bbgen
Member
Hi,
I have posted a similar thread on the Nikon Historical Society forum but was told by a friend to post here as well to seek more objective opinions.
I have a Nikon S2 Black with the serial number 6170975 that I wanted to sell. The pictures speak for themselves but before I make a complete international idiot of myself in the international scene, I just want to double check with you guys whether this is the real stuff and roughly what price level I should be looking at. I did my research about 12 years ago when I bought it but I think I better be on the safe side and check with experts here rather than being hammered later on.
I would want to sell the body alone though it comes with a black 50/1.4 lense that has a single line scratch on the front optics. To the best of my knowledge in good working condition. Finder is clean,no fog. All functions are working correctly. The vulcanite is completely intact. Cosmetic shows some minor signs of wear, slight brassing on the neckstrap hooking areas and edges. No dent and ding. Curtain in good condition.The shutter fires correctly at all speed settings. Thanks for reading and appreciate any help.
Regards
P.S. Slightly better photos of the top and back can be seen at the post #16 below by myself.
I have posted a similar thread on the Nikon Historical Society forum but was told by a friend to post here as well to seek more objective opinions.
I have a Nikon S2 Black with the serial number 6170975 that I wanted to sell. The pictures speak for themselves but before I make a complete international idiot of myself in the international scene, I just want to double check with you guys whether this is the real stuff and roughly what price level I should be looking at. I did my research about 12 years ago when I bought it but I think I better be on the safe side and check with experts here rather than being hammered later on.
I would want to sell the body alone though it comes with a black 50/1.4 lense that has a single line scratch on the front optics. To the best of my knowledge in good working condition. Finder is clean,no fog. All functions are working correctly. The vulcanite is completely intact. Cosmetic shows some minor signs of wear, slight brassing on the neckstrap hooking areas and edges. No dent and ding. Curtain in good condition.The shutter fires correctly at all speed settings. Thanks for reading and appreciate any help.
Regards
P.S. Slightly better photos of the top and back can be seen at the post #16 below by myself.
Attachments
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VinceC
Veteran
I don't know enough about these other than they are quite rare.
Assuming the camera is genuine (others here have serial #s to check against), I would strongly advise against splitting up the lens from the body.
(If you post the Serial # of the lens, someone good with serial #s will know if the camera and lens were made at approximately the same time.
Assuming the camera is genuine (others here have serial #s to check against), I would strongly advise against splitting up the lens from the body.
(If you post the Serial # of the lens, someone good with serial #s will know if the camera and lens were made at approximately the same time.
bbgen
Member
Thanks for the kind reply. i will look up the lense and its serial number. Problem is lense has a scratch near to the edge of the ring or barrel. Not that obvious because the scratch line is a little curvy parallel to the ring or barrel.
bbgen said:
I don't mean to sound harsh, but if I was going to decide whether or not to buy a camera that could be worth anywhere up to $10,000 for the real thing, as well as getting an expert to physically examine the camera, I'd also want to to see much better photos than the ones you've posted. Here's a photo of a known fake black S2 that belongs to a member of this forum. Looks pretty good for a fake, huh
bbgen
Member
Wow, fantastic fake. Could you enlighten me by highlighting what are the places to look for.
Another thing I just remembered was that a few years back, I took part in a contest on the oldest Nikon in my country organized by Nikon itself. My Nikon S came in second prize but they saw my this black S2 and they asked me to loan it to them for their anniversary exhibition.
As for the photos, I will do my best to take better ones but my only digital camera is a Panasonic FX9
Another thing I just remembered was that a few years back, I took part in a contest on the oldest Nikon in my country organized by Nikon itself. My Nikon S came in second prize but they saw my this black S2 and they asked me to loan it to them for their anniversary exhibition.
As for the photos, I will do my best to take better ones but my only digital camera is a Panasonic FX9
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kb244
Well-known
That should be fine to get a good image, just probably restrict yourself to a tripod if you're going to use automatic modes, and try not to get so close to the camera you can always crop later quite easily if the intent is images for the web. (getting too close as you done will not only risk higher camera shakes, but will allow for a larger depth of field on those cameras).bbgen said:As for the photos, I will do my best to take better ones but my only digital camera is a Panasonic FX9
To tell a good fake from the real thing, I know that the camera needs to be partly disassembled, but I don't know the details and those that do know will probably not be inclined to make this knowledge available on a public forum. That would make the job of those that make fakes easier afterall. Hopefully one of our experts will chime in here.bbgen said:
Nothing wrong with a Panasonic FX9. You can get better results by using several lamps for lighting from different directions, and most importantly a tripod (or other means to keep the camera stable). You also might get better results by turning the camera's flash off and relying on the available light. There's no need to go out and buy a D2Xbbgen said:As for the photos, I will do my best to take better ones but my only digital camera is a Panasonic FX9
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bbgen
Member
Thanks for tips and hints, I will venture into those tomorrow and see what I can come up with.
jlw
Rangefinder camera pedant
I don't know anything about black Nikons specifically, just a couple of general observations:
-- When the factories made a black camera body, they pulled bare brass top and bottom plates off the production line before the usual satin chrome finish was applied. (This saved the expense of unnecessary chrome plating, and the enamel adhered better to the brass.) This means that as a factory-black camera wears, you'll see brass in the wear spots. If you see chrome, the black finish almost certainly was applied later.
(Note that fastidious repainters can remove satin chrome with chemicals, abrasives, or via "reverse electroplating." So, a camera with brass wear marks is not necessarily "factory black." But one with chrome wear marks is almost certainly NOT.)
-- Satin chrome plating adds thickness, and so does paint. A factory-black camera will have only one or the other. If someone has painted over camera parts that were already satin chromed, the extra thickness will add up: the radii of the bends in the cover panels will be slightly too large, and creases won't be as sharp as they should be. Often it's hard to put a finger on this, it's just that the camera doesn't "look right." (Again, a camera that's been de-plated before painting won't show these effects.)
-- When the factories made a black camera body, they pulled bare brass top and bottom plates off the production line before the usual satin chrome finish was applied. (This saved the expense of unnecessary chrome plating, and the enamel adhered better to the brass.) This means that as a factory-black camera wears, you'll see brass in the wear spots. If you see chrome, the black finish almost certainly was applied later.
(Note that fastidious repainters can remove satin chrome with chemicals, abrasives, or via "reverse electroplating." So, a camera with brass wear marks is not necessarily "factory black." But one with chrome wear marks is almost certainly NOT.)
-- Satin chrome plating adds thickness, and so does paint. A factory-black camera will have only one or the other. If someone has painted over camera parts that were already satin chromed, the extra thickness will add up: the radii of the bends in the cover panels will be slightly too large, and creases won't be as sharp as they should be. Often it's hard to put a finger on this, it's just that the camera doesn't "look right." (Again, a camera that's been de-plated before painting won't show these effects.)
VinceC
Veteran
>>My Nikon S came in second prize but they saw my this black S2 and they asked me to loan it to them for their anniversary exhibition.<<
If you have photos of the camera as part of this Nikon exhibition, that would be of interest to a buyer.
If you have photos of the camera as part of this Nikon exhibition, that would be of interest to a buyer.
bbgen
Member
The serial number of the lense is #379876.
I did not attend the exhibition. In fact I did not even attend the prize presentation ceremony. I just went there to collect the prize a Nikon 3100 i think for having one of the top 3 oldest Nikon which I gave to my brother.
As a token of thanks from Nikon for loaning the S2, they gave me a Nikon Dry Cabinet, windbreaker and cap
I did not attend the exhibition. In fact I did not even attend the prize presentation ceremony. I just went there to collect the prize a Nikon 3100 i think for having one of the top 3 oldest Nikon which I gave to my brother.
As a token of thanks from Nikon for loaning the S2, they gave me a Nikon Dry Cabinet, windbreaker and cap
Jarle Aasland
Nikon SP/S2, Fuji X100
Regarding your serial number, it's very close to other confirmed black S2's. The official NHS black body list includes 6170962 and 6170995, with your camera being in the middle at 6170975.
Nikon (i.e. Nippon Kogaku) made the black bodied cameras in batches, some large, others quite small.
I'm no expert and can't say for sure that it's real, but based on the serial numbers I would think there's a good chance it is.
Jarle
Nikon (i.e. Nippon Kogaku) made the black bodied cameras in batches, some large, others quite small.
I'm no expert and can't say for sure that it's real, but based on the serial numbers I would think there's a good chance it is.
Jarle
kb244
Well-known
Well if there is a chance that its the real deal, and if they go for that much, it might not hurt talking to one of those auction houses. Otherwise I guess you could throw it up on ebay, with detailed pictures and serial number and such.
bbgen
Member
kb244
Well-known
bbgen said:
No reason you can't try, we did so with some of the leica stuff.
In any case looks like the paint is directly on top of the brass, and not on top of chrome.
bbgen
Member
Thanks guys for the quick response and appreciate all the kind advice.
Though I have an ebay account, I have yet to sell anything or purchase anything there. Actually its all a complete set with 35mm, 105mm and 85mm if I remember correctly and also another Nikon S with a 50/2 lense.
In fact, I was thinking of subsidizing the confirmed buyers air ticket if he or she were to come down to my place Afterall, I will be paying quite a fee or premium to the auctioneer and insurance and courier shipping to the auctioneer. Might as well use these good money and pay part of the airfare for the buyer if he could see and feel and we could go to the Nikon here to verify. I am sure the Nikon Japanese chief will be more than happy to help authenticate(wishing thinking on my part )
Though I have an ebay account, I have yet to sell anything or purchase anything there. Actually its all a complete set with 35mm, 105mm and 85mm if I remember correctly and also another Nikon S with a 50/2 lense.
In fact, I was thinking of subsidizing the confirmed buyers air ticket if he or she were to come down to my place
Afterall, I will be paying quite a fee or premium to the auctioneer and insurance and courier shipping to the auctioneer. Might as well use these good money and pay part of the airfare for the buyer if he could see and feel and we could go to the Nikon here to verify. I am sure the Nikon Japanese chief will be more than happy to help authenticate(wishing thinking on my part )
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VinceC
Veteran
Are you in a hurry to sell? Maybe you could sell some of the more common gear first to establish a bit of a track record. Are the other lenses from the set black barrel (35 and 85)?
If you've got a 35/1.8 in user (not collector) condition, you'll definitely have my attention. I've used mine so much that, after two decades of near daily use, it needs to be replaced.
There might be some sense in keeping the camera and all its lenses together ... an instant 1956 top-of-the-line pro collection. But others here will know if that's a smart move or not.
If you've got a 35/1.8 in user (not collector) condition, you'll definitely have my attention. I've used mine so much that, after two decades of near daily use, it needs to be replaced.
There might be some sense in keeping the camera and all its lenses together ... an instant 1956 top-of-the-line pro collection. But others here will know if that's a smart move or not.
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bbgen
Member
VinceC said:
As always, its a chicken and egg thing
Too common, there are so many sellers of the same kind. Too rare, it becomes so intimidating and fraudalent bias But after reading this thread on the shipping and customs nightmare, http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=52510 I seriously think hand delivery could be a good alternative if it is an expensive and rare item.
Sorry Vince, no 35/1.8 in my possession for Nikon.
Jarle Aasland
Nikon SP/S2, Fuji X100
I haven't read the thread you're referring to (I've already read and heard all the classic horror stories), but I wouldn't worry too much.bbgen said:
Serious buyers will know that there are customs and VAT issues involved (depending on their country). Hand delivery is obviously fine, but a little overkill, IMO (..but it could be a fine excuse to do that around the globe trip you always dreamed about). Putting things into perspective, it's not like your shipping the crown jewels or a priceless Da Vinci. In any case, you could risk getting robbed when you go to meet the buyer. Or your plane could crash. You simply can't worry about everything that can go wrong in life.
Just make sure you are paid, insure everything, and do all the paperwork properly. Shouldn't be a problem.
Good luck, whatever you decide to do!
Jarle
bbgen
Member
You make my day, Jarle. Just had my dinner and followed by a good laugh upon reading your post. I have not been to Europe except London, and its definitely not cheap to stay there
UPS has always been my choice of courier service, and I think they have done a good job so far. Most expensive item they ever delivered for me was Rolleiflex Aurum. Arrived safe and sound, and timely as well.
If the buyer is somewhere near my place, of course I have no qualms delivering.
UPS has always been my choice of courier service, and I think they have done a good job so far. Most expensive item they ever delivered for me was Rolleiflex Aurum. Arrived safe and sound, and timely as well.
If the buyer is somewhere near my place, of course I have no qualms delivering.