Leica LTM Leica IIIC K - share info and questions

Leica M39 screw mount bodies/lenses
I hate to say... but I told you so.

5+ hours to go and it spurted to almost 1K already. And because of that, we will probably see this camera's price to double at auctions end, mark my words.

We will ofcourse never know, but I'm thinking this will be shipped to HongKong and find it's way to a new-money, wealthy collector in China.
 
seifadiaz said:
...and its gone for 2,20x.xx. I wonder if any RFF'er won it.
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I doubt it..........that's WAAAAAYYYY OVERPRICED for it's condition, but sadly this is the way the cookie crumbles :(

I never expected it to go over $2k let alone over $1.5k these cameras have finally proven their value, anything even close to mint now and having any known Military history will be costing well over $5k, it's a shame that most of these cameras will remain outside the reach of real photographers.

The only way one can afford one is to find it OFF of the internet, keep a camera away from the net and evilbay you have a good deal....

Tom
 
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The saddest part about all this is there is absolutely no way it will ever be taking another photo. It won't get the CLA it needed and it will just sit in someone's cupboard for the next 25 years.
 
With prices like this on the internet it will be increasingly difficult to find one offline. One needs to be connected to veterans or their families, I suppose. I'll 'make-do' with that restored IIIc Stepper I'll be getting shortly.
 
john neal said:
At least it makes my restoration feel more worthwhile :D
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Yes, getting anything together thats "survived" to work with and shoot photos with is an accomplishment, John I can't wait till yours is done.

I'm really surprised at that camera and what it did......I have seen far RARER cameras sell for less on ebay, I suppose it was just who saw it and all the attention it got being the only one at auction on there now......

Tom
 
buzzardkid said:
With prices like this on the internet it will be increasingly difficult to find one offline. One needs to be connected to veterans or their families, I suppose. I'll 'make-do' with that restored IIIc Stepper I'll be getting shortly.
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How's that camera coming along at Youxin's Johan?

I have the "Sharkskin" IIIC K back and it's transport is butter smooth, I haven't shot anyone with it yet, but hopefully soon I'll be able to get a photoshoot going and I will post some results. :)

Tom
 
LeicaTom said:
How's that camera coming along at Youxin's Johan?

I have the "Sharkskin" IIIC K back and it's transport is butter smooth, I haven't shot anyone with it yet, but hopefully soon I'll be able to get a photoshoot going and I will post some results. :)

Tom
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Tom,

It's in the mail, it left the States and I think it's in NL customs now. I'm hoping they step on it, hoping for an ETA before X-mas. I'm living next to the mail box, crackers at hand :p

Youxin mailed me it got real nice and I reckon that when a man like him says so, it'll be REALLY nice :):rolleyes::):rolleyes:

The 1943 Sonnars are jumping up and down with excitement too! The correct lyre-shaped VIOOH also is ready to roll.

I'll post about it as soon as it checks in. Hope to take it out for a spin over the holidays!
 
gray iiic k

gray iiic k

for the auction to go to $2200 there had to be two bidders willing to go to that figure .
military cameras always go higher than standard issue ones .
in this case the seller listed the delivery as us army , early 1945 post surrender .
so in spite of the well used state ( most wartime military cameras show quite a bit of wear ) they were an item of field equiptment , not a future collectable , or the holy grail of photography .
well i have overstated here , so put in my 4 cents . and quiet now .
 
Al, you're breaking our toy!

:p

Ah well, there'll be others to drool and speculate over, and that's part of the fun, right?
 
Don't worry! I'll make sure there's a few more.......now where's my bucket of RLM 75 paint and a large camelhair brush? :D

LOL!!!!!

Tom
 
I don't know, it tickles me in a way to see other people spend that kind of money on rare subtypes. I've got my little IIIf red dial with a very nice Summitar and I do the majority of my shooting with it. It set me back a couple of hundred dollars total. These two extremes for the same basic thing are always fun to contemplate.

If I found something like the recent battered K at the proverbial garage sale, I wouldn't have a clue what it was. If I could afford it, I'd probably buy it and shoot it in blissful ignorance. ;)

Thank you for the illuminating thread, folks!
 
I find I have a connection with the IIIC K that was sold on ebay: The seller was also offering an Elmar 50/2.8 (LTM), which I bought. And he tells me that he used it with the IIIC K. Does that make my lens more valuable? :)
 
ChrisN said:
I find I have a connection with the IIIC K that was sold on ebay: The seller was also offering an Elmar 50/2.8 (LTM), which I bought. And he tells me that he used it with the IIIC K. Does that make my lens more valuable? :)
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LOL!!!!!!!! :D

Tom
 
I'm quite surprised at the way things look now....I've been following these cameras for over 20 years , but have just seriously started collecting them/working with them in the past 3 years.

Prices have been stable, it's just in the past 8 months that prices have all but tripled on most of these, even the WW2 Nazi German engraved cameras were somewhat affordable between collectors, now prices are sort of "out of control" due to the fact that there's really not many of these being found/offered in the open market like they once were anymore.........

I think that prices are going to stay high now, despite there only being a handful of serious collectors for these things, most dealers and sellers now are wise to what they are worth and finding them in old Army foot lockers and estates for $250 or less is all but a thing of the past.
(JFTR - I've myself have never bought a Grey Paint K camera for less than $1,700, so they have never been a so-called bargain for me.) ;)
*Someone has to remind me to tell of the story about the folks from a German private estate who almost THREW OUT! a 1944 W.H. engraved IIIC K and Matching Numbers/Engraved lens*

The Generation most involved with these cameras as they were new is dwindling away fast.....most of the amazing finds have already been found and the only way anything of importance comes about anymore is with the passing away of some of the ORIGINAL Leica Collectors -
*a select group of people saw the light and imagined the potential financial investment toward the end of the 1950's and started scooping up deals and also buying new and keeping it un-used*
(that's the one reason why there's so many mint boxed Leica IIIG's out there and also mint surviving Black paint MP's and M3's).

The days of finding deals on the WW2 era Leica equipment are almost over, mind you there's still something out there.......but, the NEXT Leica collectors phase will be after TOP NOTCH late 1950's to mid 1960's stuff, in the next 10 years alot of choice collectible Late Leica LTM (IIIG) and Leica M stuff will see the lime-light ~ Stay Tuned!

Keep Searchin' There's Gold out there Someplace.......!

Tom
 
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LeicaTom said:
Don't worry! I'll make sure there's a few more.......now where's my bucket of RLM 75 paint and a large camelhair brush? :D

LOL!!!!!

Tom
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Tom - I just got back from seeing the inlaws and it was good in a roundabout way as I could forget about the recent price that rat chewed wasted looking pardon my pun) gray IIIc-K went for on ebay. I remember at the start of the auction that you would be surprised if it went over $1000 - that was also my limit of a proposed bid. However, I was shocked to see it go over $2000!

So my questions are in multiples (only if you have time) as I am still curious about the market for these cameras. Why did you think that camera would only get half of its final value? What factors in the market have changed over the last few months for these cameras? Also, are the chrome K's cheaper and easier to procure than the gray K's? The reason that I also ask is you mentioned a paint type above. Do you think that some chrome K's may be 'doctored' with paint to increase their value? Is that what you were impling you would do, or were you joking?

jaans
 
LeicaTom said:
*a select group of people saw the light and imagined the potential financial investment toward the end of the 1950's and started scooping up deals and also buying new and keeping it un-used*
(that's the one reason why there's so many mint boxed Leica IIIG's out there and also mint surviving Black paint MP's and M3's).
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However, it's another question whether this was any investment worth speaking of. A near mint Leica IIIg body, in box, no lens, nowadays sells for 900 to 1000 USD (see e.g. 250740249833 on eBay). According to the consumer price index, this corresponds to a price of $127.40 in 1957.

I'm pretty sure the IIIg cost more than $127 new. Not much of a financial investment here, it doesn't even cover inflation. And that's one of Leica's rarer, more desirable models.

In other words, cameras as an investment strategy may make sense in the short run, betting on price hikes and the like; but in the long run, it seems to have been a bit like the lottery. A few people lucked out - you mention black M3s and so on - but for most, even for other cameras considered collectibles today, it appears to have been a losing proposition.
 
rxmd said:
However, it's another question whether this was any investment worth speaking of. A near mint Leica IIIg body, in box, no lens, nowadays sells for 900 to 1000 USD (see e.g. 250740249833 on eBay). According to the consumer price index, this corresponds to a price of $127.40 in 1957.

I'm pretty sure the IIIg cost more than $127 new. Not much of a financial investment here, it doesn't even cover inflation. And that's one of Leica's rarer, more desirable models.

In other words, cameras as an investment strategy may make sense in the short run, betting on price hikes and the like; but in the long run, it seems to have been a bit like the lottery. A few people lucked out - you mention black M3s and so on - but for most, even for other cameras considered collectibles today, it appears to have been a losing proposition.
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I disagree, the market goes back and forth due to the economy, but I'm pretty sure that the mint boxed matching numbers IIIG /Leicavit/ Elmar f2.8/50 combo with Leicavit case I sold in 1992 in Germany for $4,500 was a sound investment, the market now outside of these IIIC K Grey's is looking dull for many vintage Leica products, but this is not the first slump in collectible camera sales, it will all snap back as soon as the economy starts to pick up again worldwide......

Well, let's get the ball rolling here with some fresh photos, let's see some Grey K shutter cameras from some OTHER RFF members!!!!!

Tom
 
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