Eliminating Gun Terminlogy From Photography

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Lack of respect for our linguistic heritage...

Lack of respect for our linguistic heritage...

<jumps onto soapbox> ;-)

The way in which our history entangles itself with our language is one of the magnificent complexities which enrich human existence. Thousands of years of use by ordinary people, rich and poor, good, bad and middling, have shaped the evolution of the words and phrases which are our inheritance.

Language evolves naturally. This may leave us with terms that derive from a more militaristic, hunter-gathererer-fighter past, but now they are commonly used for benign everyday purposes, so be it...

We live in a world ruled by lawyers, who are the wizards in our modern society and the rest of us increasingly muggles. Language has power - and it is precisely for this reason that we must not let a tiny self-appointed 'elite' of timid, bland, politically-correct middle managers butcher our linguistic heritage for fear of maybe, perhaps, if there is a full-moon and an 'r' in the month, offending someone equally timid, bland and politically correct.

Sorry, just feel strongly about this... :)

<jumps off soapbox>

All the best, Dan
 
icemendicant said:
<jumps onto soapbox> ;-)

The way in which our history entangles itself with our language is one of the magnificent complexities which enrich human existence. Thousands of years of use by ordinary people, rich and poor, good, bad and middling, have shaped the evolution of the words and phrases which are our inheritance.

Language evolves naturally. This may leave us with terms that derive from a more militaristic, hunter-gathererer-fighter past, but now they are commonly used for benign everyday purposes, so be it...

We live in a world ruled by lawyers, who are the wizards in our modern society and the rest of us increasingly muggles. Language has power - and it is precisely for this reason that we must not let a tiny self-appointed 'elite' of timid, bland, politically-correct middle managers butcher our linguistic heritage for fear of maybe, perhaps, if there is a full-moon and an 'r' in the month, offending someone equally timid, bland and politically correct.

Sorry, just feel strongly about this... :)

<jumps off soapbox>

All the best, Dan
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I'm with you on this one Dan.

Happy Winterval!!:bang:
 
icemendicant said:
<jumps onto soapbox> ;-)

The way in which our history entangles itself with our language is one of the magnificent complexities which enrich human existence. Thousands of years of use by ordinary people, rich and poor, good, bad and middling, have shaped the evolution of the words and phrases which are our inheritance.

Language evolves naturally. This may leave us with terms that derive from a more militaristic, hunter-gathererer-fighter past, but now they are commonly used for benign everyday purposes, so be it...

We live in a world ruled by lawyers, who are the wizards in our modern society and the rest of us increasingly muggles. Language has power - and it is precisely for this reason that we must not let a tiny self-appointed 'elite' of timid, bland, politically-correct middle managers butcher our linguistic heritage for fear of maybe, perhaps, if there is a full-moon and an 'r' in the month, offending someone equally timid, bland and politically correct.

Sorry, just feel strongly about this... :)

<jumps off soapbox>

All the best, Dan
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What he said. :D
 
Hiyawaan said:
This is for all the sheep out there: Baahhh.

It is a shame that it is more important to be PC than smart over there. Is it PC to let thousands die so you can save a buck on gas, how about blockades that kill hundreds of children because they cant get medicine, how's about droping 200,000 tons of depleated uranium Yugoslavia? Get serious and Merry Christmas!
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:) :) :) This is odd, because "over here" (and I mean the west coast of the USA) those that most ardently advocate for political correctness in language pretty much hold these same opinions (not exclusively), regarding war, etc. IIRC the premise being that if we change our language, the way we speak, and hence the way we see the world, we ultimately change ourselves. Are the above actions—THEY might argue—not the result of a politically incorrect nation? And, would a politically correct nation be capable of such actions?

As far as within the context of this thread, personally, I use shot, shoot, shooting, etc. and will continue to use it. One person's opinion to his photography class, is just that: an opinion. If it created some introspection for ausDLK, or anyone else, that can't be bad. Or does the thought police forbid opinion and introspection? :)

:)
 
NB23 said:
It's all BS and it's starting to be totally annoying.

Over here, one cannot say Merry christmas no more because the Jews might be shocked. Pathetic!
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In a forum I moderated we had muslims complaining about beeing greeted with merry christmas.

I told them it's a new fangled term for the pagan rites at the winter solstice and that I could help him arange a place at Odins feast in walhalla :)
 
AusDLK: Is this really a political correctness thing??

Maybe that's what the teacher meant, but it's not necessarily so..

I can take a photo and I can make a photograph..

The two aren't precisely the same. I will take longer over the photograph I 'make', more care. The photo I 'take' will be more spontaneous. Going out to shoot will be a quick affair, going out to photograph will be more sedate.

It's an aesthetic thing, a mindset. Subtle, but that's the way it works sometimes. How does a teacher get his class to be more considered?? How about telling them to stop 'shooting' and start 'photographing'...

Of course, if it is merely for PC reasons then it is completely stupid...
 
I don't know why someone would force an association with something they abhor. I take pictures. No-one is the poorer for it. :shrug:
 
No reply from me. Don't have time. I "shot my mouth off" earlier today and need to go sweep the doghouse. :eek:
 
>AusDLK: Is this really a political correctness thing??

Some people are obviously seeing it that way.

I think that with my teacher (again, an adult workshop teacher not a college professor) his feelings run deeper then that. I suspect that it was (and still is) a heartfelt belief that he wanted to disassociate his profession and passion (photography) from an activity that which he disapproved (the use of firearms).

I never felt that he was using his position as a teacher to be a PC cop.

I admit that I found it a bit strange at first. I remembering thinking "what's the big deal?"

But as more time passed I have grown more sympathic and see more value in his point of view.
 
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ask your professor this

ask your professor this

what kills more living things - guns, or the stuff used to make film photos??

AusDLK said:
>Just go out and SHOOT,

I had a photography teacher that had a real problem with the gun (ie. firearm) terminology that infiltrates photography. He would have said:

Just go out and PHOTOGRAPH

I have thought a lot about this over time and try to follow his lead as best I can when I speak and write about photography.

But it is difficult since these terms have become so engrained in language. Without a doubt, using the multi-syllable word "photograph" as a verb in place of "shoot" is awkward. It takes practice to say that I have x "frames" left on a roll of film rather than x "shots".

It's hard to argue with the similarity of hunting for photographs and hunting for prey. Except in the later case, something -- or someone -- dies.

I personally don't think that this is just another case of political correctness at work but I'm curious how my teacher's philosophy resonates within RFf.
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" we 'kill' a program that is running"

I don't mind the dead programs - it's all the 'zombies' we find when we do a process check that worry me.
 
ampguy said:
what kills more living things - guns, or the stuff used to make film photos??
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Ted, don't try to come into my house and take the stuff I use to make film photos. :)


:)
 
jlw said:
Makes you want to line all those ****ing fools up against a wall and shoot them, doesn't it.
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Indeed, it would make an interesting picture.


That's the problem with democracy -- people who disagree with your superior wisdom still get to vote.
I don't see that placing value on life is superior. Wisdom, I'm just a mechanic and a part time photographer, but I try to think, and not just accept whatever I'm told.

Democracy? Well I'm sure that in some parts of the world democracy is alive and well, often despite our attempts to snub it out.

And indeed there are little signs of democratic life in this little country of mine, which is Scotland. The question is whether those little sparks will ignite the true democracy that I and others yearn, for as far as I can see in the UK, democracy is almost dead and buried.

Anyway back to words;

I've not given much thought to 'shooting'. It's an interesting discussion, but I know I'll continue shooting. Why let the gun have exclusive rights to the word shoot. There are lots of ways that we use the word shoot.

But the word that I often do think about, are, 'take', and 'capture'.
Sure I often take and capture things with my lens, but I think more often good shots are gifted to me. People give me photographs.

I also find it slightly disturbing how desperate many photographers are to 'own' those pictures that they have 'taken'.
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Words have different meaning when used in different contexts. The teacher has every right to not choose the word "shoot" and photographers all over also have every right to use the word (or not) or any other word. It isn't a "pc" police conspiracy by the "liberal" agenda or what not. It's just the teachers choice. From what I can tell from the original poster the teacher isn't telling everyone to change his/her choice of words.

For your viewing pleasure..the various definitions of the word in question.
Noun

  • S: (n) shooting, shot (the act of firing a projectile) "his shooting was slow but accurate"
  • S: (n) shooting (killing someone by gunfire) "when the shooting stopped there were three dead bodies"
Verb

 
I learned a lot from High Power NRA rifle shooting that I transferred to my photography.

In low light situations, bone-to-bone contact to provide a steady base, not jerking at the shutter release are all things that help to get better slow shutter speed pics.

As for panning, I don't know if skeet shooting helped my photography, or the other way around.

One thing I know I do better in shooting is paying attention to what is behind the "target". My wife has a lamp growing out of her head in our Christmas shot.

Mark
 
AusDLK said:
>Just go out and SHOOT,

I had a photography teacher that had a real problem with the gun (ie. firearm) terminology that infiltrates photography. He would have said:

Just go out and PHOTOGRAPH

I have thought a lot about this over time and try to follow his lead as best I can when I speak and write about photography.

But it is difficult since these terms have become so engrained in language. Without a doubt, using the multi-syllable word "photograph" as a verb in place of "shoot" is awkward. It takes practice to say that I have x "frames" left on a roll of film rather than x "shots".

It's hard to argue with the similarity of hunting for photographs and hunting for prey. Except in the later case, something -- or someone -- dies.

I personally don't think that this is just another case of political correctness at work but I'm curious how my teacher's philosophy resonates within RFf.
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Pardon my bluntness, but this is carrying political correctness to an absurd level. Frankly, I never even noticed the similarity until you mentioned it here. And as far as that goes, I think you would be much better off advocating that the gun industry remove photographic language from their terminology rather than vice versa. You probably didn't even give your kids toy guns for Christmas, did you, now? :rolleyes:

Well, gotta run. Must go shoot some more, uh, pictures? rabbits? whatever...

Regards,
Ira
 
gareth said:
Well I shoot, and frankly often my camera is my weapon.

I don't have a gun, and while I live in a country where hand guns are banned, nor is it easy to get a license for those guns that are not banned, it's the same country that will export any number of weapons to pretty much any country that desires them, for whatever use they wish to put them. I find that strange, I find it sad, it makes me angry.

Never mind chemical weapons, which incidentally been sold to certain countries by the country I live in, or for that matter nuclear weapons, nothing has done more harm to society than the gun, nothing has killed more, nothing will ever kill more.

No I don't blame the gun, the gun can be a handy tool in the right hands. I blame our governments, their obsession with control and imperialism, their greed, and perhaps most of the all the ****ing fools that elect them.

Political correctness? Sure it exists, but more than anything it exists as a propaganda tool of the right, very much a myth, used to try and destroy any kind of liberal view or free thinking.
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Sheesh, did someone pee in your Wheeties this morning? I never knew Scotland sold chemical weapons to anyone.

Were you supposed to stop the NAZIs in WWII with harsh (though PC) language?

The PC thing being a right wing conspiracy is a hoot. (Are you sure it isn't a vast right wing conspiracy?) Maybe it is different here in the States, but PC and Hate Speech codes were far more likely (or at least in the 80s & 90s) to be used to silence conservative view points. Maybe it is different over there.

Well, that enough time shooting the s**t with you guys for one day.
 
anselwannab said:
Sheesh, did someone pee in your Wheeties this morning? I never knew Scotland sold chemical weapons to anyone.

Were you supposed to stop the NAZIs in WWII with harsh (though PC) language?

The PC thing being a right wing conspiracy is a hoot. (Are you sure it isn't a vast right wing conspiracy?) Maybe it is different here in the States, but PC and Hate Speech codes were far more likely (or at least in the 80s & 90s) to be used to silence conservative view points. Maybe it is different over there.

Well, that enough time shooting the s**t with you guys for one day.
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He doesn't mean Scotland. The only chemical weapons the scots exported were tins of irn bru. He means the English! He is just being politically correct.
 
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