Digital Substitute

emraphoto said:
i have been watching those little olympus dslrs for a while now. if they would come out with a compact, wide lens i would be in like flynn!!

wouldn't have to be super wide... maybe a 35mm equivalent. a pancake 35mm (equivalent) and the pancake 25mm and that would be a pretty decent set-up.
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You know they have the 11-22mm lens, no? Not too expensive and what IQ!

But I agree with you, if they sell a 35mm (eq.) f/2 prime lens, I'd pre-order it the day it's announced.

If you want to help, chime in at the http://www.fourthirdsphoto.com forum, they have Olympus' ear (somewhat).
 
shadowfox said:
Agree with you on both topic.

I am also getting the E-620 (btw, where did you get yours? I want to get it online, but they are all still saying 2-4 weeks).

This will be my second DSLR ever after five years owning the E-300.

In-body IS is important to me because I like to use old manual focus lenses.

As far as noise, like you, I don't get all the hubbub from people who seem to see noise in everything except from Canon or Nikon digitals. ;)
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I ended up buying the 620 unexpectedly at a local camera store. I had gone there to buy a strap for my newly acquired Zeiss Ikon and asked the salesman when they were getting the 620 in... he answered "we only have 1 left!"... Didn't expect that! Name of the store is Berger Brothers and they do sell online (link)... I'm just lucky to live close to them.

I hate to stir the pot, but I think to a certain extent a lot of folks have gotten a bit crazy with the pixel peeping and noise concerns. I would never try to deny that the image quality from a 5D is outstandingly clean, all I can say is that for me, I have NOT found the Oly 410 (and now 620) to be "horrible by comparison"... they have served me just fine. Wonderful lenses, small and light package... awesome image quality and perfect for me when a DSLR is called for. My need to shoot at an ISO of 1600 just isn't that great, but I certainly haven't been afraid of it when it's necessary.

As for digital vs. film... not an argument I can make. As an Art Director I expect photographers I hire to use digital. However, I know plenty of pros still using film, or using a mixture of film and digital. When I do my own "I'm going to get paid for this" photography, it's digital, and it's a mixture of DSLR and Rangefinder.
 
mgd711 said:
Where will you be working in West Africa? I worked there for almost 6 years and was kidnapped twice. A small discrete piece of consumer electronics might not be the best tool for the job. Maybe a film compact like a T3 or a Klasse W might draw less attention to yourself.
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hi my friend!

i fly into Lagos, Nigeria the middle of the month and travel down into the Port Hardcourt area. of course the trip to Abuja to "check in" and pick up my security forces tail... i mean press credentials:cool: will come first. i will spend the bulk of my time in the kidnapping centre of the African continent actually and the security preparations (and $) has been daunting to say the least.

i will be packing a couple of stylus epic's for the times when losing one is a distinct possibility. the dpi is also receiving a thorough camo job via the ole ductape. it will in essence be a black box by the time i'm dobe with it. i am also heavily insured already for these sorts of affairs, including my gear.

where were you working when you were there? i am considering a trip up into western Chad and have yet to here any first hand reports of the area. I am well up to speed on the Niger Delta at this point:eek:

kidnapped twice hey? i have yet to add that to my roster of experiences. something tells me that it might end up in the memoirs yet! how did you manage to squirm out of that? any and all tips are appreciated. i am currently on the hunt for a driver to run me up to Abuja and back. drop me a line if you have any hints. i understand the road can be a tad perilous!
 
shadowfox said:
You know they have the 11-22mm lens, no? Not too expensive and what IQ!

But I agree with you, if they sell a 35mm (eq.) f/2 prime lens, I'd pre-order it the day it's announced.

If you want to help, chime in at the http://www.fourthirdsphoto.com forum, they have Olympus' ear (somewhat).
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i do know of their AWESOME wide zooms. i had considered the 7-14. the point though would be as "compact" as possible for me. i already have a bagful of big, mean, battered nikon dlsr's.

i was looking at the new pentax 15mm as an option. i don't know too much about the adapter game yet or it's list of "cons".

i'll take a peek over at fourthirdsphoto. cheers!
 
I worked in Port Harcourt (Oilfield trash). It is extremely dangerous and never under estimate the situation. I'd fly between Abuja and PH but use a decent airline like Aero Contractors. I'd avoid using Bellview, the plane we used to use from PH to Lagos later crashed on a flight from Lagos to Abuja.

If you have no contact's in PH I'd suggest getting friendly with Schlumberger or a similar oilfield contractor. The Toby Jug in PH is an OK place to drink and make contacts.

Avoid the "International Hotel" by PH airport and stay in PH itself, buy lots of water, bring a flash light and spare battery's.......

It is the most dangerous country I have been in by far (and I've been in all the oilfield **** holes in the world), the situation can change in an instant.

If you do get kidnapped just sit back and relax and wait for the ransom to be paid. As you are non-oilfield it's unlikely that will happen to you though.

If you don't have to go through Abuja take the Air France flight or Virgin (if its still flying) directly to PH.

If you want more info send me a PM and I'll give you my e-mail address.
 
i'll pm you in a bit... all the contacts and info i can get my hands the better. i do have to go to Abuja as all foreign journalists MUST check in there. as well Lagos seems to be the home base for the two months i am there... the rate at which planes drop out of the sky there has me firmly committed to four wheels!

i am very aware of the dangers yet i do appreciate your advice!

anyhow, i'll drop you a line in a bit.
 
in my opinion it's about the image.
anyone who love this or that camera, that's fine but that has nothing to do w/ the creative job of image making.
digital can be much better than film for a given aplication. film can be much better than digital... but probably not for long.
sure, a horse is much nicer than a mercedes benz but the benz is faster on an open road.
 
I guess that after half a century of learning the mishagas of film I don't want to put up with the mishagas of learning. I can still use film.
 
for the serious business Bill i run a set-up very similar to you... d700, 28mm f2.8 af and the 50mm f1.8 af (that i have had for close to 15 years).

the dp1 has come out and earned the groceries for the day more than once but i am still not quite convinced it's the answer. i seem to recall you were sporting a couple of canons for a bit, the g9 and g10? any thoughts on those models? the real issue for me these days is that the bulk of the compacts can produce files up into the 800-1600 range that look fine in b+w but in color? forget about it!
 
I am also looking for a small digital alternative...

I have owned a pair of Canon G2's for years, great little cameras with a wonderful f2.0 lens that is equivalent to 35mm at the wide end of the zoom. But the 3Mp sensor is a real struggle. Although the G2 has a little porthole that you could call a finder!

I would like find a camera with a sensor similar to the D300 with a lens equivalent to 35mm to 40mm focal length with a f2.0 aperture. Can be auto-focus as long as it will allow manual focusing by pre-set or live view. A simple, effective finder, full manual overide and good ISO performance from 50 to 3200.

It seems that most small digital cameras are either limited by a small, noisy sensor or the lack of a good, fast normal to slight wide lens. Essentially the modern day equivalent of the fixed lens rangefinder from the '70's is what I am looking for.
 
I have a D700 + 50/1.4G (or any of a few zooms, too). I was in and out of rangefinders vs. digitals for too long. I liked to use rangefinders but internet stock agencies (in general, not the brightest folks on the planet) absolutely hated film to the point you'd think they were personally threatened by that thug, E6 ,and his henchman, C41.

Now, I've decided stock is a declining way to make a few dollars, at best. I'm getting off the merry-go-round. In my frugal retirement years, I can no longer keep buying or trading camera equipment. I will keep my D700 outfit (poor me) and be happy.

With this rig I will NOT be sneaking up on anyone!
 
I haven't substituted for my Leica(s). I have added a Nikon D60 to my lifetime accumulation of cameras. Like Harry, I wish there was a digital successor to the Leica CL. Am very interested in learning about the Lumix G1.
JustPlainBill
 
I haven't substituted for my Leica(s). I have added a Nikon D60 to my lifetime accumulation of cameras. Like Harry, I wish there was a digital successor to the Leica CL. Am very interested in learning about the Lumix G1.
JustPlainBill
 
Al Kaplan said:
There aren't a lot of working photographers on this forum. A lot of the ones that I know would prefer being able to go back to using film if the market would allow it. Many do shoot film for as much of their work as they can.
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I am about 70% film use now, looking forward to getting digital use down to about 20% of my work. And for the record, I have been using digital for 15 years.

But as far as low light with Leica, it is still better than my digital rigs because I use proper technique / lighting and scene evaluation.
 
It's amazing just how big a hole in the market this is. None of the available solutions really works.

What we really need is a digital CL (max $1899 with 35mm equivalent) or a APS compact with a fixed 35mm (equivalent) lens for no more than $999. Throw in a basic mechanical rangefinder (from the CL) and manual focusing or make it like the Hexar AF.

Leica really is nuts for not building the CL-D camera. Instead, they have one foot in the grave and the other on a banana peel, because they have practically priced themselves out of the market with the M8.x and current lenses.

They can buy the 12MP APS sensor that is in the D300 from Sony. Then make set of economy lenses that are APS specific. Add a little weather-sealing (like Pentax does) and build the whole thing in Portugal, Eastern Europe or China. It would sell by the trainload.

But knowing Leica this makes too much sense and if they did built it, it would probably still cost $3000 for the body; totally defeating the reason for building the camera in the first place. Oh, well. Maybe we'll get lucky and Nikon or Cosina will build something. In any case I think we are going to see a lot of movement in this area in the next year.


But I do need something compact. I have a D700 and it is brilliant. Hands down the best DSLR I have ever used. But it is big. My current set up is 2 x M bodies with 35 and 50 and a Nikon F mounting a 50. If I add the D700 I'm going to end up a cripple. But I do want to shoot more color.

The DP2 is about as big as a pack of smokes and would hardly be noticed in my bag. But it is expensive and I need to see a few more reviews. Maybe play with one in person.
 
DP2-expensive? no

DP2-expensive? no

Harry Lime said:
It's amazing just how big a hole in the market this is. None of the available solutions really works.

What we really need is a digital CL (max $1899 with 35mm equivalent) or a APS compact with a fixed 35mm (equivalent) lens for no more than $999. Throw in a basic mechanical rangefinder (from the CL) and manual focusing or make it like the Hexar AF.

Leica really is nuts for not building the CL-D camera. Instead, they have one foot in the grave and the other on a banana peel, because they have practically priced themselves out of the market with the M8.x and current lenses.

They can buy the 12MP APS sensor that is in the D300 from Sony. Then make set of economy lenses that are APS specific. Add a little weather-sealing (like Pentax does) and build the whole thing in Portugal, Eastern Europe or China. It would sell by the trainload.

But knowing Leica this makes too much sense and if they did built it, it would probably still cost $3000 for the body; totally defeating the reason for building the camera in the first place. Oh, well. Maybe we'll get lucky and Nikon or Cosina will build something. In any case I think we are going to see a lot of movement in this area in the next year.


But I do need something compact. I have a D700 and it is brilliant. Hands down the best DSLR I have ever used. But it is big. My current set up is 2 x M bodies with 35 and 50 and a Nikon F mounting a 50. If I add the D700 I'm going to end up a cripple. But I do want to shoot more color.

The DP2 is about as big as a pack of smokes and would hardly be noticed in my bag. But it is expensive and I need to see a few more reviews. Maybe play with one in person.
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DP2 expensive? not at all:
DP2= 644 euros-i have a link from an insider who is also testing the camera.
 
Al Kaplan said:
Lag is lag. Scale focus might speed things up but the DSLR's that I played with are the devil to focus manualy other than scale focus.
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Not an SLR, but try a D300 or a D700. Faster than any film camera I've used in the last 35+ years. Digital doesn't have to mean slow...
 
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