minolta cle vs leica cl

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ywenz

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saw a great cle at the local camera shop today. absolutely loved the viewfinder.. more so than my M6 even..

since leica cl seems to be more abundant and cheaper, i want to know if the cl has the same finder as the cle?
 
The CLE has 28mm lines whereas the CL does not. Supposedly, the CLE has fewer repair problems.
 
The CLE has framelines for 28mm.
I'm currently testing out a CL for possible purchase. I'm lovin' the size and ergonomics. The shutter dial is in a great position and there is a VF indicator of which speed you have selected. Simple match-needle meter. It's louder than an M but that doesn't really matter outdoors.
It seems to be a great camera to carry in my hand as I walk to work. If the film turns out fine I'll probably get it.
 
The CL looks very "cheap" in photos. If it handles as well as the CLE did in person, I'll have to reconsider...
 
No, it's not cheap feeling, not by a long shot. I've never handled a CLE (would love to have one), but I've been very pleased with how the CL handles. The meter is its Achilles heel, but it will work fine without the meter -- replacing the electronics on the CLE, on the other hand, may prove difficult.
 
I owned both and FAR prefered the CL. The CLE is near impossible to repair these days if the electronics fail, and the shutter is electronic. CLE battery cover tended to fall off and spill the batteries. If you do get it be sure and tape the battery cover in place.
 
I've got two CLE's. Great cameras. I've held the CL, and I think it's got the better build, but not the better meter. The meter on the CL is its weak point, and as mentioned above parts for the CLE are tough to come by, but apparently the X700 series electronics work in the CLE. So buy a CLE and pick up a $30 X700 on the bay as a parts donor.

The CLE has a flip open back. Doesn't the CL have a removable back cover and spool (IIRC), so three camera pieces in your hand when changing film--I *think*. Maybe someone can confirm (?).
 
No separate spool in the CL but I've read that the tabs that hold the film in can become brittle and break. The one I am testing now is totally fine. The back does come right off to load the film, but the strap keeps it attached to the body.
You need to cock the shutter to activate the meter and have the winder unlocked (like Nikon FM2). Sometimes I have to give mine an extra jiggle to activate it, but other than that seems to work fine. Exposure so far is consistant with my Gossen Digisix.
 
yeah the CL looks pretty ridiculous when changing..

schraub_cl_offen.jpg
 
Not sure I understand why it matters what a camara looks like while the film is being changed. The CL is not cheaply made nor cheap in appearance. As for the meter being the achilles heel, while that may be true there are at least two advantages to the CL. One, the CL is a fully mechanical camera that does not need the meter or a battery to still operate. Two, the meter in the CL can be completely fixed or replaced as needed. And although it doesn't have 28mm framelines, the entire viewfinder is a decent approximation so one can still easily use a 28mm lens on it. All told, it's hard to argue with the form factor and price for an M mount camera. Gee, can you tell I have one and like it a lot?

-Randy
 
I've owned both also and far preferred the CLE. Much better VF with 28-40-90 framelines much more useful than the CL 40-50-90. The 28 lines are even visible to glasses wearers. It was my most used and favorite camera for 15 years with no problems and the battery cover never fell off.

The CL was handy because it was smaller and I like the 50 focal length. I used a separate 50 finder on the CLE, so on that basis the CL was slightly more convenient but I kept the CLE until very recently and sold the CL to the first person who asked about it after I had it about six months.
 
The meter's fine in the cl-
dead simple, a photocell, some resistors on a gold trace equipped ceramic circuit board and a battery holder. No semiconductors, all passive. Sure it's got a CDS cell, but it's nothing special. It's easier to service than an OM-1 for example- the OM uses string to move the meter for coupling, but the CL uses metal push rods..

The problem is damn foam. Once the dead teeny foam bumpers are cleaned out of the meter mech during a CLA, it's ok. This camera owes it's bad meter rep to two little bumpers of foam about 1mm square that were there to keep the needle from striking the metal stops. It turns into tar like gunge or crumbles and either makes the needle stick to either end of the travel, or bits get into the movement and make the needle not move right that way.
 
vrgard said:
Not sure I understand why it matters what a camara looks like while the film is being changed. The CL is not cheaply made nor cheap in appearance. As for the meter being the achilles heel, while that may be true there are at least two advantages to the CL. One, the CL is a fully mechanical camera that does not need the meter or a battery to still operate. Two, the meter in the CL can be completely fixed or replaced as needed. And although it doesn't have 28mm framelines, the entire viewfinder is a decent approximation so one can still easily use a 28mm lens on it. All told, it's hard to argue with the form factor and price for an M mount camera. Gee, can you tell I have one and like it a lot?

-Randy
Click to expand...

The battery dependency of the CLE isn't really a negative, because that is exactly the intent behind the design, hence the 'E.' Besides it uses commonly found batteries and is downright miserly on battery usage.

It's really an elegant design centered around a great metering system. It has a fantastic VF, an electronic cloth shutter (read: accuracy, read:M7), and ttl flash. The meter may be the most accurate meter I own (aside from the one in my D200), and the touch-sensitive meter activation combined with the internal LED shutter display is pure class. Combine the M mount with its great autoexposure mode, gorgeous veiwfinder, and the best 28/40 framelines, and it is hands down the best P&S camera around. Wasn't that the intent of the design?

I think that's why the whole removable back of the CL is an issue for me. That's not really what I want from this class of camera. The issues I have with the CLE is the lack of AE lock and no meter in manual mode. Otherwise, it's sweet.
 
Very weil-said, Ray! I haven't had a CL, but with experience with Leica M2, Bessa-T, Bessa-4, and Zeiss-Ikon, the CLE remained favorite. Now trying a Konica Hexar-RF, and I like that too, but I expect the compact innocence of the CLE will always give it an edge, especially when out with 40 & 28mm.
 
I had a CLE that I liked very much but ended selling it.
the frame lines turning it to a noncompatible camera with my other M's. I did not want to use external VF's , the summicron-c was useless on my M's and my 50's unusable on the CLE. I also hated the non-metered manual mode. But I have to say that it's a really neat camera!
I have now a CL which I like very much. It's really small and I use a collapsable 50 summicron on it which is great.
The removable back is less a pain than one may think because It's connected by the strap to the body and thus, you don't have to worry where to put it while changing film.
 
sanmich said:
I had a CLE that I liked very much but ended selling it.
the frame lines turning it to a noncompatible camera with my other M's. I did not want to use external VF's , the summicron-c was useless on my M's and my 50's unusable on the CLE. I also hated the non-metered manual mode. But I have to say that it's a really neat camera!
I have now a CL which I like very much. It's really small and I use a collapsable 50 summicron on it which is great.
The removable back is less a pain than one may think because It's connected by the strap to the body and thus, you don't have to worry where to put it while changing film.
Click to expand...

yeah, the non-metered manual mode of the CLE made me sell it. Plus the meter, though technically accurate, was an all-over averaging meter and, at least for my style of shooting, was basically useless. Agree about the good viewfinder and smooth operation but this was not enough to make me keep the camera
 
I traded a CL against a Hexar Black. They have roughly the same value when in clean condition.
 
Only had my CLEa couple of months and yes I'd like a metered manual mode but sometimes shoot with my handheld meter anyway so I'm not too bothered. Just got a CV 25mm/4P rangefinder coupled lens for it. This along with the 40mm Rokkor makes a nice lightweight travel kit.
 
RayPA said:
...as mentioned above parts for the CLE are tough to come by, but apparently the X700 series electronics work in the CLE. So buy a CLE and pick up a $30 X700 on the bay as a parts donor....
Click to expand...

Ray- could you give a little more info here? An interesting option that might make me more likely to give a CLE a try.
 
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