efix
RF user by conviction
I just wrote this piece over at the TalNEX forum, but I though it might fit here at rff as well.
As an avid user of rangefinder cameras and the Leica M8 in particular, I was really excited when I first learned that the NEX-7 was going to be real. Since I first read about the new focus peaking feature in the NEX-C3 and NEX-5N cameras, I was absolutely hooked by that idea and started wondering if this might actually be the 21st century re-interpretation of rangefinder photography -- a quick, easy and reliable way to manually focus a lens.
What I love so much about rangefinder cameras is the fact that they are completely manual in operation, making the act of taking a picture more than just pointing and shooting -- it has a feeling of craftsmanship to it. A correctly calibrated rangefinder is also a highly accurate tool, giving you precise feedback about your focus point. This sensation of being actually involved in the whole process of taking a picture, combined with the outstanding image quality the Leica M8's Kodak sensor delivers, has made this camera the ultimate photographic tool for me personally.
Leica's interpretation of the digital rangefinder has one major drawback, though: it's based on a design developed for film photography, and instead of transporting the rangefinder idea into the digital age, it forces the former upon the latter. While the sensation of looking through a large and bright viewfinder such as the one of the Leica M8 is definitely a great experience, the fact that it gives you as good as zero information about the final picture can be considered a major shortcoming.
Now, before you start arguing that back in the days of film you had to wait for the film to be developed in order to see if your picture turned out as you intended it, no matter what type of camera you were using, let me say that I believe that this is actually what makes the biggest difference between digital and analog photography (apart from Polaroid and other types of instant film): the fact that you can immediately see the result. Most modern cameras that use live view technology even show a preview image that is 99% of what your final image will look like, so you can tweak your settings before taking the shot and be 99% sure that the final image will turn out the same as the preview. While this may not be as exciting as analog photography (which I also enjoy greatly), this is in my opinion what digital photography is about: immediate control.
So, to get back to where I started: the reason why I am so excited about the NEX-7 is that I feel it is finally bringing the rangefinder idea into the digital age. Design-wise, it is very close to a rangefinder camera with its optical viewfinder located top left from the lens mount, a design that I appreciate very much, plus the two large control dials on top that make it easy to change settings such as aperture, ISO, shutter speed etc. In that regard, operation-wise the NEX-7 is much more a Leica M than a NEX.
The NEX-7's electronic viewfinder features a mind-boggling resolution of more than two million pixels, which -- as I understand -- comes close in viewing sensation to Apple's retina display. Combine this with Sony's great focus peaking feature and the advantages of the digital age that I wrote about above, and you have the ideal tool for using manual lenses with full manual operation of the camera, yet with the instantaneousness and immediacy that makes digital photography so interesting.
Thus, as a fan of manual operation and of rangefinder cameras in particular, but also being a kid of the digital age, I truly have high hopes in the NEX-7 being able to deliver a similar using experience as the Leica M8, yet with the complete list of advantages modern digital cameras have to offer.
The only point where I am afraid the NEX-7 may not be able to keep up with the M8 is the image quality department. I am not talking about high ISO noise here -- we all know that the Leicas aren't great in that regard. I am talking about resolution, about colour reproduction, about the ability to make the best of the quality that M mount lenses are able of delivering. This is where the M8 (and M9) really shines -- the quality of the pictures is simply outstanding and breathtaking. And in the end, this may be the one and only reason for keeping the M8 over the NEX-7. But we'll only know once production models of the NEX-7 are readily available.
What are your thoughts?
As an avid user of rangefinder cameras and the Leica M8 in particular, I was really excited when I first learned that the NEX-7 was going to be real. Since I first read about the new focus peaking feature in the NEX-C3 and NEX-5N cameras, I was absolutely hooked by that idea and started wondering if this might actually be the 21st century re-interpretation of rangefinder photography -- a quick, easy and reliable way to manually focus a lens.
What I love so much about rangefinder cameras is the fact that they are completely manual in operation, making the act of taking a picture more than just pointing and shooting -- it has a feeling of craftsmanship to it. A correctly calibrated rangefinder is also a highly accurate tool, giving you precise feedback about your focus point. This sensation of being actually involved in the whole process of taking a picture, combined with the outstanding image quality the Leica M8's Kodak sensor delivers, has made this camera the ultimate photographic tool for me personally.
Leica's interpretation of the digital rangefinder has one major drawback, though: it's based on a design developed for film photography, and instead of transporting the rangefinder idea into the digital age, it forces the former upon the latter. While the sensation of looking through a large and bright viewfinder such as the one of the Leica M8 is definitely a great experience, the fact that it gives you as good as zero information about the final picture can be considered a major shortcoming.
Now, before you start arguing that back in the days of film you had to wait for the film to be developed in order to see if your picture turned out as you intended it, no matter what type of camera you were using, let me say that I believe that this is actually what makes the biggest difference between digital and analog photography (apart from Polaroid and other types of instant film): the fact that you can immediately see the result. Most modern cameras that use live view technology even show a preview image that is 99% of what your final image will look like, so you can tweak your settings before taking the shot and be 99% sure that the final image will turn out the same as the preview. While this may not be as exciting as analog photography (which I also enjoy greatly), this is in my opinion what digital photography is about: immediate control.
So, to get back to where I started: the reason why I am so excited about the NEX-7 is that I feel it is finally bringing the rangefinder idea into the digital age. Design-wise, it is very close to a rangefinder camera with its optical viewfinder located top left from the lens mount, a design that I appreciate very much, plus the two large control dials on top that make it easy to change settings such as aperture, ISO, shutter speed etc. In that regard, operation-wise the NEX-7 is much more a Leica M than a NEX.
The NEX-7's electronic viewfinder features a mind-boggling resolution of more than two million pixels, which -- as I understand -- comes close in viewing sensation to Apple's retina display. Combine this with Sony's great focus peaking feature and the advantages of the digital age that I wrote about above, and you have the ideal tool for using manual lenses with full manual operation of the camera, yet with the instantaneousness and immediacy that makes digital photography so interesting.
Thus, as a fan of manual operation and of rangefinder cameras in particular, but also being a kid of the digital age, I truly have high hopes in the NEX-7 being able to deliver a similar using experience as the Leica M8, yet with the complete list of advantages modern digital cameras have to offer.
The only point where I am afraid the NEX-7 may not be able to keep up with the M8 is the image quality department. I am not talking about high ISO noise here -- we all know that the Leicas aren't great in that regard. I am talking about resolution, about colour reproduction, about the ability to make the best of the quality that M mount lenses are able of delivering. This is where the M8 (and M9) really shines -- the quality of the pictures is simply outstanding and breathtaking. And in the end, this may be the one and only reason for keeping the M8 over the NEX-7. But we'll only know once production models of the NEX-7 are readily available.
What are your thoughts?
Lss
Well-known
On the other hand, the optical viewfinder gives you perfect (well, with some parallax error) information about the subject you are framing and the way it interacts with its surroundings. This, along the easy and precise focusing method, is why I like rangefinder cameras. And this is why I believe I will still prefer the user experience of the M8 over the Nex series.
The EVF is essentially a digital implementation of an SLR-type TTL viewfinder. The form factor of the camera and the lenses you can use may feel more like a rangefinder, and the manual focusing with focus peaking may provide a somewhat similar experience as rangefinder focusing, but the user experience regarding seeing and framing is completely different. This is probably preferred by some users and disliked by some others, but it is a difference.
ramosa
B&W
No question. I will stick with M8 over these alternatives. And someday move to FF digital RF. While the Nex-like options may be good for some users of Leica lenses, I am not one of them. In my eyes, although these bodies can both take Leica lenses, they are completely different animals. It's like comparing RFs to SLRs. These are all different camera types that bring with them quite different photographic experiences. I, for one, really like the RF experience.
Kevin
Rainbow Bridge
For those DRF users who are consistently challenged by rangefinder calibration issues, focus-shifting lenses, tilt when using extreme wide-angle lenses, composition and focus issues when using short telephone lenses, longish shot-to-shot times, etc, this new body from Sony could be just the ticket!
efix
RF user by conviction
Good point on the viewing experience being entirely different, Lss and ramosa. But that's exactly what I mean by Leica forcing the rangefinder concept onto the digital medium: the rf viewfinder cannot by design take advantage of the possibilities of digital photography (contrary to the Fuji X100's hybrid viewfinder). I don't say a camera has to be either this or that, and I know that the digital Ms are appreciated for exactly what they are (which is in fact why I bought the M8). I just think the NEX-7 has the nicer package of digital ease of use and immediacy combined with manual operation and accurate manual focusing. Not to spark an ideological war here ... 
N
Nikon Bob
Guest
I have always thought that a modern reincarnation of a RF like camera should not be lumbered with a mechanical RF focusing device. I think both Fuji and Sony are looking at a new way forward in their implementation of the EVF. I too am looking forward to seeing what the NEX-7 will have to offer.
Bob
Bob
It's funny how many people slag the M8/M9 as being a digital camera designed from a film camera... when that is exactly why I like it.
kshapero
South Florida Man
I have used the NEX 5n extensively and the 3 before it. If you are looking for the pure experience of photography look elsewhere (I include the 7 in this thought). The implementation is almost like a high res video game. Focus peaking, etc, It just felt gimmicky. Of course everyone is different but I really felt like I was freezing video stills. Yes the 7 offers the EVF but it is more of the same. Even the X100 with optical VF felt cluttered with info but definitely a better experience. Still to me only Leica and Epson offer digital Rangefinders which why I am here on this forum. Well actually I am mainly here because of the the film RF's.
dct
perpetual amateur
That's also my opinion. But I see no actual solution for that aspect. Maybe a new "Fuji X1000" could give us a hybrid zooming viewfinder with extended FoV compared to the real lens FoV. Than I could be back to real framing, inluding outside view to my composition approach. Which is one more piece I like on real RF cameras over SLR with max. 100 % FoV out of the lens.
jpfisher
Well-known
I view the NEX-7 as a replacement for both my aging Pentax K10D and Panasonic G2. Takes any lens via adapter, combination eye-level EVF and waist-level LCD. And with the hot shoe I can set it up for wireless strobes with my existing kit.
Not going to ditch the M8--or M3, or CL--but can definitely see the NEX-7 as the go-to for high-ISO, macro, and telephoto shooting situations.
Not going to ditch the M8--or M3, or CL--but can definitely see the NEX-7 as the go-to for high-ISO, macro, and telephoto shooting situations.
Robin Harrison
aka Harrison Cronbi
It looks like a mighty fine camera, but one single comparison turned me off the Nex-7 as a potential M8 replacement for me. See the "24mm Zeiss vs 24mm Summilux on the NEX-7" section here: http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/cameras/sony_nex_7_first_impressions.shtml
Oh wait...scrap that! Michael Reichman has just admitted this test might have been flawed. Just goes to show...don't believe one man on the internet.
Has anyone seen any other early "M mount on Nex-7" tests yet?
Oh wait...scrap that! Michael Reichman has just admitted this test might have been flawed. Just goes to show...don't believe one man on the internet.
Has anyone seen any other early "M mount on Nex-7" tests yet?
porktaco
Well-known
yeah, there's one guy over on DPReview who ran a bunch of zeiss m mounts through an nex-7. the photos are pretty awful and i can't believe that this is the image quality that is going to come out of a production camera. i've got pretty high expectations for this rig and i'm going to be disappointed if it doesn't come through. i love my RFs but i'm really sick of focus error/focus shift problems. plus some kind of assist like peaking or magnification would be great.
some of the 5N photos look absolutely tremendous but the attached-EVF and lack of the familiarly placed dials is kind of a problem for me.
some of the 5N photos look absolutely tremendous but the attached-EVF and lack of the familiarly placed dials is kind of a problem for me.
Moriturii
Well-known
I think not before long into the future, if things go like they are, Leica will stop making cameras all together becaues they have lost their innovation, and anything they introduce is always a couple of generations behind, and there is no way on earth they are making money off of their camera lines (maybe keeping the S2 pro line) and only focus on producing lenses, sort of like Carl Zeiss. I best buy a bunch of mint bodies right now.
Gabriel M.A.
My Red Dot Glows For You
I would not consider rollerblades to be a replacement to a Segway. I'd use both if I liked both, but choosing one over the other as mutually-exclusive oversimplifies both.
Out to Lunch
Ventor
What kills the Sony Nex whatever edition for me: it's a tiny piece of high-tech in your hands...
douglasf13
Well-known
If one finds rangefinders too gimmicky, there's always the option of throwing a Leica external OVF on NEX and zone focusing. I do that from time to time if I get tired of LCD/EVF.
Gid
Well-known
I'm sure lots of people will love the NEX 7. However, if you want a true digital implementation of an RF camera you can choose an RD1, M8 or M9. Anything else is just a compromise. This doesn't mean that you can't get good images with anything else, just that it will not be an RF experience. RF like is not RF.
What makes you think Leica is not making any money off its "couple of generations behind" cameras?
http://diglloyd.com/blog/2011/20110812_2-LeicaProfits.html
Teuthida
Well-known
The m8 is the first camera that has gotten me well and truly interested in digital capture. I love it, and will use it till it dies. It gives great images and feels just like my beloved m4. IMHO, any "improvement" in sensor twchnology since 2006 is marginal and irrelevant to the issue of the IQ of the m8.
That being said, Ive got a NEX 7 on order and am excited to use it.
That being said, Ive got a NEX 7 on order and am excited to use it.
bigeye
Well-known
2 years after release, the M9 still the only full-frame RF on the market and we're still waiting for someone other than Leica to separate "digital" from automatic control.
The NEX7 looks like step in the right direction. (But, Sony pretty much invented miniature push-button menu hell and it'll take me some convincing...)
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The NEX7 looks like step in the right direction. (But, Sony pretty much invented miniature push-button menu hell and it'll take me some convincing...)
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