders are delicate cameras. i had this titanium shutter slr from nikon that was much much more reliable than a leica ..

 

[denizg7]

Dennis,
the 1000th speed is one of the common problems as are the slow speeds.
The first curtain bearings are dry causing too narrow a slit width as the curtains travel. It needs the core removing from the shell and the bearings of the curtain rollers and the drum shim lubed. It's not a DIY job unless you are familiar with M strip downs as the light shield needs to be removed to do this work. I would not advise changing any settings of the tensions on rollers or the timing mechanism as these were set at factory and once lubricated should work as normal. I've had this in many M's and first call is to clean and then lubricate. Once I have done this the shutters nearly always return to spec.
Messing around with factory settings will make it a bigger job than necessary.
I would recommend sending it to someone who knows what they are doing. If on the other hand you are familiar with seperating the core and shell it's an easy fix.

thanks for the tip. Got it, ill send it to Nippon soon. But after having a bit of problem with the M i can't enjoy it as much as i used to.. If this becomes an occurrence every 2 years i might CLA and sell it

 

[maddoc]

yeah i know right .. Rangefinders are delicate cameras. i had this titanium shutter slr from nikon that was much much more reliable than a leica ..

I think you should better have kept that Nikon SLR ... 😀

 

[nobbylon]

Don't forget that most M6 are 20+ years old and if it's mint it's probably not been used a lot. If it had been regularly used it would prob' be fine.
Once it's done properly and given regular use it should be good for a long time to come.
I've had similar problems with F's and F2's that I have bought in the past. Never had any problems with any F3 I've had though apart from 1 that had a sticky mirror.
That's the thing with mechanical things though, if you don't use them they get lazy!

 

[denizg7]

I think you should better have kept that Nikon SLR ... 😀

i just too used to the rangefinder focusing and the soft backround lenses.. it's addicting.. Only if DSLRS were never made and rangefinder's were still commerical then nikon woulda made the perfect titanium shutter rangefinder with an M mount oh boy

 

[denizg7]

Don't forget that most M6 are 20+ years old and if it's mint it's probably not been used a lot. If it had been regularly used it would prob' be fine.
Once it's done properly and given regular use it should be good for a long time to come.
I've had similar problems with F's and F2's that I have bought in the past. Never had any problems with any F3 I've had though apart from 1 that had a sticky mirror.
That's the thing with mechanical things though, if you don't use them they get lazy!

quite right, this one had dust when i bought it.. I am gonna hope this 280 dollar repair will last me 10 years with frequent use!

 

[Chriscrawfordphoto]

Funny, after 22 years of rigorous use, my Nikon F3 has never needed a CLA (other than a damp cloth to clean the exterior, and a air blower to clean the interior), and I took it to a repair shop in San Diego this past summer, they tested the Shutter Speeds and Meter, and it was spot on.

You can find hundreds of threads about CLA and Overhaul in this forum with regards to Leica cameras.

Nothing against Leica as I have owned a Leica M3 and M4 in the past and loved them, but so much for reliability.

Cameras with electronically controlled shutters like the F3 rarely need adjustment. Mechanical shutters like the Leica's do need periodic adjustment as the springs weaken with use, and lubricants gum up.

 

[sanmich]

I had three repairs on my two F3's after small knocks or simply after the electronics self destructed.
I think the Nikons that were to be compared here are the F and F2....
That being said, once your M is CLA'd, the only possible trouble short of half destroying the camera would be knocking the RF off.

 

[Frontman]

Cameras with electronically controlled shutters like the F3 rarely need adjustment. Mechanical shutters like the Leica's do need periodic adjustment as the springs weaken with use, and lubricants gum up.

My old Nikon S and F cameras have mechanical shutters, and neither have ever needed adjustment or repair. Not being argumentative, but Nikon has made many great cameras,

 

[zuiko85]

I think one of the problems with mint Leicas is that they are *mint*, but 10 or 15 or 20 years old. How did they remain in such good cosmetic shape? Probably sat unused for a decade or more. That is death to a mechanical camera with close tolerances. If your mint M6 had been regularly used since new it would not look mint but I'd venture it would not be giving you problems now.

 

[baisao]

I feel like a lot of the problems people have with Leica reliability can be traced to two extreme user habits: 1) unnecessary, too frequent, or poorly attempted CLAs because users/sellers want/demand it; 2) many Leicaphiles are collectors that (unknowingly?) let their gear gum up on their display shelf.

 

[jtm6]

That being said, once your M is CLA'd, the only possible trouble short of half destroying the camera would be knocking the RF off.

What kind of force is required to knock the alignment off? I'm mostly interested in vertical alignment since that seems to be much more difficult to adjust (behind the dot, special tool, etc) than the horizontal alignment, at least in an m6.

 

[nobbylon]

What kind of force is required to knock the alignment off? I'm mostly interested in vertical alignment since that seems to be much more difficult to adjust (behind the dot, special tool, etc) than the horizontal alignment, at least in an m6.

M6ttl, top pocket of my canvas army jacket, slid of my bike and hit the cobbled street. It knocked the vertical alignment out and I then knocked it back with an opposite slap to the palm of my hand.
It takes more than you think to knock out of alignment, far more than is considered normal usage and still perfectly usable afterward.