I'm getting straight messages about film been alive.

[fleetwoodjazz]

I'm very sceptical for film been alive in Canada. Despite film interest increase in USA and Vietnam I see for real in reports from RFF members, I see nothing optimistic about Canada. I'm the only film shooter most of the time I ever go locally.

In previous years I gave our kids film P&S and it was not in use for months.

But... Earlier this year son of our neighbor borrowed my exposure meter and took some film to practice with his family Zenit. We have it developed few times already. He is slow but steady. Just like we were back then.
But he is constantly taking it OOF... I can't blame him, I have used this Zenit before and focusing was a challenge. I barely finished one film with it and returned it. It is really bad comparing to Kiev-19 focusing.

And all of the sudden one of our daughters asked for film camera. She finished one roll within one week and second one already loaded.
Looking how she does it - nothing beats old AF fixed lens auto exposures cameras with flash. They aren't bulky and using AA batteries. Next to it is plastic SLR with some compact prime. It has to be as simple as possible, including film load, rewind and rewind back. Last plastic SLR like EOS series are perfect for it. Nikon, Kiev SLRs I used to have were probably OK as well, but I let them all go, because I didn't used it. Good news our EOS300 is working and they are not expensive cameras to get at all. YN in EF mount primes are also very affordable.

With my mechanical Leica, Bessa and FSU RF gear I feel disconnected.
I don't think my kids will be able to deal with RF or scale focus and manual exposure. In my teenage years I was only good with RF focusing...

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/the-rise-of-film-photography-1.4757070

 

[semi-ambivalent]

Thanks, the lens does have nice bokeh. Possibly a hint of soap bubble bokeh on the one pic.

Don't bring in things that don't matter. Content matters, not technological speculation about content. Technology has nothing to do with content.

They're lovely pics. Full stop. Or, to paraphrase Dale Carnegie, take the complement and shut up. 😉

 

[Skiff]

T2 prices skyrocketted after that... I'm at a crossroads when it comes to celebrities like the jenner's. I have a hard time believing that their use of film is genuine and not because its in fashion.

Well, we don't know whether she is really into film in the long term, or just for a short time because of fashion. Time will tell.

In the end, it is not so important.
Because she inspires other young people also to get into it. Lots of them will probably only try it and then give it up. But probably also lots of young photographers will try it, like it and keep using it. And these will have a long term positive effect on film photography.
By the way, Kendall Jenner's photos (made by her as a photographer) are quite good.
Here is the Jimmy Fallon talk show in which she takes shots with her Contax T2:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0PRFAh602kU

 

[Archlich]

That film photography today is a niche market and on a much lower sales level than 20 years ago is of course right.
Everyone knows it.
But it is also completely irrelevant for the future of film!!
We only need about 2 million enthusiast film photographers worldwide in the long term for a very good and sustainable future of film.
Enthusiasts who shoot - on average - about 25 - 30 rolls of film p.a..
Makes 50-60 million films in total. That is more than today and enough to keep Kodak, Fujifilm, Ilford, Foma, Adox and Film Ferrania profitable and in business!
Currently about 3 - 3.5 billion people worldwide are taking photos. In 20 years it will be probably 5-6 billion worldwide.
So if then only 0.03% are shooting film, it is more than enough to keep film alive and kicking.
It is negligible and a tiny market in relative terms in comparison to digital imaging.
But for itself and in total it is a big and attractive global market. And that is all what film shooters need.
That 99.97% of all others use smartphones and digital cameras is totally irrelevant for film shooters.

Film can be extremely well as a niche market!

It's all good except, we have to rely on an aging supply of film cameras for this future. Few new ones are still in production, and they are either incompetent or expensive.

I'm not saying the current flow of gears couldn't last another 100 years or so. It's just an impression: film photography has a future, but it's not a thing of the future. It has to rely on nostalgia to survive. The further we are down the road, the deeper we'd dive into the past...

What kind of "tomorrow" is that?

 

[David Hughes]

I was in a well known tourist spot a few days ago and by 7 pm had counted 7 digital cameras, thousands of smart phones and just one old git with a long beard using an Olympus µ-I. (That reminds me, I must up-date my avatar.)

FWIW, I also had a digital and my wife had her 'phone and so I tried using all three for several shots. I'll try and sort out some for comparison but so far the 'phone vs. compact pictures seem identical. Both were good for easy shots and so-so for difficult shots without a bit of thinking.

And I wondered how many 'phone users have noticed the "Settings" icon on the built in cameras...

Regards, David

 

[Skiff]

It's all good except, we have to rely on an aging supply of film cameras for this future. Few new ones are still in production, and they are either incompetent or expensive.

I'm not saying the current flow of gears couldn't last another 100 years or so. It's just an impression: film photography has a future, but it's not a thing of the future. It has to cater on nostalgia to survive. The further we are down the road, the deeper we'd dive into the past...

What kind of "tomorrow" is that?

Look at the Vinyl revival: Today almost more different new turntable models are produced than in the former times. Even new, innovative companies for turntable manufacturing were founded.
Or look at instant cameras. The demand is booming, both Polaroid and especially Fujifilm are producing new cameras. Fujifilm alone has produced more than 7 million Instax cameras in their last fiscal year (that is almost double of the whole DSLM camera production of 2017).
So a clear indication that if demand is there and increasing, new cameras will be produced.

The market for standard film cameras (35mm, 120, LF) is still flooded with an oversupply of good used cameras.
When this oversupply is drying up used camera prices will significantly increase. The higher the price for used cameras, the more attractive the market will become for manufacturers to make new cameras.
The same scenario we have had with mechanical watches and turntables.

Digital camera production has reached a new all-time low in the first half of 2018. And this trend will probably continue for quite some time. The camera manufacturers are producing today only about half (!) of the amount they have produced in the film era at the end of the 90ies.
So with an ongoing film revival and increasing prices for used film cameras, in the coming years the film camera market will be again attractive for camera manufacturers.
We will see new film cameras in the future.

 

[Ko.Fe.]

"It is great and going to be better in future. Long and energetic applauds". Quote from newspaper "Pravda".

I see as many Polariod users as film users. In fact I never seen Polariod users in action.

 

[Skiff]

I see as many Polariod users as film users. In fact I never seen Polariod users in action.

What you see or don't see is completely irrelevant.
Relevant is only that millions of photographers worldwide like instant film photography, buy new cameras and use instant film regularly. Both Polaroid and Fujifilm.

Since 2004 Fujifilm has increasing demand for Instax (they have published that data some time ago). A growth trend for 14 years.
Polaroid also has increasing demand since their start as Impossible eight years ago.
Both invest millions in new films and cameras.
Simply because their is a huge demand for that.
Whether you or me using it, or see using other doesn't matter at all. There are millions of photographers out there globally who are using it.

 

[Ko.Fe.]

Polaroid has some popularity among hipsters. They buy one pack and brag about it for years.
Instax has nothing to do with film photography this thread is about.
Actually, Instax is not about photography. It is conusmerism.
Ma, I want camera. Ma goes to the store and only affordable camera is instax.
Ma, I want camera question is asked in millions every year. Because it is growing population. So, ma I want camera scenario repeated for some years now.
Instax purchased, few packs and then it is collecting dust. Who wants to pay one back per crappy, soft and tiny image regularly. Instax is not photography it is popular toy.
Developing film and enlarging is photography. All photography courses I know ditched film and trashed enlargers.
Including Raerson in Toronto.

 

[Skiff]

Actually, Instax is not about photography. It is conusmerism.

That is just your personal opinion. And bashing Instax in general just shows your prejudices concerning a certain group of photographers.
I know lots of real, enthusiast photographers who like this medium and use it seriously (me included). I've seen lots of excellent Instax shots. Lots of professionals use it too. For example on weddings.

Developing film and enlarging is photography. All photography courses I know ditched film and trashed enlargers.
Including Raerson in Toronto.

1. No one stops you from developing your film and make enlargements in your darkroom. I do and enjoy that, too.
2. Lots of photographers here in that thread have given you lots of information about the current, very active film photography scene. In Canada and worldwide. They wanted to help you.
But sadly you ignore all that.
3. You want photography courses in Toronto? Stop crying, become active and offer them!
Become part of the solution, like so many other photographers have done worldwide.
Stop being some of this old grumpy men who are always only complaining .......

 

[Ko.Fe.]

Sorry, but each of us has his tune here. Yours is mix of "we will build communism by 1967" and hipsteria.

 

[Skiff]

Sorry, but each of us has his tune here. Yours is mix of "we will build communism by 1967" and hipsteria.

Kodak, Fujifilm, Ilford, Foma, Adox, Film Ferrania, Polaroid, Jobo, Intrepid, Chamonix, Mint, Heiland, Kienzle, Chroma, Reflex, Standard, ars-imago, The Darkroom, Richard, Camera Rescue, Click&Surr, Fstopcameras, Filmomat and lots of further companies are investing in new products, production capacities and / or services because they see increasing interest in film photography.

But for you that is all communism and hypsteria.....🙄

 

[HHPhoto]

For the Canadians here:
Quote from Bob Carnie ( http://www.alternativephotoservices.com/ ) on photrio:
"Spoiler Alert for Canadian Photographers using BW film.

A brand new Hostert Dip and Dunk process machine is going to start up in Toronto to process BW Film
I will post more details as they come but all indications that this will be a great process line to Mail in your film."

Hostert is a German manufacturer of film and paper processing machines. They are producing these machines for decades.

Cheers, Jan

 

[Ko.Fe.]

🙄
Halton Camera Exchange. They have darkroom and will develop BW film. It is available for years. But nobody needs it where they are...

Kodak, Fujifilm, Ilford, Foma, Adox, Film Ferrania, Polaroid, Jobo, Intrepid, Chamonix, Mint, Heiland, Kienzle, Chroma, Reflex, Standard, ars-imago, The Darkroom, Richard, Camera Rescue, Click&Surr, Fstopcameras, Filmomat and lots of further companies are investing in new products, production capacities and / or services because they see increasing interest in film photography.

But for you that is all communism and hypsteria.....🙄

https://rangefinderforum.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2828073&postcount=20
Do you read your own thread?

Kodak is next to Kaput and FujiFilm is cutting films, not making new ones for years. (Please do not push Fuji BW film "news", read about it first).

Ferrania is BS, if you read ex-APUG fifty and then twenty pages threads it is obvious what this is nothing but SNAFU.

Reflex is Konost. Bunch of kids with diplomas who new nothing about manufacturing.

I'm not saying here is nothing happening. But then someone like you is mixing some small startups with no go or near bankrupt companies and pushing it as something big, this where communists and propaganda starts. I lived through it, I could smell it from thousands of miles.

As realist I count only available products. Available means - I go online press buy button and it is delivered as regular item. With week or two.
Or it is made per order, but it is available. Like Interpid.

So, then we cut not available products from your list it might become very short.

"Investing" doesn't mean anything.
If you are not aware where are many private startups everywhere.
9 of 10 of them are not succeeding.

This is why I can't take start ups for real. Unfortunately, for now it is the way. Most will collect money, make something primitive and go away quick.

 

[BLKRCAT]

Im confused, are you for the future of film or against it?

Being someone that shoots a lot of film I would expect them to be more positive of the future of medium that they enjoy making images with.

I think I've came full circle. Halton Camera Exchange, no one needs it. Well in the suburbs I would assume so. I don't think that the demographic that would use film would be there.

I think that the reason you don't think film is alive is because you are no nowhere near the pulse.

 

[Ko.Fe.]

Im confused, are you for the future of film or against it?

Being someone that shoots a lot of film I would expect them to be more positive of the future of medium that they enjoy making images with.

I think I've came full circle. Halton Camera Exchange, no one needs it. Well in the suburbs I would assume so. I don't think that the demographic that would use film would be there.

I think that the reason you don't think film is alive is because you are no nowhere near the pulse.

I'm realistic. This is it. As person who was educated to rely of facts and critical analysis of them.
It has nothing to do with demographics. If you check, Toronto is not growing as fast as suburbs. It is suburbs where families with children are moving from Toronto and it is stable and long term trend.
Where is big high school beside Halton Camera Exchange. Kids walking by this shop every day.
Where I'm they are building new schools every year and most of them have dozen of portables beside.
It is not demographics. It is something else. It is something related to crowded cities. It might have something to be more individual just to show up in the crowd or backslash against of uber and uber food.

Talking about future. How many young people you have introduced to film? Did you give your gear and film to teenagers? Did you teached them to develop and print?
I did it for three so far. Where I'm. This is how we are doing it here.

 

[BLKRCAT]

I think there's something to be said for being on the pulse. Seeing first hand the resurgence of film I'm much more positive about the future of film photography than you are. I don't blame you though, you don't see the lines of people dropping off and picking up film from downtown camera, you don't see the film cameras on the street. If you are just reading articles and analyzing data then you will definitely have a different opinion. Speaking of which what articles are you reading? Your OP says that film photography interest raised in the US and Vietnam? Why only them?

Also doing some searching and reading some articles of my own I can't seem to find any articles about millenials moving to the suburbs, but rather millenials flocking to the city. Just about everyone I see shooting film fits in that millenial demographic. You haven't thought that maybe they leave the suburbs to come to the city to live the trendy life?

I've given away film and cameras, taught people how to develop film. I'm a go to person in my circles to ask about cameras and film photography so i'm also referring people a lot. I do what I can to help get film and cameras into the hands of others.

 

[Ko.Fe.]

It took me like 10 seconds.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/toronto-suburbs-growth-rates-census-1.3972405
Was it you who mentioned some people moving out from Toronto to Hamilton?
https://www.theguardian.com/society...g-suburbs-america-housing-crisis-urban-exodus
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/glo...search-of-affordable-housing/article30273404/

Toronto has lost the highest number of young people since 1999-2000 and Vancouver has lost the most since the Great Recession, according to Statscan’s latest intraprovincial migration data.

https://toronto.citynews.ca/2015/09...oo-pricey-looking-to-the-suburbs-study-shows/

But it is good we are in the same pattern on film.

 

[Ko.Fe.]

BWT. This guy from Milton http://www.alexluyckx.com/about.html
is Canadian Correspondent for the Film Photography Podcast. I never seen him in Milton with film camera at any local event 🙂.

 

[BLKRCAT]

Straight from your article

Downtown Toronto still a hot-spot
While the suburbs are growing, there are also plenty of spots within already-dense Toronto experiencing population growth too.

In a map of census tracts developed by Statistics Canada, it's clear that a significant chunk of the downtown core — particularly the condo-heavy stretch along the waterfront — is a hot spot for population growth.

Just because milton grew 31% doesn't mean its a mass exodus from the city. Miltons population increased by 27,000 people from 2011 to 2016. The 5% increase in Toronto is 160,000 people from 2011 to 2016.

Also I can't find the quote about toronto losing the highest number of young people. It's not in any of the links you pasted.