first range finder, please advice

[cs_foto]

Hi all, I'm new in here, basically I want to get my first rangefinder film camera with the leica M mount.

at the moment I shoot with hasseblads V system and also use a nikon based SLR system (digital and film with an FM2N)

My plan is to change my nikon digital/film system for a M mount based system (probably getting the M8 in the future)

Ok here comes, I am considering both brand new bodies or second hand. At first I was only considering a leica body, an MP to be precise, or a second hand M4-P, I don't need a meter, I don't need anything else but manual controls, I want a full mechanical shutter, basically a camera that will never need batteries. Something like my Nikon FM2.

I understand both the MP and the M4-P can work at 100% without batteries which is amazing, I also know that the M7 will not work without batteries (limited to shutter speeds of 1/60th or 1/125th).

Now comes the dilema, I just found that I could get a Zeiss IKON or a Voigtlander Bessa, in this case I will go for a 'brand new' body as they are quite 'accesible'.

My question is, will this 2 cameras work at 100% with no batteries? which of the voigtlanders is better?

Are there any other brands that would take the Leica M lenses?

Any advice or guidance will be much appreciated

Thanks for your feedback and sorry for the long post.

 

[kxl]

What focal length(s) do you like to shoot? How much are you looking to spend for body and lens?

The ZI requires a battery as do the CV R3A and R4A. The CV R3M and R4M do not (they'll function, but no metering).

I have a ZI, and am very happy with it. Batteries are cheap, small and with the ZI, they last forever. So, I always have at least a couple in my bag. The CV's provide good value (I used to have an R3A, R3M and R4M), but the ZI viewfinder is just a different league altogether. The ZI has framelines for 28-35-50-85.

 

[mfogiel]

The questions are:
- do you wear glasses?
- what fl will you use mainly?
- do you want to do street photography?
- are you directed to a place where you cannot buy a battery once a year?
- do you want to shoot B&W or colour?
- do you need a very quiet shutter ?
- do you want to shoot against the sun sometimes?
- do you need a shutter faster than 1/1000 ?
- do you think you will want to change the film quickly?

 

[nzeeman]

zeiss ikon is electronic camera - and it is dead without batteries. if you want mechanical bessa take those with m in name r2m, r3m,r4m. if you need it for 50 mm lens r2m, if you want 40mm r3m, and for wide angles r4m...

 

[robklurfield]

Consider an M2, M3 or M4. No batteries, no meter. Far less money than a current MP. Rugged as can be. See threads all over the place on RFF re viewer finder, frame lines choices/preferences. I don't have experience w/ CV's, so I can't compare, but there are tons of folks on RFF who know them well and swear by them.

 

[cs_foto]

wow thanks for the quick replys


- do you wear glasses?
NO
- what fl will you use mainly?
will start with a 28mm a 50mm and a 90mm most probably
- do you want to do street photography?
as well
- are you directed to a place where you cannot buy a battery once a year?
YES, really no batteries i really mean it 😀 So there goes the Zeiss
- do you want to shoot B&W or colour?
both, why is that?
- do you need a very quiet shutter ?
Yes I heard the M7 the other day and is lovely, I if only leica can do that then there is no other option, this is very important
- do you want to shoot against the sun sometimes?
always 😀
- do you need a shutter faster than 1/1000 ?
yes, maybe
- do you think you will want to change the film quickly?
not necessarily, how you compare?

Cheers

 

[Steve Bellayr]

M6 Classics can be found for around $1200 in excellent condition. When the battery dies it is fully functional sans meter.

 

[mfogiel]

So, there is no ideal solution for you, because Leicas go down to 1/1000 at most, and if you shoot against the sun, you burn a hole in the shutter. ZI does not work without batteries, so your best shot is the R2M, but it will not be very silent, and if you want to use it for street photography, you will lose some good shots because it has no AE ( you do not want the battery dependency). At least, this camera does not cost much, so you can spend more on lenses... Actually, you could buy the R4M for the 21-35mm and the R3M for the 40-90mm fl

 

[cs_foto]

"and if you shoot against the sun, you burn a hole in the shutter"

hi can you explain a bit more?

what about the leica M4-P? so far it seems right.

 

[photobizzz]

The lens focuses the rays into a pinpoint that can burn a hole in the cloth shutter of any Leica camera, the CV Bessa camera have a metal shutter so it is not a problem

 

[cs_foto]

so is that like a law? or something that has happened, once in while kindda thing?

whats the chance of this happening on a real life scenario/ normal use. lets say you are shooting in a very sunny country in the seaside or in the desert in africa.

 

[sojournerphoto]

so is that like a law? or something that has happened, once in while kindda thing?

whats the chance of this happening on a real life scenario/ normal use. lets say you are shooting in a very sunny country in the seaside or in the desert in africa.

There are a few threads on here about it, and how to repair it.

Rxm for no battery or ZI with battery

Mike