An RF newbie taegrtting Bronica RF645 (or Mamiya 6/7 ?)

[alexz]

Hello all, just get registered here in RF community.
I'm an avid photo amateur, having shooting with 35mm for last 9 years using a pro Canon SLR system (film, of course) and two ears ago made my foray into large format (through short experience with 6x6 medium format by TLR). Really enjoying my 4x5, but figured my Canon gear gets almost no use last 2 years and the thought of lugging around a heafty and bulky Canon doesn't sound appealing any more (so that is on of the main reasons it is getting bored in the closet).
I made up my mind to sell off the entire 35mm system and acquire a light/manageable and confortable MF system, i.e. a rangefinder to serve as a backup to my LF passion and for all-around shooting.
My choices are either Bronica RF645 or Mamiya 6 (or probably 7 ?). I know about format differences and 6x4.5 will suit me without problem, who Mamiya still sounds tempting. So far I'm leaning towards Bronica which gets excellent reviews in almost any respects, though what bothers me is the lack of more or less long lenses. I understand in practice, the longest available is 100mm (which translates into something like 60mm in 35mm format, am I wrong ?). For general shooting I guess it is well enough, though an availability of something close to 90-100mm in 35mm format meaning would be nice... Well, not a deal breaker I guess but anyway...
The high praises for Mamiya's RF optics can be heard from nearly every corner on the internet, however there are opinions it is quite harsh (in terms of out of focus, bokeh), whilst Bronica's lenses are more pleasing in this respect while offering also very high optical quality. Am I misleaded ?

How do you, RF645 shooters find the lack of longer then 10mmm limiting in actual use ? I mean all-around shooting such as trips, vacations, some family portraiture, etc...
I have never used a rangefinder so far (though played with some old Russian RF 35mm camera many years back), how its viewfinder compares to, say, a finder of EOS-3/1V ? In terms of size, field of view and brightness...

Chances as soon as my Canon system will begin to sell off I'll be open for RF645 offers (unless I'll be convinced to go Mamiya route till then...;-) )...

I'm learning an affordable flatbad scanners are getting better for film scanning (MF and LF in particular) such as Epson's V700 which is a saver for me...(used to scan my 35mm work routinely in the past with my Nikon IV ED).

Thanks in advance, Alex

 

[physiognomy]

Welcome to RFF Alex... I'm sorry I can't help you with mf rf's, but I'm sure there are plenty of others out there who will be able to give you some advice.

Peter

 

[woodphoto]

What kind of Canon gear do you have?......I love my Broni, I shoot with mainly the 65mm and use the 45mm on occaision, don't own the 100mm. I tend to get up close and personal with my subjects so I don't mind not having a tele lens.

The broni is easy to use, has superb optics, and a all around great camera (if you can find one, B&H used dept has one for 999.99, I was thinking a second body, but decided not to.) the only shor tfall is the lenses are not that fast, F4 is as wide as they go, so I tend to use a lot of 400iso film. The viewfinder is bright and easy. I use my camera on AP, only to make it easier for me since I know action stuff is out of the question.
Here' a coupl web sites that helped me decide.....

http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/cameras/rf645.shtml
http://www.photo.net/equipment/bronica/rf645
http://photo.net/mjohnston/column3/



I to have Canon gear and it is a chore to carry them around, so I don't use them for to much other than my photojournalism/sports stuff.
As for mamiya, I have'nt used one but based on price..I got the body and the 65mm lens (broni kit) for a grand, where as the mamyias' body alone are around 1200.00-1500.00
Hope I helped a little....

 

[JeffGreene]

Welcome to RFF! Just thought I would put in a word for the Mamiya 6. Have one and love it. All lenses are tack sharp, and the collapsible lens is a definite plus. I have all three lenses, but find myself using the 50 virtually all the time. The Bronica is a great camera. If you are interested in a great price for a 6 I can put you on to
a dealer with better pricing than you mentioned. PM me.

 

[sf]

I shoot with the RF645 exclusively in film (and a little digicam for snapshots). I'll refrain from being verbose, and instead get down to the nitty gritty:

1. I've never wanted for a longer lens than the 100mm.
2. I've never wanted for a wider lens than the 45mm.
3. The RF645 is the nicest piece of gear I have owned. I LOVE my camera. Maybe I need a GF, but I think I actually love my camera. And that 100mm...yummy.

If you haven't already, go here (think I already posted this in your universe...): http://www.shutterflower.com/RF645 review.htm

buy the Bronica. It's just the better camera. IMHO.

 

[alexz]

What kind of Canon gear do you have?.....

Thanks guys, appreciate your help.
Michael, I own Canon EOS-3 with booster, 28-70/2.8L, 70-200/2.8L, 550EX and accessories.

Frankly, I'm also tempted to go 35mm rangefinder route with Contax bearing the fact that my entire 35mm path (Nikon 35mm scanner) and excellent 28/50/90mm Contax lenses, but still yet MF is tempting...

BTW, any experience scanning MF (6x4.5 and 6x6) on home flatbeds ?

Alex

 

[sf]

Thanks guys, appreciate your help.
Michael, I own Canon EOS-3 with booster, 28-70/2.8L, 70-200/2.8L, 550EX and accessories.

Frankly, I'm also tempted to go 35mm rangefinder route with Contax bearing the fact that my entire 35mm path (Nikon 35mm scanner) and excellent 28/50/90mm Contax lenses, but still yet MF is tempting...

BTW, any experience scanning MF (6x4.5 and 6x6) on home flatbeds ?

Alex

Buy the Epson 3170. I had one before I bought the V700 and it is actually totally decent. The V700 is a serious step up, but the 3170 is less than 1/7 the price, now. Buy one for nothing on Amazon.com. If you shoot mostly C41 and B&W, you'll be fine. And some day, you'll be glad some of your shots are MF. More detail, better tones, faster films (less grain=go to a higher ISO easier), bigger prints.

 

[alexz]

Thanks.
In fact I shoot transparancies about 90%, the rest is color negs (C41) for dedictaed people stuff/portraiture. Will it handle it ? Or V700 is the way to go nevertheless ?

 

[sf]

Thanks.
In fact I shoot transparancies about 90%, the rest is color negs (C41) for dedictaed people stuff/portraiture. Will it handle it ? Or V700 is the way to go nevertheless ?

The 3170 does a decent job of things, but doesn't have nearly the dynamic range that the V700 does. You might even go the 4180 or 4780 route...though you might as well buy the V700. The V700 is also reviewed on my site.

For web-publishing, the 3170 is fine, though a little soft on E6. For web publishing, the V700 is very very overkill.

 

[Simon Larbalestier]

Welcome to RFF Alex

This site is a small goldmine of information

I'd agree with Jeff, the Mamiya 6, is indeed a fine camera and more portable than the later 7 series as it's lenses are designed to collapse into the body.

Re the V700/750 i found two interesting user reviews that tackle the issue of sharpness and make for an interesting read.
one is here:

http://www.photographyri.com/index.php?title=stumbling_with_developer_and_maximizing&more=1&c=1&tb=1&pb=1

the other one compares the V700/750 with the Nikon 5000 ED:

http://www.webweavertech.com/ovidiu/weblog/archives/000448.html

quite an eyeopener and i use both scanners but in two different countries so i can never do a side by side comparison but on recent scaning sessions i do think that the Nikon is much better for 35mm film with a greater D-Max.

You can also get 3rd party flatbed film holders made by Doug Fisher who is also a RFF member these have adjustable feet and additional glass to maxmise film flatness.

his site is www.betterscanning.com.

 

[woodphoto]

[
BTW, any experience scanning MF (6x4.5 and 6x6) on home flatbeds ?

Alex[/QUOTE]


Sorry, just 35mm negs. Actually I rarely put negs to dig. I perfer to print them or get them printed. I don't mind looking at them on a contact and choosing.

 

[Benjamin Marks]

Have you considered the Fuji MF-rangefinders? Non-interchangeable lenses, but great glass and quite light. Just a thought to muddy the waters.

RF in 135 is great for available light. RF in medium format has slower lenses in general. You might want to consider that as well.

Good luck in your choice.

Ben Marks

 

[Abbazz]

Have you considered the Fuji MF-rangefinders? Non-interchangeable lenses, but great glass and quite light. Just a thought to muddy the waters.

To muddy the waters even further 🙄, there are the old G690 rangefinder series, which do have a full range of 7 interchangeable lenses (link).

Cheers,

Abbazz

 

[bellyface]

I thought of getting a mamiya 7 at one point, probably cause of the 35mm pano adapter, but decided on the broni instead, in 2002, I bought the broni kit for $1300, later sold it that year and got a pentax 67II... I regretted losing that broni... well I got it back, but at half the price I paid in 02', so lately, thanks to digital, they can be had at bargains. I do have a 135mm viewfinder though... looks like those are even more rare than the 100mm... these cameras are at bargain prices, and they truly are awesome ergonomically.

 

[dazedgonebye]

To muddy the waters even further 🙄, there are the old G690 rangefinder series, which do have a full range of 7 interchangeable lenses (link).

Cheers,

Abbazz

Ok, I'll take a G690 with the 50, 100 and 180. Man, with that 180 attached, what a beast of a set up!