boojum
Ignoble Miscreant
There seems to be a running thread on camera BBS's about whether one should keep both eyes open when shooting or not. Some folks are quite dogmatic about this. OTOH if you look at the folks whom we consider to be great you will see some keep both eyes open and some do not. So which way is "right"? I am opting for whatever works for you.
WoodallP
Pragmatist Barnack lover
Not with this viewfinder! Both eyes or nothing
boojum
Ignoble Miscreant
Not with this viewfinder! Both eyes or nothing
Is that opinion or law?
There is much ritual and code involved with many hobbies and this one is no exception. How about if I wear an eye patch with an eye painted onto it so it looks like I have both eyes open? Will that work? ;o)
Glenn2
Well-known
I’ve got several kontur finders, both 35mm and 6x9. The frame lines are clear areas on an opaque background. It would probably be easy to make using Kodalith film, old tech or go modern with computer and transparent material to print on.
I’m not an optics expert just a person who spent his working years doing neat science stuff in research labs. After giving some thought to the subject of Kontur finder design I came up with a couple ideas for a modern version.
First the high end… A small screen such as are common in mirrorless these days. At the time I was experimenting low resolution stuff was easy to get. You don’t need hi res, you’re only generating thin frame lines. Just add a suitable lens, case and foot and it should work.
What I wasn’t able to do was write the code to generate the frame lines. A friend was supposed to assist, but got diverted. Of course having frame lines in software means easy adjustments for focal length, etc. Nikon DSLRs have pins on the shoe that send distance and focal length to control their zoom flashes. Trying to photograph birds in flight is especially difficult with a long lens. A zoomable kontur would be very useful. I got a simple working prototype, but never took it farther. At one point I wanted to enlist Tom A.s help with details, sad that he passed before it could happen.
Second the low tech route. Engrave the frame lines on a thin piece of transparent plastic, back this with an opaque material. A small bright light LED at the edge lights up the lines. It’s even possible to stack several of the clear sheets and get different lines with the flip of a switch.
I was able to source the optical parts fairly quickly. I got several magnifiers that are designed for measuring thread count of fabrics.
Still got all the bits, should pass them on to someone with the skills and time.
If Kontur finders have gotten you curious there’s an easy way to see the effect.
If you’ve got an M Leica or similar, cover the view window on the front with something that blocks all light. Black electrical tape that you’ve pressed your thumb against a few times works well. You just need to block the light. Also cover the range finder window.
If you’ve got an X-100 type cover the window as above.
Now hold the camera up to your right eye while keeping the left eye open. What you will see are the frames floating in your field of vision. The brain cleverly puts things together. The frames you see will be wrong for the focal length. The lines you see divided by the finder magnification is the apparent Kontur focal length.
Crazy ideas from an old guy. ;-)
I’m not an optics expert just a person who spent his working years doing neat science stuff in research labs. After giving some thought to the subject of Kontur finder design I came up with a couple ideas for a modern version.
First the high end… A small screen such as are common in mirrorless these days. At the time I was experimenting low resolution stuff was easy to get. You don’t need hi res, you’re only generating thin frame lines. Just add a suitable lens, case and foot and it should work.
What I wasn’t able to do was write the code to generate the frame lines. A friend was supposed to assist, but got diverted. Of course having frame lines in software means easy adjustments for focal length, etc. Nikon DSLRs have pins on the shoe that send distance and focal length to control their zoom flashes. Trying to photograph birds in flight is especially difficult with a long lens. A zoomable kontur would be very useful. I got a simple working prototype, but never took it farther. At one point I wanted to enlist Tom A.s help with details, sad that he passed before it could happen.
Second the low tech route. Engrave the frame lines on a thin piece of transparent plastic, back this with an opaque material. A small bright light LED at the edge lights up the lines. It’s even possible to stack several of the clear sheets and get different lines with the flip of a switch.
I was able to source the optical parts fairly quickly. I got several magnifiers that are designed for measuring thread count of fabrics.
Still got all the bits, should pass them on to someone with the skills and time.
If Kontur finders have gotten you curious there’s an easy way to see the effect.
If you’ve got an M Leica or similar, cover the view window on the front with something that blocks all light. Black electrical tape that you’ve pressed your thumb against a few times works well. You just need to block the light. Also cover the range finder window.
If you’ve got an X-100 type cover the window as above.
Now hold the camera up to your right eye while keeping the left eye open. What you will see are the frames floating in your field of vision. The brain cleverly puts things together. The frames you see will be wrong for the focal length. The lines you see divided by the finder magnification is the apparent Kontur focal length.
Crazy ideas from an old guy. ;-)
Godfrey
somewhat colored
@Glenn2 .... I did that the first time I heard of the Kontur finders. It worked well for me; I bought the Kontur finder for 6x6 and the other for 24x36 shortly afterwards. They work superbly. Yes, you can likely make one pretty easily if you're handy with small optics, but the originals that work so well are pretty cheap and easy to find.
@boojum ... A Kontur finder requires use of both eyes. The whole point is that one eye (which ever you prefer) sees the frame lines and the other eye sees the subject: your brain puts the two together (if your brain works like a normal human brain does with binocular vision; this is not true for some people... ).
Whether you like to keep one eye closed when using a conventional optical finder or not is completely up to you. I use both methodologies with conventional viewfinders depending upon the situation and my needs.
G
digression: It's time for my walk and today's test shooting will be with the restored Voigtländer Vitessa. Now ... Should I fit the Kontur finder or just use the standard viewfinder?
@boojum ... A Kontur finder requires use of both eyes. The whole point is that one eye (which ever you prefer) sees the frame lines and the other eye sees the subject: your brain puts the two together (if your brain works like a normal human brain does with binocular vision; this is not true for some people... ).
Whether you like to keep one eye closed when using a conventional optical finder or not is completely up to you. I use both methodologies with conventional viewfinders depending upon the situation and my needs.
G
digression: It's time for my walk and today's test shooting will be with the restored Voigtländer Vitessa. Now ... Should I fit the Kontur finder or just use the standard viewfinder?
Leon C
Well-known
For me personally it depends on what I'm taking pics of, I can do either, from my days as a music photographer it was handy to keep an eye on what else was happening on stage but for my personal work it focuses me if I use one eye.
pixelated
Established
These days I shoot with one eye closed. But way back when, doing football games for my high school newspaper I learned that having both eyes open is a good idea in sketchy situations.
Retro-Grouch
Veteran
I'll bet it could almost hold your camera collection!Just took delivery of a 20ft storage container (or ‘seacan’ as they’re called in these here parts). After delivery one of our contractors shimmed and leveled it, as it shouldn’t be sitting directly on the ground.
Now when my friends and relatives visit I’ll have a place for them to stay
View attachment 4850595
shawn
Veteran
Law, the viewfinder is almost entirely blacked out except for the frame lines. You need both eyes open for your brain the superimpose the framelines on top of the vision from your other eye.
shawn
Veteran
They are pretty close to the same. About 4 degrees different horizontally and 3 vertically.
There are a number of different variations of the Kontor included 6x6. Some of the '50mm' look like the only difference is about the position of the framelines due to parallax of the cold shoe on the camera it was built for.
Do you think the metal shims used for 8' optics tables might work?
Alpsman
Well-known
The "Shoe Base" from Cosina / Voigtländer for the Nikon F and/or F2.
Actually not absolutely necessary, since you can put the viewfinder on the accessory shoe. But - so what? Do we want to discuss self-control again?
Of course, I also designed and printed a suitable box.
This small box takes up less space in the cupboard (this creates more space for more accessories) and the original packaging is also preserved.
Now all I need is the matching 15mm Voigtländer . . .
Actually not absolutely necessary, since you can put the viewfinder on the accessory shoe. But - so what? Do we want to discuss self-control again?
Of course, I also designed and printed a suitable box.
Schachtel für Voigtländer Shoe Base für Nikon F oder F2; Box for Voigtländer Shoe Base for Nikon F or F2 by blechbude | Download free STL model | Printables.com
Schachtel für Voigtländer Shoe Base für Nikon F oder F2; Box for Voigtländer Shoe Base for Nikon F or F2 | Download free 3D printable STL models
www.printables.com
Now all I need is the matching 15mm Voigtländer . . .
Leon C
Well-known
So it's landed and the Rangfinder does indeed need cleaning, or the glass does at least, I started to clean the top before I remove it [Someone has already going off the marks on the winder] and do it properly, to assess any possible damage, going to look nice I think for the £13 it cost and it does indeed seem to all work.
I did really just want to add that this is another 'bargain' I bought and took a chance with, the glass was mentioned and is obvious but it was also described as having a dodgy door release, it does feel a bit loose but on these, I found out, there's a certain way to open them and when it first landed I didn't know that and it did indeed feel 'dodgy' but once I discovered the proper way, it opens first time now, every time, so another Camera mistaken as broken because of user error!
I did really just want to add that this is another 'bargain' I bought and took a chance with, the glass was mentioned and is obvious but it was also described as having a dodgy door release, it does feel a bit loose but on these, I found out, there's a certain way to open them and when it first landed I didn't know that and it did indeed feel 'dodgy' but once I discovered the proper way, it opens first time now, every time, so another Camera mistaken as broken because of user error!
rfaspen
[insert pithy phrase here]
Vince, are you going to paint that thing?
I've been fighting, error I mean discussing, with my wife just to have a garden shed in the back yard. I offered her complete freedom to paint it any way she likes.
Still not budging 😠
I've been fighting, error I mean discussing, with my wife just to have a garden shed in the back yard. I offered her complete freedom to paint it any way she likes.
Still not budging 😠
Vince Lupo
Whatever
I don’t think so, although it’s always subject to change. Definitely not on the priority list but if we did decide to paint it, then the ‘ebony’ colour of the house would seem right.
Godfrey
somewhat colored
digression: It's time for my walk and today's test shooting will be with the restored Voigtländer Vitessa. Now ... Should I fit the Kontur finder or just use the standard viewfinder?
I read the Voigtländer Vitessa manual and learned how to load it. It is a little tricky due to the plunger-film advance-shutter cocking mechanism but, with a bit of effort, it seems to have loaded and be working correctly. The camera feels nice in the hand and seems to work well. I didn't put the Kontur finder on the other day ... walked for an hour and made 14 exposures. I'll fit the Kontur and finish up the roll on today's walk.
Have to say: the "barn door" folding mechanism is cool as heck to look at and the plunger is very direct, but honestly the Retina IIc folding and winding mechanisms are simpler and easier to use. Both are about equal on the quality of the range/viewfinder and focusing feel. The Vitessa's thumb wheel focusing takes a little getting used to, for me, but proves easy once I got the muscle memory in place. Both are a little crowded/fiddly in the space where you need to adjust the EV/aperture/shutter speed settings to adjust for exposure ... the Leica Barnak from the same era are much easier to set shutter and aperture with, and without the complication of the coupled EV setting.
Now to get on with rendering a few more of the Vito II negatives into prints.
G
Rick Waldroup
Well-known
A Gordy wrist strap for my new Ricoh GR IIIx. I received my GR a couple of weeks ago but have not been able to use it because of illness- nothing major, just a temporary immobility issue. I hope to make a train trip to downtown Dallas next week and spend some time shooting the camera. Gordy mailed the strap today so it should be here before my day trip.
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Paul_Taylor
Newbie
IIIa from the early 1930s, with uncoated Nickel Elmar.
Michael Markey
Veteran
Probably rather foolishly bought (again) two of the native lenses for my CL .
The 55/135 and the 35 summilux.
I`ve always found the little CL useful and have been using full frame lenses on it for the last couple of years but looking back on the relatively good performance of the native lenses I decided to reinvest.
The second hand prices seem err buoyant
The 55/135 and the 35 summilux.
I`ve always found the little CL useful and have been using full frame lenses on it for the last couple of years but looking back on the relatively good performance of the native lenses I decided to reinvest.
The second hand prices seem err buoyant
Godfrey
somewhat colored
Interesting. I have the Nikon F Hot Shoe Adapter for such purposes ... It puts the viewfinder slightly off to one side but with a 15mm (or 10mm) lens, the best viewfinder typically barely shows 80% of the full field of view so that error is inconsequential.
Early Nikon F plain prism - Vintage 1963-1964 production
G