50/1.1 MS-Sonnetar: the next cult lens?

[uhoh7]

F2 is easy. Do you have any wide open ? Thanks.

Several of those will be at 1.1, I think the cat is WO. The blonde portrait I think also. I will shoot some in the next few days totally WO and you can see.

WO the lens is a real handful, and goes into "glowy" mode, much like the Canon 1.2 or even the 75 Lux. Color aberrations make sharpness assessments partly subjective. My understanding is that the optimal aperture is 1.6 But even a tad off 1.1 things really change. By 1.4 in the central frame the lens is pretty sharp, by any standard.

Really, what we have here is a modern 50/1.5 Sonnar with an extra ultra-fast mode, where the optical design is stretched well past the limit but can produce very interesting results simply impossible with anything else.

The sonnar design was eclipsed for reasons very evident in the landscape above: the edges basically never come in. All of my sonnars are like this. Even so the Sonnetar pulls that landscape off in an utterly unique way, because the designer has specially selected his glass for color rendition.

My samples are not highly modifiied, so the colors are sonnetar, and no other lens I own is anything like it. The result varies with light of course.


L1032674 by unoh7, on Flickr

L1032676 by unoh7, on Flickr

It's an art lens, pure and simple, with the invaluable feature of being very small and light, unlike any superspeed ever made to date for the 135 frame. I love to take it with me in the evenings.


L1032627 by unoh7, on Flickr


L1032706 by unoh7, on Flickr

Regarding some very nice peoples' fixation with "wide open": it is not by accident the lens has a special german aperture which makes perfects circles at every aperture. Comparisons to the zeiss, for example, should be at 1.5, since that lens really cannot compete at all at 1.1 😉

I bought the lens brand new for 1065USD I think. It is a total steal at that price, unless you are expecting a 200 gram .95 nocti.

 

[Huss]

Several of those will be at 1.1, I think the cat is WO. The blonde portrait I think also. I will shoot some in the next few days totally WO and you can see.

WO the lens is a real handful, and goes into "glowy" mode, much like the Canon 1.2 or even the 75 Lux. Color aberrations make sharpness assessments partly subjective. My understanding is that the optimal aperture is 1.6 But even a tad off 1.1 things really change. By 1.4 in the central frame the lens is pretty sharp, by any standard.

Really, what we have here is a modern 50/1.5 Sonnar with an extra ultra-fast mode, where the optical design is stretched well past the limit but can produce very interesting results simply impossible with anything else.

The sonnar design was eclipsed for reasons very evident in the landscape above: the edges basically never come in. All of my sonnars are like this. Even so the Sonnetar pulls that landscape off in an utterly unique way, because the designer has specially selected his glass for color rendition.

My samples are not highly modifiied, so the colors are sonnetar, and no other lens I own is anything like it. The result varies with light of course.

It's an art lens, pure and simple, with the invaluable feature of being very small and light, unlike any superspeed ever made to date for the 135 frame. I love to take it with me in the evenings.

Regarding some very nice peoples' fixation with "wide open": it is not by accident the lens has a special german aperture which makes perfects circles at every aperture. Comparisons to the zeiss, for example, should be at 1.5, since that lens really cannot compete at all at 1.1 😉

I bought the lens brand new for 1065USD I think. It is a total steal at that price, unless you are expecting a 200 gram .95 nocti.

Maybe this thread should have opened with these shots!
😉

 

[filmtwit]

Here's one at 1.1

 

[Pioneer]

I love this lens. I don't carry it all the time, but I could. I think it is actually that good.

Everybody seems to have this unhealthy fascination with sharp. I like sharp as much as anyone but it is not the be all, end all of photography. I really do believe that things like composition, location, environment and character mean more than sharp. And the photos that stick in everyone's minds are way beyond even these criteria. They just stick in your mind, even if they fail many of the rules.

Maybe, just maybe, learning your lens, your film and your camera are way more important than sharpness.

Maybe I will put that MS Optical Sonnetar on the front of my M3 and just use it for a year. I am pretty sure I have enough bulk TMX 100 or EK 522 XX lying around the house to pull if off.

 

[uhoh7]

OK these are for Ferider, since he asked nice 🙂 I grabbed the lens and set it to 1.1, but of course the M9 cannot go fast enough to shoot WO in daylight at 1.1, however I have a 3 stop ND filter, so I put that on there. Everything in the next few posts is WO on M9.


L1039724 by unoh7, on Flickr


L1039703 by unoh7, on Flickr


L1039697 by unoh7, on Flickr


L1039647 by unoh7, on Flickr

 

[uhoh7]

And some more:


L1039643 by unoh7, on Flickr

Above this seems to be the optimal distance WO.


L1039652 by unoh7, on Flickr


L1039656 by unoh7, on Flickr


L1039699 by unoh7, on Flickr

 

[uhoh7]

And just a few more so we can be really sure.......


L1039684 by unoh7, on Flickr


L1039711 by unoh7, on Flickr


L1039682 by unoh7, on Flickr

The famous coma adjuster, which just moves the rear element closer or further from the sensor, is a godsend for the M9. That's how you calibrate it. My hit rate today in these WO shots was close to 80%, which is phenomenal at 1.1 with a RF, I think.

Again, the lens is meant to work around 1.4 for the most part or more stopped down, and I rarely shoot it WO like this. What do you guys think?

 

[squirrel$$$bandit]

Are you kind of out of luck with the coma adjustment if you're shooting on film?

 

[Dante_Stella]

Are you kind of out of luck with the coma adjustment if you're shooting on film?

No, but it would be a lot harder to calibrate the lens without a groundglass and/or autocollimator. I suppose you could do it once on a digital and lock it in.

Dante

 

[Dante_Stella]

A couple of notes here:

1. "Glowy," in most cases that I've seen it with fast lenses, means "front-focused." Few of these fast 50mm lenses actually flare badly on point light sources.

2. The color rendition of the Sonnetar is different - probably the Tantalum glass acting like a rare-earth enhancing filter. Not sure how I feel about that as a permanent feature.

Dante

 

[uhoh7]

Really interesting, he must have had a hand in some of these:

http://sciencecenter.net/hutech/catalog/bborg.pdf

I never heard of Borg stuff before, but apparently highly regarded. The remarkable thing about the lens versions of these, is the fluorite glass and relative light weight.

Would love to hear Miyazaki-san on his experiences with these lenses.

As to the colors: unlike the CV 35/1.2 color signature, which I often struggle with, I very much enjoy the Sonnetar colors. Very rich and vivid. 🙂

 

[uhoh7]

Also, perhaps I should not use the term "glow", when what I am really referring to is CA, which both the 75 Lux and Sonnetar display shooting wide open, and other aberrations which happen with high speed lenses. These are not easy to correct for in design, which I believe is why the .95 nocti is such a large lens.


L1039713 by unoh7, on Flickr

Here we see a longer shot WO with the Sonnetar. If you go to the full on flickr you will see all sorts of interesting things going on, LOL

For example there is extreme coma in the row of cars past the truck and the intersection. Nevertheless quite small details are visible on the truck and other objects in the focal plane.

This would be a fun shot to test the coma adjuster, I will have to try that on the A7.mod, which shoots this lens very well, and of course does not need calibration.

Anyway, the point is you get alot of aberrations with any sonnar wide open, and even more with one that is capable of 1.1. So if you want to mellow these effects, stop down like a reasonable person 🙂

 

[raid]

It seems to me that using the Sonnetar requires some extra devotion and refined skills that owners of this lens may or may not be willing to invest. As long as users of this lens are happy with it, it is their option to enjoy it. I have not bought this lens.

 

[Pioneer]

+1 Raid. Mastering this lens requires you to make peace with the ergonomics and the adjustment of the lens. In return you can make some photographs with a unique signature.

However, there are many other wonderful lenses to be found in the Leica universe.

 

[uhoh7]

As far as I'm concerned, the man is a god. 🙂

Now that everyone can see the lens in many shots above "wide open", I'll try to give an idea what it can really do in "keeper" mode, between f/4 and f/1.4. These today on A7.mod (Kolari thin sensor cover)


DSC02054 by unoh7, on Flickr


DSC02037 by unoh7, on Flickr


DSC02023 by unoh7, on Flickr


DSC02069 by unoh7, on Flickr

@Jonmanjiro Love the shot, which I've seen often, and really appreciate the background info. Anyone who has seen "The Flight of the Phoenix" knows toy design is no joke. 🙂 How can we arrange a Q&A with this designer? Raid style email interview would just be fantastic.

 

[Chris Bail]

No, but it would be a lot harder to calibrate the lens without a groundglass and/or autocollimator. I suppose you could do it once on a digital and lock it in.

Dante

I did what you suggest here. Dialed the coma adjustment in on the M9, then used the same setting on film

Dialed it in at home...

Leica M9 - MS-Optical 50mm f1.1 by Chris Bail, on Flickr

and ended up shooting some digital and film at the same family event with the same coma setting the whole time.

On the M9

L1010401 by Chris Bail, on Flickr

M9 again

L1010413 by Chris Bail, on Flickr

And a couple on the MP

2014-26.Leica MP.MS-Optical Sonnetar 50mm f1.1.Kodak 400-2TMY.30 by Chris Bail, on Flickr


2014-26.Leica MP.MS-Optical Sonnetar 50mm f1.1.Kodak 400-2TMY.19 by Chris Bail, on Flickr

 

[uhoh7]

Fantastic, Chris 🙂 #2 my fav

 

[Chris Bail]

Fantastic, Chris 🙂 #2 my fav

Thanks! I like that one too.

 

[Chemophilic]

I did what you suggest here. Dialed the coma adjustment in on the M9, then used the same setting on film

Dialed it in at home...

Pardon my ignorance... I have been looking for some instructions on how to exactly dial in that Sonnetar setting but I am still lost. Would someone kindly guide me through on fine-tuning it on a digital body to be used on film? Thanks!

 

[Bille]

I haven´t seen anything "very, very sharp" so far. Looks like an ordinary super-fast SLR lens from about 1970.