leicashot
Well-known
The module is official and is coming
Leica X1 or Ricoh GXR
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The module is official and is coming
A 35mm module is official?
Matus
Well-known
I think leicashot meant the M-module.
leicashot
Well-known
Yes I mean the M-module. a 35mm module would make a GXR system perfect....or a GXR with large built in VF would surpass the X100 in a heartbeat. 28/35/50 macro in a tiny light setup.
Now only if Ricoh would redesign the lens modules so the hood protects the lens that extends out, instead of attaching to the end of it. This is a real weak point of the camera, taking away from it's robust body design.
If you drop of bang the lens while the camera is on and lens extended, it's history.
katrak
BennyBlue
I had one of the first X1's and used it almost every day...until the GXR arrived.
Out of the box the Ricoh GXR was as almost as slow as the Leica X1 in terms of AF. Then I updated the firmware (NB since March 2010 there have been 5 firmware updates for the Ricoh) which turned it into a completely different animal. Fantastic.
But what is more fantastic is the user interface (which is often said to have been actually designed for photographers by photographers - I agree) and other touches:
Every button seemingly can be customised.
Manual focussing has a depth of field gauge on the screen.
It remembers all setting including focus when turned off.
The lens has a manual focus ring.
The auto iso is vastly configurable
the 50mm macro takes filters and has a lens hood.
Rather than go on (there are dozens more), download the manual from the Ricoh website.
As for picture quality I am really hard pressed to see any quality difference between the Ricoh GXR and the Leica X1.
For now, sadly, the Leica X1 sits on the shelf – I really do hope the new fw upgrade for it at least gets it into the same ball park, speedwise as the Ricoh GXR and /or makes manual focussing more useable.
In most other aspects, I’m afraid, the Leica X1 is prehistoric. It’s also built less well (it’s been back to Leica already with stuck buttons) whereas the Ricoh GXR is like a mini Nikon D3 (which makes it heavier). It’s also a bit bigger.
One downside is that initially it has a huge number of options and settings – if you hate setting up cameras you won’t like this. But once set up, you can forget about the other options and get on with picture taking.
Out of the box the Ricoh GXR was as almost as slow as the Leica X1 in terms of AF. Then I updated the firmware (NB since March 2010 there have been 5 firmware updates for the Ricoh) which turned it into a completely different animal. Fantastic.
But what is more fantastic is the user interface (which is often said to have been actually designed for photographers by photographers - I agree) and other touches:
Every button seemingly can be customised.
Manual focussing has a depth of field gauge on the screen.
It remembers all setting including focus when turned off.
The lens has a manual focus ring.
The auto iso is vastly configurable
the 50mm macro takes filters and has a lens hood.
Rather than go on (there are dozens more), download the manual from the Ricoh website.
As for picture quality I am really hard pressed to see any quality difference between the Ricoh GXR and the Leica X1.
For now, sadly, the Leica X1 sits on the shelf – I really do hope the new fw upgrade for it at least gets it into the same ball park, speedwise as the Ricoh GXR and /or makes manual focussing more useable.
In most other aspects, I’m afraid, the Leica X1 is prehistoric. It’s also built less well (it’s been back to Leica already with stuck buttons) whereas the Ricoh GXR is like a mini Nikon D3 (which makes it heavier). It’s also a bit bigger.
One downside is that initially it has a huge number of options and settings – if you hate setting up cameras you won’t like this. But once set up, you can forget about the other options and get on with picture taking.
Matus
Well-known
- katrak -
Thank you for comments. As I mentioned in the other thread I managed to get y hands on X1 briefly and the the main points can be summarized as follows:
- body feels very light and not too strong. I would prefer metal shell and 100g more. After all - this is not a camera to put into jeans pocket anyhow.
- the control layout is very good - no complains there.
- the LCD is good enough (for me).
- Af is slow, eagerly awaited firmware update is still to come.
- size is just right
- MF focusing is not user friendly (plus the known aperture issue)
For the GRX - I am currently not ably to try one, but it does look very interesting - most users are happy about the build quality and controls (most of them). What I really miss is 35 mm lens module as that is my preferred focal length. 28 + 50 is nice, but too much bulk. In particular the 50 mm module is too large (long) for my needs.
I am currently looking for a compact camera - the X1 is closer to that definition, but I fully agree that faster AF, more sturdy "feel" of the body and more usable MF focus implementation would make it more attractive.
Thank you for comments. As I mentioned in the other thread I managed to get y hands on X1 briefly and the the main points can be summarized as follows:
- body feels very light and not too strong. I would prefer metal shell and 100g more. After all - this is not a camera to put into jeans pocket anyhow.
- the control layout is very good - no complains there.
- the LCD is good enough (for me).
- Af is slow, eagerly awaited firmware update is still to come.
- size is just right
- MF focusing is not user friendly (plus the known aperture issue)
For the GRX - I am currently not ably to try one, but it does look very interesting - most users are happy about the build quality and controls (most of them). What I really miss is 35 mm lens module as that is my preferred focal length. 28 + 50 is nice, but too much bulk. In particular the 50 mm module is too large (long) for my needs.
I am currently looking for a compact camera - the X1 is closer to that definition, but I fully agree that faster AF, more sturdy "feel" of the body and more usable MF focus implementation would make it more attractive.
Matus
Well-known
Just commenting on y own post 🙂
Sean has just posted a review of the beta version of the new firmware for Leica X1 - and it looks really positive with many of the issues being addressed and some clever features added. For me this means that the X1 remains in the game for the time being.
Still, getting my hands on GXR will be essential to decide.
urban_alchemist
Well-known
I just sold my GXR. I've long been a Ricoh fan - GR1s, GRD I, II and III all passed through my hands.
I never really clicked with the GXR though. It seemed too complicated for its own good; the size was too large; the 50mm was sluggish as hell - to the point of being unusable in AF (though the image quality was excellent); irritating lapses (like the time-lapse that would keep the camera running all the time, thus giving the process a time-limit of 3 hours); an EVF that, though good, was never quite as instant and clear as I wanted or expected.
Also, the M-mount really doesn't interest me. I have an M9 and once you put on a bulky M lense, there's really not much in it as far as portability is concerned...
I have just sold it and should have a Fuji X100 waiting for me when I return from honeymoon next week. I know it is a less versatile camera, but as much as I continue to love Ricoh, we just didn't gell...
I never really clicked with the GXR though. It seemed too complicated for its own good; the size was too large; the 50mm was sluggish as hell - to the point of being unusable in AF (though the image quality was excellent); irritating lapses (like the time-lapse that would keep the camera running all the time, thus giving the process a time-limit of 3 hours); an EVF that, though good, was never quite as instant and clear as I wanted or expected.
Also, the M-mount really doesn't interest me. I have an M9 and once you put on a bulky M lense, there's really not much in it as far as portability is concerned...
I have just sold it and should have a Fuji X100 waiting for me when I return from honeymoon next week. I know it is a less versatile camera, but as much as I continue to love Ricoh, we just didn't gell...
Matus
Well-known
You find time for RFF during your honeymoon!? Your wife must be very tolerant 🙂
As far as I know the AF speed issue with the A12 modules was answered by firmware. Size, obviously, not.
Once you get the X100 - please do share how do you find that it compares to GRX.
As far as I know the AF speed issue with the A12 modules was answered by firmware. Size, obviously, not.
Once you get the X100 - please do share how do you find that it compares to GRX.
Matus
Well-known
So, my dear RFF Leica X1 owners. The new firmware is out and it promises a lot. So - please - update your little cute cameras and let the rest of us know your impression! thank you in advance 🙂
Updated comparison to Ricoh GXR would be of course great too.
Updated comparison to Ricoh GXR would be of course great too.
dogberryjr
[Pithy phrase]
robert blu
quiet photographer
Just updated ! Comments? The ones that dogberryir made ! I'll probably go out shooting tomorrow, let you know.
robert
PS the important point for the ones who manual focus is that after you switch off and switch on again the camera remember where the last focus was.
robert
PS the important point for the ones who manual focus is that after you switch off and switch on again the camera remember where the last focus was.
Matus
Well-known
Based on the content of X1 firmware thread it seems that this was indeed a successful update (even though it left some wishes unfulfilled)
I have another X1 - versus GXR question - namely the dynamic range. I have read very positive comments about the GXR, but what about the X1? How does it compare at the same ISO to Ricoh in RAW mode? Really curios ...
EDIT
I forgot to mention that I am aware of the reviews over at DPreview.com where also DR is tested. In those tests GXR shows considerably better DR - in particular in highlights. However - some early samples of X1 did show tendency to overexposure (even in M mode) so part of the small highlight headroom could be this. Still - the GXR does seem to show large DR.
What I would love to hear is your real life experience.
I have another X1 - versus GXR question - namely the dynamic range. I have read very positive comments about the GXR, but what about the X1? How does it compare at the same ISO to Ricoh in RAW mode? Really curios ...
EDIT
I forgot to mention that I am aware of the reviews over at DPreview.com where also DR is tested. In those tests GXR shows considerably better DR - in particular in highlights. However - some early samples of X1 did show tendency to overexposure (even in M mode) so part of the small highlight headroom could be this. Still - the GXR does seem to show large DR.
What I would love to hear is your real life experience.
Last edited:
leicashot
Well-known
I haven't compared side by side, but from experience whey're almost identical. They also use the same tweaked sensors.
The main difference between the two is the user interface, where the GXR wins and the lens, which is obviously different, but the Leica is sharper. Also the GXR can also be a 50mm macro lens.
Matus
Well-known
Thank you, that kind of feedback is what I am looking for.
You have summarize it exactly the way I see it - on one side one fixed lens with my favorite focal length, on the other 2 lenses (for the price of X1) with more flexibility. I have actually seen some amazing macro shots taken with the GXR. So - there is no clear winner for me - but this makes it more interesting 🙂 (there is a bit of masochism in that though)
Matus
Well-known
OK - I just came back from a business trip and I was lucky enough to visit the Fotogena shop and indeed they had the GXR on display. So I had the possibility to try X1 and GXR with the 28 mm lens module side by side.
My impressions from the GXR + 28:
- the display is very nice and fluid when you move the camera
- the AF is reasonably fast (this was bright interior)
- the build quality is just great - the camera feels very good in hand
- the digital viewfinder is on the weak side - the image was way too bright and coarse. I would either stay with LCD or get external optical viewfinder.
GXR (28mm A12) versus X1:
- X1 is lighter and bit more compact (though the difference is small)
- GXR has faster AF (the X1 had the new firmware)
- X1 has usable LCD, but 2 generations behind GXR. Is not too fluid (frame rate of sensor is 24 fps as far as I know)
- GXR feels more sturdy, although the X1 does not feel as flimsy as I described before
- GXR has lock on the main selector, the selection wheels on the X1 do not and are too easy to roate
- both camras look very good, should that matter 🙂
My current stance - if Ricoh would announce compact 35/2.5 mm lens module I would not wait any longer. The X1 is more expensive, slower - but has a nice fixed (= advantage - no lens GAS to come) lens and looks so good in black 🙂 Anyhow - I want to get my hands on X100 before taking any decisions.
I have just send a few of the full size sample shots from different cameras that are available on dpreview.com for printing as I am curios how these look on paper, but do not expect much differences (files were similar)
My impressions from the GXR + 28:
- the display is very nice and fluid when you move the camera
- the AF is reasonably fast (this was bright interior)
- the build quality is just great - the camera feels very good in hand
- the digital viewfinder is on the weak side - the image was way too bright and coarse. I would either stay with LCD or get external optical viewfinder.
GXR (28mm A12) versus X1:
- X1 is lighter and bit more compact (though the difference is small)
- GXR has faster AF (the X1 had the new firmware)
- X1 has usable LCD, but 2 generations behind GXR. Is not too fluid (frame rate of sensor is 24 fps as far as I know)
- GXR feels more sturdy, although the X1 does not feel as flimsy as I described before
- GXR has lock on the main selector, the selection wheels on the X1 do not and are too easy to roate
- both camras look very good, should that matter 🙂
My current stance - if Ricoh would announce compact 35/2.5 mm lens module I would not wait any longer. The X1 is more expensive, slower - but has a nice fixed (= advantage - no lens GAS to come) lens and looks so good in black 🙂 Anyhow - I want to get my hands on X100 before taking any decisions.
I have just send a few of the full size sample shots from different cameras that are available on dpreview.com for printing as I am curios how these look on paper, but do not expect much differences (files were similar)
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