Canon IV questions

[rbiemer]

Folks,
I've been offered a Canon(from what I've been able to research) IV for what is either a cheap or an insanely cheap price depending on which IV it is. I think it's an SB based on the serial # and slow speed dial. The camera looks OK but is pretty dirty. And comes with an 85 Seerenar as well as some Canon 50mm lens. The 85mm is what got me interested, actually. The camera is a nice bonus.
My questions:
--How much should a typical CLA cost?
I've seen/read DAG as a repair option. How was their service/price/turn around time?
--Who else should I consider for this Canon?
--The bezel around the RF window seems to be gone--is that a problem in itself or something I can replace when/if I find the part?
--The Canons before the V are bottom loaders?
--This has the red diamond with EP marking, does that mean anything more than where the camera was sold?
--Any particular "gotchas" about these cameras?
Thanks, all my friendly enablers 😀
Rob

 

[Kim Coxon]

Can't help with the service info but the bezel from a Fed 2 will fit if you can't find a Canon one. The EP was "Exchange Post" ie it was bought in a military exchange. Yes they are bottom loaders.

Kim

 

[srtiwari]

Interesting seeing your note. I am somewhat new to Canon Rangefinders, tho' am used to the Leicas. Recently bought a Canon IVsb and just love it. If you want to use a Screw mount body, the Canons (IMHO) are better than the Leicas. My camera had a couple of problems- punctured curtain, "stuck" shutter speeds etc. DAG repaired it for $220, and returned it very promptly (about 10 days). I am very happy with it and would recommend them. My body also says EP, but has the usual speeds (1/30, 1/15 etc.).
Believe the View finder system helps focus better (than the Leicas) and one can get away without extra Viewfinders if you plan to use the 50 and 85 or longer lenses...
Of course, the loading is not as straightforward as an SLR, but you probably already know that.
Subhash
Subhash

 

[rover]

The Canon cameras are very well made, every bit as well made as Leicas of the day. The VF of the Canon IVSB and Leica IIIc or f are "squinty, the openings are kinda small. The Canon VF has an adjustible magnification so that the built in VF can be used for 50, 100 and 135mm lenses without external finders. The extra mag also helps with critical focusing. wlewisiii had his IVSB serviced by DAG, quickly and for a fair price I believe he will tell you. The Bezel just unscrews, yes the get lost.

 

[back alley]

cla should run between 160 and 200.
great cameras, often said to be better than the leica bottom feeders.
that 85 is a hell of a lens, weighs a ton but plenty sharp--i miss mine.

 

[rbiemer]

I have been interested in the various Canon screw mount cameras for a while but they are/were mostly out of my price range so the lust was idealized. And as much as the Leica screw mount cameras are wonderful, the seperate RF/VF windows on those are (for me) a deal breaker.
Plus, I figure if I don't enjoy using it, I might be able to find somebody, somewhere to take it off my hands and not be out much(if any)$. 😀
Starting from FSU cameras--which I am mostly very happy with--I can't imagine this will be a major disappointment. With the possible exception of the VF.
I did just get a Retina 1a which has a seriously tiny VF but that's OK in that camera since I'm not trying to focus with it. Cleaning it was a bit of a pain, though.
I've been using, almost exclusively, the Bessa R for a while and I am starting to miss the "classic" feel of brass&chrome gear. My Zorki is off at the "health spa" and I am starting to get anxious to have it back...my Kievs are wonderful but not the same. And I have more choice in LTM lenses.
Rob

 

[rbiemer]

cla should run between 160 and 200.
great cameras, often said to be better than the leica bottom feeders.
that 85 is a hell of a lens, weighs a ton but plenty sharp--i miss mine.

joe,
the 85 started all this. I found an ad for it and inquired. The person selling it responded nicely and mentioned "Oh, by the way, I also have the camera this lens fits..."
I'm looking forward to this one.
Rob

 

[dexdog]

Several RFFers have recommended Mark Hama for CLAs on old Canons. I think his web site is markhama.com, but I am sure a Google search on his name will turn it up. I have used DAG for a couple of Canon LTMs, and have been pleased with the results

dexdog

 

[wlewisiii]

I had a IVSb repaired by DAG. Price was very good and turnaround for me was less than a week.

William

 

[Kim Coxon]

You will not be dissappointed with the RF in the Canons. I went from the FSU cameras to the VI-L which has a similiar rotating varable mag finder and it is sooo much better than the FSU ones. I far prefer it to the other later Canonc such as the P and 7 and it's even with the Leica M's.

Kim

I have been interested in the various Canon screw mount cameras for a while but they are/were mostly out of my price range so the lust was idealized. And as much as the Leica screw mount cameras are wonderful, the seperate RF/VF windows on those are (for me) a deal breaker.
Plus, I figure if I don't enjoy using it, I might be able to find somebody, somewhere to take it off my hands and not be out much(if any)$. 😀
Starting from FSU cameras--which I am mostly very happy with--I can't imagine this will be a major disappointment. With the possible exception of the VF.
Rob

 

[John Shriver]

The RF bezel ring easily counts as the "most often missing part" on Canon RF cameras. (Probably infinity locks on lenses come up second.) I've never had to find one, but I suspect that the usual sources (DAG and Sherry) ran out years ago.

 

[CanonRFinder]

My body also says EP, but has the usual speeds (1/30, 1/15 etc.).

Hi I see you mention "1/30" as the slow speed. The camera in fact is a IVSB2 that is if it has a top speed of 1000. This one is one of the four bottom loading model Canon put out with slow speeds at "1/30". Probably the best of the four because of the top 1000 shutter speed, all the others only went to 500. Peter K

 

[rbiemer]

Hi I see you mention "1/30" as the slow speed. The camera in fact is a IVSB2 that is if it has a top speed of 1000.
Peter K

Peter,
I didn't mention the specific speeds, actually. But the slow speed dial tops out at 1/25. The camera does go to 1/1000.
I have finalized the deal and am now getting antsy to see the camera and lenses!
I thought I had a two body kit figured out(and a bag to carry it in); now I get the fun of rethinking that set up.
Rob

 

[wlewisiii]

Peter,
I didn't mention the specific speeds, actually. But the slow speed dial tops out at 1/25. The camera does go to 1/1000.
I have finalized the deal and am now getting antsy to see the camera and lenses!
I thought I had a two body kit figured out(and a bag to carry it in); now I get the fun of rethinking that set up.
Rob

Yep, that's a IVSb. Quite possibly the finest bottom feeder made by anyone. I've used a IIIf, for example, but the IVSb blows it away. Good luck with your purchase. That is a really fine camera. And yes, it make you rethink many things. I was very happy with my Kiev 5 until I got a Canon IVSb and realized just how good the Canons really were...

I, personally, did end up with a 7. But I can tell you that if I hadn't, that IVSb would be my go to camera. It's just that nice...

William

 

[rbiemer]

Got an email from the seller this afternoon, the Canon is on it's way!! Should be in my hands Monday or Tuesday...I'm psyched about this beastie! And, since the deal is done, some details: I found a classified ad that offered the 85mm/f2 lens(with"rangefinder") for $20. No picture but the ad said "email if interested or you'd like to see pictures" So I did. The lens looks OK, so I decide to go for it. I correspond back and forth a few times and am getting a good feling about the seller. She casually mentions that she "also has the camera this lens fits. And for sentimental reasons wants to keep them together." So being the helpful, sensitive guy I am 🙄 I want to accomodate her desires. My total? $120 plus shipping. 😀 😀
Rob

 

[Wayne R. Scott]

. My total? $120 plus shipping. 😀 😀
Rob

Rob,

I think you are supposed to post a HU on deals like this, BEFORE you buy it. 🙂

Nice going!

Wayne

 

[gordonb]

Rob,

DAG's Parts Listings for Canons are here

 

[rbiemer]

HU The new toy is here!!

HU The new toy is here!!

Well, the bad news first:
:bang: I think I have just ruined myself for FSU cameras. :bang:
The good news:
Oh man is this example nice! Much better than the photo showed!
Haven't put film in it yet but will soon.
This is the first knob wind camera I've owned that is actually easy to wind on. 🙂
The leather is in decent shape. The finish has some brassing but nothing horrible. There is a take up spool. Not, appaently, a spring-loaded one as mentioned in the manual(s) I've downloaded.
The shutter looks OK but I'll know better after I get some film in the camera.
The 50mm lens is a 50mm/f1.8 so that is now my fastest 50. Tiny bit of oil on the aperture blades. No major scratches/marks on the glass.
The 85/f2 is in similar condition and came with a Canon case and finder.
I note that the slow speeds are sticky: The shutter doesn't close 'til I release pressure on the shutter release. I'll see if this improves as I use the camera.
Over-all this stuff is dusty but not abused. I guess that it sat in a drawer/closet after the sellers dad stopped using it.
And, to top off my wonderful day, it is actually sunny and warm!! And I have a couple of hours 'til sunset!
Hopefully it'll take me less time than that to load this camera for the first time.
I don't use the strap that came with my Bessa--so for now that one is going on this camera.
Color me giddy!
And thank you to all you helpful folks!
This camera will definetly benefit from a CLA but I know that I'll hate giving it up for any length of time...right now the plan is one roll of film through it(you know, so I can describe any problems to the service folks 🙄 ) and then off to re-hab.
😀 Rob 😀

 

[wlewisiii]

Well, the bad news first:
:bang: I think I have just ruined myself for FSU cameras. :bang:

Yep, they will do that. The Canon IVSb I had fall into my lap awhile back utterly spoiled me on FSU cameras as well. Fortunately for my wallet the lenses are still as good as ever... 😀

They are nice - I love the way the knobs feel when wound on too. Sounds like you got a really nice example. Good luck with it!

William

 

[rbiemer]

Well,
I got the first roll of film back yesterday and as I thought, the slow speeds are off but the high speeds seem to be OK(close enough for color print film anyway).
This camera is definitely heading off to get a CLA. It's so nice now I can hardly imagine what it'll be like after!
Here's 2 shots--1 from the 50/1.8 and 1 from the 85/2.
Rob