LeicaFan
Well-known
Guys, I've been thinking about giving up my D3 for an M3.
Don't get me wrong, the D3 is an excellent camera, but I feel like it is more of a tool for somebody who photographs for a living, not a passion. I've gone through a few DSLRs and while I think that they're great, I've never really been happy with them.
I've known about Leica for some time now, but only recently (maybe about a year) did I discover what a Leica really is. I enjoy street photography and I think that a Leica would be the perfect tool for my desires. I enjoy the 50mm focal length so I believe that a M3 would be perfect for me.
I know that by giving up a DSLR for a film rangefinder, I will be losing a lot of features, but I think that those features (e.g., autofocus, metering, etc...) are features that take away from the photography experience.
I do think that I would still want a digital camera for certain conditions. Ideally, I would like an M3 and an M8, but I don't want to spend that much. If I sell my D3 and prime lens, I can allow myself $1400 for an M3 (looking for an SS and then with the money left over, I can have it CLA'd, top and bottom plates refinished, and have the vulcanite replaced with some sort of leather.... in other words, a "new" M3), $1000 for a 50/2 Cron (hoping for the current version... basing my price on what antiquecameras.net says), and with whats left over, I can buy an E-P2 and adapter for the M lenses.
Worst case scenario, I decide that the M3 is not for me and I sell everything and buy another DSLR. I do know that as soon as the D3 successor comes out, the price of the D3 will drop significantly. If I decide to go back to a D3, I would probably be able to buy one for much less than what I sell mine for. From what I've seen, Leica prices (for the older film models) are pretty much set (increasing, even?).
I just wanted to put my thoughts into words and hopefully get some feedback from your guys. Have any of you made a similar switch? Do you regret it?
Don't get me wrong, the D3 is an excellent camera, but I feel like it is more of a tool for somebody who photographs for a living, not a passion. I've gone through a few DSLRs and while I think that they're great, I've never really been happy with them.
I've known about Leica for some time now, but only recently (maybe about a year) did I discover what a Leica really is. I enjoy street photography and I think that a Leica would be the perfect tool for my desires. I enjoy the 50mm focal length so I believe that a M3 would be perfect for me.
I know that by giving up a DSLR for a film rangefinder, I will be losing a lot of features, but I think that those features (e.g., autofocus, metering, etc...) are features that take away from the photography experience.
I do think that I would still want a digital camera for certain conditions. Ideally, I would like an M3 and an M8, but I don't want to spend that much. If I sell my D3 and prime lens, I can allow myself $1400 for an M3 (looking for an SS and then with the money left over, I can have it CLA'd, top and bottom plates refinished, and have the vulcanite replaced with some sort of leather.... in other words, a "new" M3), $1000 for a 50/2 Cron (hoping for the current version... basing my price on what antiquecameras.net says), and with whats left over, I can buy an E-P2 and adapter for the M lenses.
Worst case scenario, I decide that the M3 is not for me and I sell everything and buy another DSLR. I do know that as soon as the D3 successor comes out, the price of the D3 will drop significantly. If I decide to go back to a D3, I would probably be able to buy one for much less than what I sell mine for. From what I've seen, Leica prices (for the older film models) are pretty much set (increasing, even?).
I just wanted to put my thoughts into words and hopefully get some feedback from your guys. Have any of you made a similar switch? Do you regret it?
LeicaFan
Well-known
Thanks for your opinion.
I'm not opposed to buying an older Summicron (I believe that the current model shares the same optics with some of the previous models, correct?), but there might be a problem in locating an older Summicron that is in well-kept condition.
Stuart John
Well-known
Nope not crazy but you may not like a rangefinder though. As much as I like the idea of rangefinders I actually prefer my FM2 and 35mm 2.5 E. I got as for as the camera store a couple of years ago with both my DSLRs and my Nikon lenses ready to trade in for an M6 but just could not quite do it.
I am still tempted about every couple of months to sell my Nikon gear and get a Leica but still have not done it. I started looking a Leicas in 1998 and still have not taken the plunge. I've have a couple of Canonets which I've had since 1998 and have put plenty of rolls through them but still can't decide if a rangefinder is for me.
I may look again in the new year though as the band I have been playing in for the last 2 years has split up so I have a bit more time for photography.
I want to shoot much more film and make the most of it while it is still around. There is plenty of time to shoot digital but film may be much harder to come by in another ten years.
I am still tempted about every couple of months to sell my Nikon gear and get a Leica but still have not done it. I started looking a Leicas in 1998 and still have not taken the plunge. I've have a couple of Canonets which I've had since 1998 and have put plenty of rolls through them but still can't decide if a rangefinder is for me.
I may look again in the new year though as the band I have been playing in for the last 2 years has split up so I have a bit more time for photography.
I want to shoot much more film and make the most of it while it is still around. There is plenty of time to shoot digital but film may be much harder to come by in another ten years.
LeicaFan
Well-known
Stuart, I already have a rangefinder (see sig). I like them! 
Stuart John
Well-known
Thats good, I've had my Canonets for years but I'm still not sure. I guess one day I am going to have to buy a Leica M to see how it suits me long term.
archeophoto
I love 1950's quality
You didn't tell us what type of photographs you take/want to take. Or why you don't like the D3. Is it too big maybe? You also didn't tell us what lenses you use on your D3. Some of them turn the D3 into a real awkward monster.
I for myself would never give up my D700 for any 35mm camera. The low ISO performance and flexibility of the D700/D3 can not be replicated with any 35mm setup. I would miss that greatly.
I know what you mean by being passionate about 35mm film cameras though. I enjoy shooting with my IIIf more then I do with the D700. But the flexibility of the D700 is just unmatched.
I for myself would never give up my D700 for any 35mm camera. The low ISO performance and flexibility of the D700/D3 can not be replicated with any 35mm setup. I would miss that greatly.
I know what you mean by being passionate about 35mm film cameras though. I enjoy shooting with my IIIf more then I do with the D700. But the flexibility of the D700 is just unmatched.
LeicaFan
Well-known
I like the D3 and it is an excellent camera, but I think that I am just not happy with DSLRs in general. Like I said before, I feel like it is more of a tool for somebody who does photography for a living, not a passion. As cliché as it may sound, I want to connect with the subject, not just point and shoot.
I am a prime lens kind of guy, so I am using the 50mm 1.4G. It's fairly small so the D3 doesn't look ridiculously large. I know that I would be losing out on a lot of things, but I think that the e-p2 might make up for that (well, not in terms of ISO performance). Even so, a lot of the things that I would be losing out on are things that take away from the experience.
And I enjoy street photography/cityscape. Here are some of my pictures (none of these were taken with the D3, btw lol):
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dave lackey
Veteran
No, you are not crazy as you have thought this out pretty well. Look at it this way, in a year or two, what will have replaced the obsolete D3? The M3 is not going anywhere and it certainly will not be obsolete, so why not give it a go?
Life is too short, experience the Leica-ness!
Life is too short, experience the Leica-ness!
archeophoto
I love 1950's quality
I see where you are coming from and the D3 wouldn't be my ideal street shooter either. I use a Leica IIIf or a Rolleiflex for that.
But I don't get your comment about the "experience". While I like using my old mechanical cameras more (feel, quality, film development etc.), the D700 doesn't take any experience away from me. On the contrary, I get shots from it I just would not get with the vintage mechanical gear. It just adds to the experience, it doesn't take anything away.
But I don't get your comment about the "experience". While I like using my old mechanical cameras more (feel, quality, film development etc.), the D700 doesn't take any experience away from me. On the contrary, I get shots from it I just would not get with the vintage mechanical gear. It just adds to the experience, it doesn't take anything away.
LeicaFan
Well-known
Well let me put it this way, digital and mechanical offer two different experiences. Right now, I feel as if the mechanical experience will bring me the pleasure that digital has not provided.
atlcruiser
Part Yeti
seems like a good idea to me
I would suggesst a M6 ..the meter is great and really speeds up street shooting
I would suggesst a M6 ..the meter is great and really speeds up street shooting
LeicaFan
Well-known
David,
I've looked into the M6, but if I got one, it would have to be a TTL because I would want the .85x finder and it would have to be in chrome (don't like the black bodies). Most likely, that would put me over my budget.
I've looked into the M6, but if I got one, it would have to be a TTL because I would want the .85x finder and it would have to be in chrome (don't like the black bodies). Most likely, that would put me over my budget.
shadowfox
Darkroom printing lives
Wes,
Consider that at some point you may have a shift in your focal-length preference.
If you spend your budget on a decked-out M3, then you realize that you'd prefer 35mm or wider lenses, you're out quite a bit and probably won't be able to recover it.
An M4 may be a more flexible choice in my mind.
Consider that at some point you may have a shift in your focal-length preference.
If you spend your budget on a decked-out M3, then you realize that you'd prefer 35mm or wider lenses, you're out quite a bit and probably won't be able to recover it.
An M4 may be a more flexible choice in my mind.
dave lackey
Veteran
italy74
Well-known
Wes
I honestly think you might have to evaluate something else; what you're proposing to do is like a base jump from 1000 m having only the flying squirrel suit on...
You said you feel mechanical would provide you more pleasure to shoot. Try to realize "why" the M3 and not another rf or slr camera. Has it to do (unconsciously) with fetishism that some have for Leica branded cameras? Or does it truly answer to a need (or supposed one) you have?
On one hand I understand the urge you have, on the other I have to warn you that it might be a very painful move (especially if you don't have a accordion-like walet)
I honestly think you might have to evaluate something else; what you're proposing to do is like a base jump from 1000 m having only the flying squirrel suit on...
You said you feel mechanical would provide you more pleasure to shoot. Try to realize "why" the M3 and not another rf or slr camera. Has it to do (unconsciously) with fetishism that some have for Leica branded cameras? Or does it truly answer to a need (or supposed one) you have?
On one hand I understand the urge you have, on the other I have to warn you that it might be a very painful move (especially if you don't have a accordion-like walet)
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JoeV
Thin Air, Bright Sun
Of course, if you choose a film camera, you are also choosing a film "work flow". Meaning that you are limited to whatever film stock will be available in the future. And there's the processing and scanning and/or optical printing side of working with film cameras. You're not just changing cameras, but the entire what-happens-after-I-press-the-shutter process.
That said, I would like to ask the OP if he has seriously tried "street" photography with his current DSLR? The reason I ask this is because, if street is really your passion, you could be found satisfied to pursue it with whatever tools you have available, regardless of them being a rangefinder or a DSLR. In fact, I've found some of the newer cameras like micro four thirds are also pretty good for street.
The crux of my question gets down to your motivations; are you really passionate about street photography, or are you in fact passionate about the idea of owning a Leica rangefinder? Because those are two entirely different questions, the answers to which will lead you in two entirely different directions.
~Joe
That said, I would like to ask the OP if he has seriously tried "street" photography with his current DSLR? The reason I ask this is because, if street is really your passion, you could be found satisfied to pursue it with whatever tools you have available, regardless of them being a rangefinder or a DSLR. In fact, I've found some of the newer cameras like micro four thirds are also pretty good for street.
The crux of my question gets down to your motivations; are you really passionate about street photography, or are you in fact passionate about the idea of owning a Leica rangefinder? Because those are two entirely different questions, the answers to which will lead you in two entirely different directions.
~Joe
LeicaFan
Well-known
I'm fairly set on the 50mm focal length. I've always felt comfortable with it, but you're right. 35mm would be nice so I need to keep your suggestion in mind.
With the M3, don't I need to add goggles in order to use 35mm?
I enjoy rangefinders and SLR cameras. I'm fine with either as my primary. If I'm going to make the switch from digital to film and give up my D3, you better believe that I'm going to buy a Leica. And me choosing the M3 is based on a couple of things. 1) It is the best for the 50mm focal length and 2) I enjoy the simplicity of it. I supposed that an MP with an .85x finder would be a good choice as well, but those are still pretty expensive.
So I'm left with the M3 and the M6 TTL .85x. I'm not opposed to the M6 (if the price was right), but I not sure how reliable the M6 is.
dave lackey
Veteran
Jeez, Wes, life is too short, if you want a Leica, an M3 or other model, go for it. There is nothing special about the cost of an M3 and it is certainly something you will regret if you really would like to try one and do not follow through. The re-sale down the road will cost you nothing as the value of my own M3 has risen in the last two years. I thoroughly enjoyed my Nikon S3 2000, but am enjoying the M3 even more. The Leica experience was something I had to do and I made the right decision with the M3.
That said, the M6 is very reliable as are all Leica cameras. Just decide if you want to use a separate meter or a camera with one built-in. And, the M3 works better with goggles for the 35mm lens but they look cool!
And, yes, shooting with film is different but the workflow is no big deal. Many options there. One thing about going with film is the experience of a lifetime will be more difficult 10 years down the road. So, why not now?
Good luck,
LeicaFan
Well-known
Joe,
I'll admit, I love the idea of owning a Leica, but also, street photography IS what I enjoy.
Jeez, Wes, life is too short, if you want a Leica, an M3 or other model, go for it. There is nothing special about the cost of an M3 and it is certainly something you will regret if you really would like to try one and do not follow through. The re-sale down the road will cost you nothing as the value of my own M3 has risen in the last two years. I thoroughly enjoyed my Nikon S3 2000, but am enjoying the M3 even more. The Leica experience was something I had to do and I made the right decision with the M3.
That said, the M6 is very reliable as are all Leica cameras. Just decide if you want to use a separate meter or a camera with one built-in. And, the M3 works better with goggles for the 35mm lens but they look cool!
And, yes, shooting with film is different but the workflow is no big deal. Many options there. One thing about going with film is the experience of a lifetime will be more difficult 10 years down the road. So, why not now?
Good luck,
Dave,
Thanks. You're right. Life is too short. I think I'm going to go for it.
Selling the D3 won't be a problem. The problem will be locating the camera that I choose. I've been looking around and haven't seen too many M3 SS's on the market. Last night, I looked for M6 TTL's and didn't come up with too much, either. I guess good things come to those who wait, right?
italy74
Well-known
Wes
I have no idea if they sell abroad, nor if it's convenient for you given the unfavourable euro / dollar exchange rate, however one of the places where I'd look here is this:
http://www.newoldcamera.com/Catalogo.aspx?Marca=LEICA-M&Tipo=CO
I know it's all in Italian but they have plenty of M3's bodies and being placed in they are probably one of the two most reputable shops here in Italy for second hand camera market.
I have no idea if they sell abroad, nor if it's convenient for you given the unfavourable euro / dollar exchange rate, however one of the places where I'd look here is this:
http://www.newoldcamera.com/Catalogo.aspx?Marca=LEICA-M&Tipo=CO
I know it's all in Italian but they have plenty of M3's bodies and being placed in they are probably one of the two most reputable shops here in Italy for second hand camera market.