i NEED digital manual focus camera advice ...

[paulfish4570]

... but any advice must leave out leica cameras, and full-frame dslrs. i simply cannot afford an M9/ME/Mm body, or a canikon full-frame body. i would like to buy new.
i like the files i get from my x100, so i suspect i'd like a same/similar-size/quality sensor.
i want a digital focus/composition hit rate that equals that of my r2m and ME super when, for example, shooting my grandchildren at play. recently, i shot my three grandchildren at a nice playground, using my x100, r2m and ME super. i exposed maybe 30-35 frames total of ap 400. i made 150-plus x100 frames. more than half the film frames are keepers. maybe 20 of the x100 frames are keepers. there is no difference in rate of keepers when shooting static stuff.
with my x100 set on "manual," using the little focus button on the top right of the back with my thumb, and my right forefinger-tip on the shutter release, i cannot get off a shot quick enough to catch my grandchildren at play. this is more of a body issue involving declined fine motor skills, not a camera issue.
i am much quicker focusing the lenses of my slr and rf with my left hand, and hitting the shutter release near simultaneously with my right forefinger.
i'd like to use my current lenses: pentax-m 50/1.4 modified by ferider for coupled rangefinder use with m-mount bodies via adapter; and/or my un-modified pentax-m 50/1.4; and/or my nikon e-series 35/2.5; and/or my nikkor 50/2. i'd be willing to sacrifice use of those lenses with a digital cam. the fuji x-e1 and x-pro1 might be in the picture with the fuji 35/1.4.
so, what say ye: ricoh gxr with EVF? NEX 5n with EVF? NEX 6 or 7? pentax or nikon dslr with crop sensor? many of y'all know what i shoot. i much appreciate y'all's advice.

 

[paulfish4570]

oh yeah: i am a 50mm equivalent focal length guy. i very seldom use anything wider. the x100 with its 35mm equivalent almost always is too wide for me. with people subject, i like to maintain a "normal," respectful distance, even with my grandchildren.

 

[hipsterdufus]

What's the budget? I have had a similar dilemma over the last few months. I ended up getting a used Canon 5D for my manual focus M42 lenses. However, in your circumstances, I really think a Nex 5N would be the best choice. It has focus peaking (very rangefinder-like), and it wlll let you use virtually all of your lenses with a minimal crop factor. Plus, it fits your requirement for a new (not used) camera.

 

[Benjamin Marks]

Paul:

Man, there are a lot of choices out there right now. I think the question is how well you adapt to technologically driven focus compromises. In my case, I happen to like adapters and EVFs, which may put me in the minority of photographers here. If you don't have a problem manually focusing on an EVF, and if money allows, in your shoes I would buy a NEX 7. I have the NEX 5 and I have been happy with the image quality. The NEX 7 fixes my main objection to the early NEX form factor, which is enforced chimping (or in my case a silly kludge involving a Hoodman viewer and >gasp< rubber bands). But if you like a 50mm FOV, there are many nice 35s out there that will get you there on an APS-C camera. A Fuji XP-1 would also work nicely, but once again, you have to learn to live with the camera's limitations. I have one of these and use frequently with M-mount lenses, as well as lenses from SLR manufacturers.

I have also watched the OM-D's prices anticipating that at some point in the next year they will drop. But the 2x crop factor on these cameras make them a poor choice for you, given what you have written about your preferred focal lengths above.

The GXR has a great reputation with RF lenses, but it doesn't sound like that is what you would be using. My suggestion would be to try to handle as many of the cameras you are interested in, in person so you can see how you interact with the particular set up you are testing.

Good luck and let us know what you choose.

Ben Marks

 

[daveleo]

Paul
I have a Nikon D5100 and before that a D60. These are 1.5 crop factor bodies. I've been through a slew of "consumer" lenses, and I now shoot 90% of my images with the camera set to M and I am using a 1980's vintage manual focus 24/f2.8AIS ($189 in EX condition) because it gives me that 36mm FOV that I love. I also have the new Nikkor 35mm/1.8 DX automatic lens ("52mm FOV") and it is fabulous for the $200new. I have three versions of their 50mm lens and my hands down favorite is the old manual focus semi-pancake design ($59 in EX condition !).

Check out the used or refurbished Nikon DSLR's. I am much happier with the D5100 now that I am using the manual lenses.

Oh . . . I installed a Katzeye focusing screen ($120) that made things a lot easier for these old eyes.

 

[MartinP]

As you already have a few K-mount lenses, buy a 28mm or 35mm Pentax-A lens and one of the Pentax DSLR's. For the rare occasions when I need a decent digital shot, or a copy of a silver print (using a low priced Pentax macro lens), I have a K5. No problems with focussing manually, it is quite small and it is very adaptable. There are also the lower priced bodies from Pentax which are lighter, smaller and cheaper. Why make things complicated?

 

[ruby.monkey]

Try the micro-4/3 camera of your choice with a 25mm f/1.4 DG-Summilux.

 

[doolittle]

Total curve ball here: Nikon V1 with 10-30mm kit lens. Especially now that they are discontinued and heavily discounted. Calumet UK are selling them off for £299.
Yes, the sensor is smaller than m4/3. However with the relative low pixel count and decent sensor it performs above its station. The killer feature though is the fast autofocus and fps, great for photographing fast moving kids.

Also Nikon have recently released an 18.5mm 1.8 (50mm equivalent with the crazy 2.7 crop factor).

 

[paulfish4570]

i think 1.5 crop factor is as far as i want to go from full frame.

 

[kxl]

Start with the lenses. If you would like to use ALL of those lenses, then you can count out the DSLR's and instead "focus" on the NEX or Fuji or other bodies that will take adapters to mount all kinds of lenses.

Myself, I pre-ordered a NEX6 since it seemed to best fit my needs. Others like the Ricoh or the Fuji. They're all good.

However, if you think that just using your Nikon lenses would suffice, I would recommend the Nikon D7000 (if your budget allows). Manual focusing should be easy; if not, you can install a Katzeye focusing screen (I had installed one on my D200 when I had it, and the screen made a HUGE difference for manual focusing).

The D7000 would then allow you to take adavantage of a whole slew of AI/AIS lenses... yeah, I know, unleash the GAS. 😀

 

[splitimageview]

The tough part about adapting lenses to cameras with OVFs is they are not always focus accurate (the green dot on nikons helps little.) Focusing screens are designed for AF, not MF. One can spend a lot of time going nowhere on these kludges...I've done it. 🙂

For that reason, EVF is the way to go for adapted lenses. Focusing at the sensor gets rid of all the uncertainty and unfocused images. 🙂

The latest NEX models have phase detect AF so shooting fast moving kids should not be a problem. For adapted lenses, focus peaking works great. Flip LCD. Lots to like. I've owned a 5 for a couple of years and use it every day. Owned a 7 which has a great sensor, but sold it to get a 6.

The latest Fuji firmware has greatly improved AF, but there is no focus peaking on the Fujis (yet.)

Lastly, the in body stabilization on the OMD is fantastic, if that is important. Works on adapted lenses. Can't do this with Sony or Fuji but you do go back to 2x crop.

 

[Ezzie]

To be perfectly honest with you. An X-E1, as much as I like it, will not do what you ask. It may be able to mount all your lenses, but the EVF manual focusing is not up to the task of moving children, unless of course you zone focus. For a more studious use, fine. For action not.

 

[GaryLH]

APS c sensor options

APS c sensor options

Paul

I came away w/ the following interpretation of the info -
- x100 too slow for the grand kids
- - don't like to use full auto af mode on x100 (would be fastest)
- - don't like to use zone focus or pre-focus to a spot?
- focus faster w/ old manual film camera then x100 in this situation

Xp1/xe1 in full af is going to be a hair faster. 28mm equiv currently fastest combo af wise. Manual focus w/ Fuji lenses much better than x100, but still does not quite have feel of real manual lenses. All your lenses w/ adapter can work on the xp1/xe1 body. Manual focus w/ mag assist if required. 3x and 10 x. No AA filter, best high iso support. People have reported a shimmering effect on edges when things are in focus in evf but I don't have good enough eyes to c it. Xe1 has advantage of built in diopter support

Nothing is as fast as a dslr such as Canon or Nikon in full af mode. Try a d3100, 5100, or 7000 from Nikon w/ 35 1.8 afs lens. Dslr flange distance too great for adapter usage of rf lenses. Menus can be very confusing at first if u have never used dslr. AA filter and next best in terms of iso.

Ricoh gxr w/ a12 m module option. Mf only, focus peaking and multiple level of mag support if required, customizable lens info support including distortion, aberrations, etc. there are Nikon ais to m adapters out there for your ais lenses. One of the few cameras out there w/ both normal and electronic shutter. Absolutely dead quiet in electronic shutter mode. Needs a external evf otherwise rear LCD only. No AA filter and not as good as others in terms of high iso. The absolute bet solution outside of drf for using rf lenses, especially wide angle ones.

Nex5n/nex6 second fastest to dslr in terms of af focus speed. Native lenses are not as good as Fuji in terms of iq, not as rich as Nikon in terms of breadth. Best af lenses currently are Zeiss 24, Sigma 30 and 19. Sony has some new lenses coming out which they hope will make more serious photographers happy, such as the 35f1.8. All your lenses can be adapted to the Sony. Focus peeking and mag support as required but no lens correction like the Ricoh or Fuji. Like the gxr, 5n needs an external evf. Worst thing about Sony is the UI compared to other cameras except maybe dslr.. specifically on the 5n is the placement of video button and that it cannot be disabled, unlike new nex6. I hate that video button so much that I did the so call hillbilly solution, used the new air cured rubber compound and made a surround barrier around it. I lost way too many shoots due to accidentally engaging movie mode. U need to disable, wait for the movie to write to sd card before u can take that picture. New nex6 allows for this botton to be disabled. Nex6 may have faster af then any other Nex due to new sensor which has both contrast and phase af support, only time will tell. Canon eos-m has similar sensor design and reports are coming in about slow af performance. Not sure if fw updated will help if this ends up an issue w/ nex6. Sony has got the best video capability and maybe the best universal digital back for legacy lenses. AA filter and as good as dslr in terms of high iso for 5n. Not sure in terms of nex6 yet. Nex5 does not have normal hot shoe. Nex6 first to have it.

As others have said, best to handle them yourself, especially if u can rent for at least a couple of days. All tricks u learned on x100 will almost all apply to xp1/xe1.

Gary

 

[aleksanderpolo]

Paul, I have the GXR and GF1. The GXR with focus assist mode 2 (much better than mode 1, which is equivalent to NEX's focus peaking) will probably give you the fastest manual focus speed and accuracy outside of real RF. However, for small kids (I have two), it will still not be fast enough. So I suggest you look into OMD + Panny 25/1.4 if you want it small, or it will be DSLR if you really need the speed.

The X35/1.4, while nice, would probably focus as fast as the Panny 20/1.7, which is the slowest AF lens in m4/3 land and totally not adequate for small kids in my experience.

Best wishes.

 

[paulfish4570]

my new daughter-in-law has a NEX-5n but no EVF. how much do NEX adapters run? depending on cost, i might buy a nikon ais adapter just to try it out with lcd ...

 

[paulfish4570]

getting some wonderful advice so far ...

 

[GaryLH]

my new daughter-in-law has a NEX-5n but no EVF. how much do NEX adapters run? depending on cost, i might buy a nikon ais adapter just to try it out with lcd ...

Anywhere from 29 to 59 for most of the third party stuff. The best are over 150.

Gary

 

[willie_901]

Paul,

For the situation you described, why not just use the AF-S mode with the X100? After all, pressing the AFL/AEL button is using the AF system anyway.

I always prefer manual focus mode with my X100 and XP-1. But the OVF in AF-S mode should yield more keepers than the OVF mode in M focus mode. The same is true for the EVF except the EVF let's you control the focus-region size which can help too.

No doubt the X100 is not the best camera for people in motion.

Do you use the audible focs confirmation beep? This can be helpful, but it won't tell you if the focus point is where you want it to be.

Some people claim AF-C works best for moving children, but I have no experience to share. I do know AF-C mode uses more power.

I know you asked specifically about MF digital camera options. I am compelled to mention a used D300 is currently the least expensive, best AF camera I have used for moving children. A nice used body and the old 50/1.8 AF lens should be less than $700. There are numerous tutorials on line that describe exactly how to select the AF menu parameters for moving subjects. Honestly the AF performance is amazing. In burst mode it will adjust focus on moving subjects in between shutter cycles. It wil lock on to a subject and follow it changing ocus as it moves.

 

[dnk512]

Original question was about *manual-focus* on digital.

Yes, lots of very capable AF cameras. But, with manual lenses on a digital body the options go down a bit.

I tried 4/3 E410 with a katz eye screen and was OK for manual focus. I suspect E3 or E5 will be better. Even better would be a Canon 5D or any other full frame DSLR.

Currently I have settled for the Nex5n. With the viewfinder and focus peaking I can shoot with Nikkors youth soccer with as good or better success than my wife's canon AF DSLR.

One heads up, you will need to be using fairly fast lenses and mostly open during focus.

 

[ColSebastianMoran]

... but the EVF manual focusing is not up to the task of moving children, unless of course you zone focus.

Is any EVF up to the task of moving children? I'm shooting kids with a good DSLR (Nikon D300) on autofocus and it's still difficult sometimes.

Paul, if you are intent on shooting with manual focus, then all the old tricks are still important: the right focusing screen or RF patch and good old direct hand-on-helicoid focusing, not "fly by wire" focusing. No wait-for-EVF-to-update.