Leica M5 compatibility?

[wrs1145]

I’ve contemplating purchasing a Leica M5 and read that this camera will not support the below listed lenses. My question is that true?

C/V 21/4

C/V 25/4

Canon 25/ 3.5

Canon 28/2.8

Canon 28/3.5

Orion 15 28/6

Thanks for your replies,
Bill

 

[Rob-F]

Well, I don't have any of those lenses, but the concern, with the M5, is that, being wide-angle lenses, the rear element and the rear of the barrel, might protrude too far into the camera chamber. If it does, it will damage--destroy-- the metering stalk that holds the photocell. This was an issue with the 21mm Super-Angulon. The cure is to file away about one mm or so from the bayonet lug that activates the stalk. Of course, then you have no metering.

Bill, just get an M6 instead. Trust me, it's a much better idea, if you are going to use lenses you aren't sure about. I actually prefer the M6's metering.

 

[Slumgullion]

I don't have all (or most of those lenses), but I can confirm that the M5 works great with the Voigtlander lenses mentioned. It will work with all modern CV lenses.

Don't have the Canon lenses or the Orion, but based on pictures of how far the rear element lens extends from the body, I'd guess that all of them should be fine.

The M5 is an exceptional camera. The list of lenses that it doesn't jive with is really quite short. Don't let that scare you away from the single most ergonomic/fast to operate M (outside of the M7) with the most accurate and useful meter (including the M7).

 

[38Deardorff]

It's primarily the collapsible lenses and those with protruding rear elements like the Super Angulon 3.4..... that could cause issues on the M5.
On the subject of Canon lenses... I have the Canon 28.. f2.8 and use it with no problems on the CL (which shares the same meter system as the M5)

 

[splitimageview]

It's primarily the collapsible lenses

I have tested M5s with many collapsibles and never had any conflict with the meter arm with any of them...Elmars, Summitars, Summicrons, Fuji Cristar, Nikkor, etc. (This also applies to CLs.) If this is still a concern, place one or two o-rings of slightly less diameter than the barrel of the collapsible. These are essentially invisible but will keep the lens from collapsing completely.

 

[ellisson]

The first and second versions of the Leica elmarit 28mm f2.8 lenses also interfere with the M5 metering arm. But there are plenty of other 28mm options including the later version of Leicas 28mm elmarit lenses.

 

[Slumgullion]

The first and second versions of the Leica elmarit 28mm f2.8 lenses also interfere with the M5 metering arm. But there are plenty of other 28mm options including the later version of Leicas 28mm elmarit lenses.

True, but then again, the M5 doesn't have 28mm framelines. If that focal length is important to the OP they should think about another camera...unless they really love external finders.

 

[CameraQuest]

all of the lenses listed are M5 compatible except for the Orion

also incompatible are the Ruskie LTMs 35 and 20

 

[chuckroast]

I’ve contemplating purchasing a Leica M5 and read that this camera will not support the below listed lenses. My question is that true?

C/V 21/4

C/V 25/4

Canon 25/ 3.5

Canon 28/2.8

Canon 28/3.5

Orion 15 28/6

Thanks for your replies,
Bill

I have the 21mm f/4 Voigtlander Color Skopar in LTM mount and use it without issue on my M5 with an adapter ring (and an aux finder, of course).

There are lenses like the collapsible 50mm Elmar and Summicron which also work fine (I have the LTM Elmar and have used the LTM collapsible Summicron on that body in the past). BUT you should only use them fully extended on the M5, not collapsed. Leica warned this could damage the light meter probe that drops into place in front of the shutter curtain when the camera is cocked due to lack of clearance between that probe and the back of lens when collapsed.


Now I have to go double check to make sure that 21mm never sticks in the camera too deeply at any focus setting, but I am 99% sure it is fine.
Similarly, trhere are some older ridgid ultra wides that cannot be used because they protrude too deeply into the camera. I think some of the early Leica Super Angulons were like this and these had to be modified. I don't know about the other lenses on your list.


P.S. See also -

[M5] Lenses not usable on M5 ?

https://www.perplexity.ai/search/can-the-vogtlander-21mm-f-4-lt-isR5gAVVTCGUR3ncoykdLg

 

[splitimageview]

There are lenses like the collapsible 50mm Elmar and Summicron which also work fine (I have the LTM Elmar and have used the LTM collapsible Summicron on that body in the past). BUT you should only use them fully extended on the M5, not collapsed. Leica warned this could damage the light meter probe that drops into place in front of the shutter curtain when the camera is cocked due to lack of clearance between that probe and the back of lens when collapsed.

They aren't usable when collapsed, of course, but they also don't conflict with the arm even when collapsed. If one is worried about this and want an extra bit of margin for error, see my earlier post about o-rings.

 

[chuckroast]

They aren't usable when collapsed, of course, but they also don't conflict with the arm even when collapsed. If one is worried about this and want an extra bit of margin for error, see my earlier post about o-rings.

Are you sure this is true for every deep well/collapsible lens? There has to be a reason Leica warned against it. I would not take the risk. I'd ensure that a collapsible say out and that I not use any of the lenses they advised against.

 

[38Deardorff]

I have the 21mm f/4 Voigtlander Color Skopar in LTM mount and use it without issue on my M5 with an adapter ring (and an aux finder, of course).

There are lenses like the collapsible 50mm Elmar and Summicron which also work fine (I have the LTM Elmar and have used the LTM collapsible Summicron on that body in the past). BUT you should only use them fully extended on the M5, not collapsed. Leica warned this could damage the light meter probe that drops into place in front of the shutter curtain when the camera is cocked due to lack of clearance between that probe and the back of lens when collapsed.


Now I have to go double check to make sure that 21mm never sticks in the camera too deeply at any focus setting, but I am 99% sure it is fine.
Similarly, trhere are some older ridgid ultra wides that cannot be used because they protrude too deeply into the camera. I think some of the early Leica Super Angulons were like this and these had to be modified. I don't know about the other lenses on your list.


P.S. See also -

[M5] Lenses not usable on M5 ?

https://www.perplexity.ai/search/can-the-vogtlander-21mm-f-4-lt-isR5gAVVTCGUR3ncoykdLg

If I remember correctly the Super Angulon f4 & f3.4 as well as early Elmarit 28, were too long to use on the M5/CL without damaging the meter arm. I don't believe they could be modified.
Super Angulon 3,4/21 before Nr. 2 473 251,
_ Elmarit 2,8/28 ab Nr. 2 314 921.
_ Super Angulon 4/21 LTM

 

[splitimageview]

Are you sure this is true for every deep well/collapsible lens? There has to be a reason Leica warned against it. I would not take the risk. I'd ensure that a collapsible say out and that I not use any of the lenses they advised against.

Yes I'm absolutely sure with the lenses I've measured and tested myself listed here: 50/3.5 Elmar and Nikkor, 50/2 Fuji Cristar, 50/2 Summicron, 50/2 Summitar, 50/2 Nikkor on both the M5 and CL. I have not tested the 50/1.9 Canon or 50/2 Canon, and there are probably other collapsibles out there in the wild as well. 🙂

But if this is worrisome and you want extra margin, just add the o-ring(s) as described above. They are discreet and provide additional margin while still allowing collapsibility.

 

[ellisson]

True, but then again, the M5 doesn't have 28mm framelines. If that focal length is important to the OP they should think about another camera...unless they really love external finders.

Possibly true, but the OP's list and the lenses he is questioning are all wide angle lenses, so he is interested in them. Check it out.

 

[chuckroast]

True, but then again, the M5 doesn't have 28mm framelines. If that focal length is important to the OP they should think about another camera...unless they really love external finders.

The wider the lens the less precise the framelines and the more reasonable an aux finder is. It's an approximation in either case.

I use a 21mm like this all the time on both Barnack and M bodies.

 

[Slumgullion]

The wider the lens the less precise the framelines and the more reasonable an aux finder is. It's an approximation in either case.

I use a 21mm like this all the time on both Barnack and M bodies.

Exactly...and 28mm is just long enough, that close-up (sub 1m), having parallax corrected framelines will give you much more accurate framing. Beyond 1m and and with wider focal lengths it's less critical. I still, regularly, end up cutting the tops of subjects heads off at close distances when using a 21mm external finder (which is certainly a personal problem).

At any rate, the two 21mm lenses I have from Voigtlander extend similarly deep into the body and work flawlessly on the M5.

Southwest Airlines by Jim Fischer, on Flickr
Leica M5, Voigtlander 21mm f/4 Color-Skopar VM, Kodak T-Max 400, Xtol 1:1.

Jenny by Jim Fischer, on Flickr
Leica M5, Voigtlander 21mm f/4 Color-Skopar, Fomapan 400, Xtol 1:1

Jenny by Jim Fischer, on Flickr
Leica M5, Voigtlander 21mm f/1.8 Ultron, Ilford HP5+, Xtol 1:1.

 

[Coldkennels]

all of the lenses listed are M5 compatible except for the Orion

This doesn't make any sense; the Orion barely intrudes into the camera at all.

I just got the vernier callipers out; the LTM CV 21mm Color Skopar measures 14.1mm from mount to the back of the rear element's protective shroud with the lens set to infinity. The same measurement for the Orion, on the other hand, is 10mm.

In other words, if the CV 21mm works on the M5, the Orion will be compatible too.

(The Jupiter 12, for those curious, goes approx. 20.5mm deep into the camera. I say approximately because the rear element is totally unprotected and I didn't want to scratch it!)

 

[rfaspen]

I have a CL, not M5. Always thought the meter stalk system was identical with each....but I don't know for sure.

I use the rubber O rings on collapsible lenses like the elmar. I might have used one even without the worry about the CL; it makes my lens collapse nicely. I also have used the CV 21/4 LTM (on M adapter ring) on the CL. Nothing bad happened as far as I know. I don't trust the metering.... party because my CL's meter is twitchy and generally incorrect. But the stalk works fine 😎. I haven't tried the Canon 28/3.5 on the CL (yet) but it looks like it would be OK. Maybe I'll give it a test if I get time.......and remember. Don't have any of the other lenses listed in OP.

 

[38Deardorff]

I have a CL, not M5. Always thought the meter stalk system was identical with each....but I don't know for sure.

I use the rubber O rings on collapsible lenses like the elmar. I might have used one even without the worry about the CL; it makes my lens collapse nicely. I also have used the CV 21/4 LTM (on M adapter ring) on the CL. Nothing bad happened as far as I know. I don't trust the metering.... party because my CL's meter is twitchy and generally incorrect. But the stalk works fine 😎. I haven't tried the Canon 28/3.5 on the CL (yet) but it looks like it would be OK. Maybe I'll give it a test if I get time.......and remember. Don't have any of the other lenses listed in OP.

I have both the CV 21mm/4 and a Canon 28mm f2.8 LTM.... they work fine without damaging the CL meter arm. Back in the day the recommendation was to use dymo label tape on collapsible lenses for the CL/M5..... times have changed ("what's a label maker?")..... & the o-rings look like a fine work around.