Considering my first Leica M body (film)

[kxl]

My first post in a while, so please be kind and patient with another "what would you buy" question. I know we all have different likes/dislikes and this choice is ultimately up to me. But I would like to get input from those who are far more experienced with Leica film bodies.

When I shoot film, my primary body is a Zeiss ZI, with a Pentax SLR a back up. But I would like type get an M body, and currently considering:

• M6 2022 Re-issue - newer with modern parts, so repair and parts availability are less of a concern. This is obviously a more expensive option.
• M6 Classic - circuit board availability is a bit of a concern (may not be a "huge" concern(?) but sh&t does happen).
• M4-P - if an M6 circuit board fails, isn't this essentially what I have? I don't mind metering with my Gossen Luna Pro. This option is the least expensive.

 

[Phil_F_NM]

M4-P all the way, especially if you don't mind the handheld meter. You could always stick an MR-4 on there as well. Use the money you save on film.
Phil

 

[38Deardorff]

K, is there a reason you've selected these 3 in particular? Personally i don't like the cluttered finder of the M4-P to M6 /MP.
If you choose the meterless route....
What you find a deal on may vary.... The M4-2 (still with steel gears).... has 35-135 framelines
I'd look at both the M2 & M4 (older, brass gears).

 

[kxl]

K, is there a reason you've selected these 3 in particular? Personally i don't like the cluttered finder of the M4-P to M6 /MP.
If you choose the meterless route....
What you find a deal on may vary.... The M4-2 (still with steel gears).... has 35-135 framelines
I'd look at both the M2 & M4 (older, brass gears).

I think the M6 is just beautiful--so the pure aesthetic (yeah, I know...) of the 2022 M6 is my baseline, then I just went from there. I typically go out with a 2-lens combo: 28/50 or 35/75, so the need for 28mm framelines was a factor. I should add that yes, the MP is also an option.

 

[38Deardorff]

I think the M6 is just beautiful--so the pure aesthetic (yeah, I know...) of the 2022 M6 is my baseline, then I just went from there. I typically go out with a 2-lens combo: 28/50 or 35/75, so the need for 28mm framelines was a factor.

I'm happy with auxiliary finders.... so that makes a difference. The build quality of the earlier /later cameras is worth considering.
The earlier cameras top plates are brass..... the M4-2 /P/ old M6..... are plated zinc. Of the newer cameras the new M6 & MP (had one of those too) have the 28 framelines....and a brass top plate.

 

[Benjamin Marks]

I hear ya. I was right where you are in the summer of 1994. Had wanted an M6 since the 1980's. I started out with what I could afford: an M3 DS, then an M3 SS. Then an M4-P, and then finally a used M6 (what they now call a Panda). I still have all these cameras, LOL, as I have been better at acquiring these things than selling them off over the years.

In terms of the experience of using the camera, it is going to be very similar. I like an in-camera meter for the way I work, although the Gossen Luna-Pro is a great meter and I used one of those with the meterless M's before I got the M6.

I guess if presented with these options and I had no M camera at all, I'd go for the camera that had been most recently serviced. Ask to see receipts.

On my M's, except for dropping the M6 on the marble floor of Union Station back in '97 (sob! -- dented, but fixed) the only issues I have had were with the M6's metering circuit board going bad in 2003 or so. Parts were still available then, so I got it fixed up.

The only other thing I'd say is that the M finder design was changed around the time of the M4 (not the P, the straight M4). VF's of these newer models, which included the M4-P and the M6 do flare when pointed in the direction of a strong light source. Earlier ones don't have this "feature". So you get to use 28's (yay) but have to work around the finder flare from time to time (boo). None of this stopped me from getting an M7 or M8 (since sold), or an M9, which I still use.

Good luck! They are great machines and in some sense there are no bad cameras in the models you are considering.

 

[Godfrey]

Over the many years, I've owned and used M3, M4, M4-P (twice), M6TTL (0.72x), M4-2, and M6TTL (0.85x). These last two I still own and use. They are all far more alike than different. There aren't any bad choices in these M bodies (including also the M2, which I haven't owned), presuming whichever one you get is in decent shape or you're willing to have it CLA'ed to get it into decent shape.

My preferences now, having owned all these, are:

• The M4-2 was a low-ball purchase in 2011 or so ... $700 plus another $105 to have the viewfinder/rangefinder CLA'ed. The shutter isn't perfect ... it needs an overhaul ... but it's only off by half a stop across the frame, mostly noticeable at 1/500 and 1/1000 second. Not a big deal, I've run many rolls of film through it with no significant issues. I like the somewhat simpler viewfinder, albeit with this model I tend to use 90 vs 75 mm lens at the long end due to the lack of 75mm frame lines.
• The M6TTL (0.85x) I bought a year and some ago. It is in practically new condition. I bought it simply to have a film M with in-camera meter, for convenience, and because I mostly use 35/50/75mm lenses ... the higher magnification viewfinder allows more accurate focusing and a larger image in the viewfinder frames. Works beautifully, and has run a couple dozen rolls of film.

Find a good one, put a good lens on it, and go enjoy!

G

 

[Bill Blackwell]

... The earlier cameras top /bottom are brass..... the M4-2 /P/ old M6..... are plated zinc. Of the newer cameras the new M6 & MP (had one of those too) have the 28 framelines....and a brass top plate.

This is not entirely true. ALL base plates are brass. Leica did experiment with zinc bottom plates, but it was determined that the zinc material won't hold up under that kind of usage (constant removal and reattaching). ALL Leica M cameras (except the M7) can be 100% serviced mechanically. ALL Leica M cameras (except the M7) have essentially the same components. The M5 - if properly serviced - should also be a consideration. It's robust and has the only spot meter, but no 75mm framelines.

I've shot with them all over the years and you're not missing out on anything with one over the other - except the meter. But if you need 75mm framelines you're relegated to the M4-P or M6.

I've discussed the potential "classic" M6 meter board issue with Don Goldberg (DAG) and he seems insistent that the odds are very small it will fail at this point. Mine is an early production model produced in the first batch and they were most prone to fail. Don essentially said "don't worry about it". So, I'd opt (actually, I did) for a clean M6 classic. You'll save thousands of dollars over the 2022 version, of which you're gaining a brass topcover and "modern" circuitry. If you like the "post" RW system of the MP, then knock yourself out (everything is identical to the 2022 M6 except the RW knob).

 

[38Deardorff]

Thanks for the additional info Bill.
re: the 75mm framelines. "But if you need 75mm framelines you're relegated to the M4-P or M6." ..... also MP and MA.

I think it's worth familiarizing oneself with the differences between the models, since if buying used, you might stumble on a good deal on something you weren't considering.
During the 2008 economic meltdown I was just in picking up some paper, but bought a well-used M4-2 (completely serviceable & accurate) for $400 Cdn ($289 USD) at The Camera Store in Calgary. That M4-2 with a used Nokton 40mm 1.4 came in under $450 USD.... so pretty hard to pass up.

 

[sojournerphoto]

I have an M4 and MP 0.85 viewfinder and MA. I am entirely happy with any of them. Only the MA has 28mm framelines.

 

[38Deardorff]

I have an M4 and MP 0.85 viewfinder and MA. I am entirely happy with any of them. Only the MA has 28mm framelines.

The more common 0.72 MP has both the 28 and 75 framelines.

 

[sojournerphoto]

Yes, and I only picked up the MP because it was offered and was a 0.85 to be honest.

 

[38Deardorff]

Yes, and I only picked up the MP because it was offered and was a 0.85 to be honest.

Yes. No surprise that it doesn't have the 28mm since it has the magnified ( more M3 style) framelines.

 

[splitimageview]

there are umpteen discussions about which M. 🙂 It's never ending because everyone has different preferences.

The first M I had was an M3, I've had M4-2, new M6 classic, new LHSA black paint M6 TTL, and pretty much all the others (even an MP I got at a pawnshop with a 50/1.4 for $600.)

My preference after all these years is the M4 or M4-2, I don't need 28mm frames.

 

[Photar]

All good choices. Among these choices, I would go with the M6 2022 reissue because it has a built-in meter and you will get warranty. Fact is, you hardly can make a bad choice in M territory (unless you pick a model without rangefinder).

 

[Photar]

an MP I got at a pawnshop with a 50/1.4 for $600.

😲

 

[Beemermark]

ALL Leica M cameras (except the M7) can be 100% serviced mechanically. ALL Leica M cameras (except the M7) have essentially the same components. T

Not sure why you say the M7 can't be serviced. DAG did mine recently.

 

[38Deardorff]

All good choices. Among these choices, I would go with the M6 2022 reissue because it has a built-in meter and you will get warranty. Fact is, you hardly can make a bad choice in M territory (unless you pick a model without rangefinder).

Ph, I'm not averse to buying new (guilty as charged)... but at $6400 USD /$9900 AUD .....you're paying a one heck of a lot for a warranty up front. You could buy a bagful of of used M cameras for that amount....& have several backups in case you drop one 😉

 

[chuckroast]

My first post in a while, so please be kind and patient with another "what would you buy" question. I know we all have different likes/dislikes and this choice is ultimately up to me. But I would like to get input from those who are far more experienced with Leica film bodies.

When I shoot film, my primary body is a Zeiss ZI, with a Pentax SLR a back up. But I would like type get an M body, and currently considering:

• M6 2022 Re-issue - newer with modern parts, so repair and parts availability are less of a concern. This is obviously a more expensive option.
• M6 Classic - circuit board availability is a bit of a concern (may not be a "huge" concern(?) but sh&t does happen).
• M4-P - if an M6 circuit board fails, isn't this essentially what I have? I don't mind metering with my Gossen Luna Pro. This option is the least expensive.

My first was an M2 and I still think it's the best onramp to M film cameras. These are built like tanks and are just great shooters. They are also relatively good deals.

 

[Mute-on]

I think the M6 is just beautiful--so the pure aesthetic (yeah, I know...) of the 2022 M6 is my baseline, then I just went from there. I typically go out with a 2-lens combo: 28/50 or 35/75, so the need for 28mm framelines was a factor. I should add that yes, the MP is also an option.

I am biased towards the MP (0.58 in my case) if you use 28mm and want a metered body. I actually find the in-body metering very convenient, particularly in changing lighting conditions. Nevertheless, an external meter can also be quite liberating since you can set exposure once and leave it alone until or unless the light changes significantly. Overall, I do prefer the solid advance lever of the M2/M3/MP over the articulated lever of the M4/M6. Luckily you can replace the M6 advance lever with the MP style and get the best of both worlds with the faster film rewind knob of the M6.

You really can’t go wrong. In your shoes, in ascending cost, I would prioritise M4-2/P, M6 (original Classic), second hand MP, new MP, 2022 M6.

Good luck in your quest. Enjoy!