I don't understand Leica people

Originally Posted by Toby
This means many young photographers would be put off from experimenting with rangefinders, and so limits the new blood entering the RF scene, this in particular is a bad thing.
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However, it also means many young collectors will be encouraged to experiment with making a few bucks collecting RFs and thus duplicate new blood entering the RF Collectors scene. Collectors [who collect only] aren't discipling shooters and would probably call it a "waste of a good item" to pull a Leica off the shelf, yank it out of the case, stuff it in you coat pocket and head for the farmer's market.

While users, even beater users like me, :cool: want the prices of good cameras to stay low, we certainly don't want the prices/value of our cameras to drop. Whether user or collector, we all want to "buy low/sell high" our cars, houses and cameras. Sure, $1000 for a wooden display Leica would be crazy money to me... unless... I really, really believed it would sell for more than that in the future. At that point, it's not likely I'm going to pass up an opportunity to make a profit so some youngin' can get into his new hobby cheaper. Anybody here ever bought another lens they really didn't need because the price was "too good to pass up" ? I have. (BTW, for you Leica wooden display model collectors with silly money... I've got a pocket knife, a 2 by 4 and time on my hands. PM me. ;) )
 
Toby said:
My only bugbear with collectors is that they bump up the prices of cameras which limits who can buy them. This means many young photographers would be put off from experimenting with rangefinders, and so limits the new blood entering the RF scene, this in particular is a bad thing.
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I am not so sure. Used Voigtlander R2A..CV 35 f2.5...more than a used Olympus 1n but no more than a decent Fm2.

Some of the posh collector Nikon or Leica RF kit might cost a fortune but there is plenty of highly useable kit out there which is not coveted by collectors. If youngsters want to try the glow of rare vintage collector leica glass I suggest they buy a CV 35 and smear a touch of vaseline on the front ;). Anything that is rare and coveted will have a high price. This is normal and not confined to cameras. Its like complaining that young drivers don't get to play with vintage Ferraris because the collectors have driven the prices up (and they cost a fortune to start with).

For people wanting to buy and use kit there has never been a better time, surely. (OK maybe just before the Leica price hike was better ....)
 
dexdog said:
It is not that I don't understand leica people, it is that I do not understand leica snobs. In my estimation, leica snobs are as insufferable as Mac snobs (including several of my extended family). The snobs like to pretend that they are superior to the folks that do not subscribe to the religion. I am not into faith-based photography or computing.

Use whatever works for you personally, but don't be snarky about it.
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Dexdog,

I find people who use material items as a way to define themselves and their self worth to be rather pathetic. But it does not keep me up at night. They are not to be confused with enthusiasts or zealots. While they too can be annoying at times I have to appreciate the passion.

I use Leica cameras and lenses. I also use mamiya gear and bronica gear and CV equipment. I use it because it fits a specific need and is great equipment. I'm not alone in that either. If you find that to be "snarky" so beit.

BTW...snobs are not pretending to be superior. They beleive that they are superior. Snobbery is just part of life. Get used to it or admit you have a touch of it yourself.

Bob
 
I find people who use material items as a way to define themselves and their self worth to be rather pathetic. But it does not keep me up at night. They are not to be confused with enthusiasts or zealots. While they too can be annoying at times I have to appreciate the passion.
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The use of material goods to define oneself ("what does your car say about you?") has recently been proposed as a mental illness by psychologist Oliver James and dubbed affluenza.

Link
 
I have eighteen Leicas ... only two of which I seem to use which are my M7 and M2. I guess I could sell the rest and the money would get something very nice as a replacement ... maybe a bloody great plasma TV with surround sound ... an overseas holiday, maybe some blue chip shares ... nahh! Even though they aren't being used they give me a lot of pleasure ... they look great , they feel great and they smell great. Yeah ... when they stop affecting me that way, I may cash them in ... doesn't seem likely though! :D
 
Since you say you don't understand let me try to explain.
Not all collectors collect for display,it's obvious that a Dummy M5 is only for display but that's not how it starts.
It starts by one loving their instruments,so much that you CAN'T sell them,then you want to try other instruments and so on...
before you know it you have 50 cameras and you have become a collector!
That is when the Dummy M5 comes into the picture!

At the end I like to mention,Personally, I have enjoyed using every camera I collected;)


Get it?

Kiu
 
Don't understand Leica people? Imagine the price of what a dummy Black Nikon SP would go for....
 
Yeah, but I would have the top plate, back, and bezel off of that one and then pick up a user SP so fast it would make your head spin.
 
My younger brother always collected stuff when we were kids. But he was my brother so even though I called him a moron on a daily basis I gave him the baseball cards from my gum, emptied him all the pennies that weighed my pockets down, gave him my comic books when I was done reading them.

At last count I think his collections were appraised at $1.6 million and I'm forced to admit he wasn't quite the moron I thought ;)
 
edodo said:
the M5+ summilux at 900 euros seems untrue to me, or the M5 and or the lens was mechanically wrong somewhere...
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I watched that eBay auction till the very end and was resisting a colossal GAS attack at the time, so I am quite positive that it did indeed happen and did not have any defects mentioned in the text or immediately visible to my non-Leica-trained eye. Actually the result was less than 900, IIRC somewhere in the 860's. I would agree that it probably wasn't a particularly representative auction, but then again unrepresentative things do happen every now and then.

Philipp
 
To anyone that doesn't "get" collector's... DON'T WORRY ABOUT IT! It's not your moeny and its nothing you need to bother your little heards about. I don't collect cameras, but I collect records, one specific band in particular. I have each and every album on nearly each and every pressing and color. I have up to nine or ten copies of the same specific record, but they're pressed on different colors so it gives me an incentive to buy them. Some of them are pretty valuable to other collectors of this band (i have lots valued between $100-150, a handful at $150-200 and a couple that are $300+), and I don't expect most people to want to spend that much for a record. Its a game, I guess. I enjoy scouring record shops, ebay, etc. for a pressing of a record that I don't have. Its a hobby. Its just fun. I wouldn't pay $600+ for a dummy Leica, but I don't collect Leica. However, if I had a bunch of money, I probably would acquire a small Leica collection, because there's a lot of history in these cameras and they are very nice. It may not make the most amount of sense, but it doesn't have to make sense to you, just the buyer.
 
I don't understand why would people buy a dummy Leica body, but then, they probably wouldn't understand why I would buy a camera body to use it, so we're even.

Now, the collector's mentality is, indeed, a psychological short-circuit. In other words, Ralph, your dad is right: you're nuts.

And so are most of us, RFF members. :)
 
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