My Leica IIIc -- A Lost Cause?

[sircarl]

About 15 years ago, when I knew even less about photography than I do now, I started haunting antique camera shows in New York, and ended up buying a Leica IIIc, three LTM lenses, and a Leica universal finder. The camera body, it turned out, while in generally decent shape, needed repairs (mainly for a light leak) and an overhaul. These were done by Don Goldberg, and it now works fine.

But whenever I've used it, I haven't seen the kind of results I expected, and I've gradually learned a possible reason why. In my hasty examination of the lenses in the shows, they looked fine. But more recently I've looked at them under a strong light, and it's not a pretty sight. There is considerable fungus on the 35mm/f3.5 Summaron, haze and small scratches on the collapsible 50mm/f3.5 Elmar, and light haze on the 90mm/f4 Elmar (the best of the three). Cleaning hasn't helped at all.

So I'd like to ask a few questions from the IIIc/LTM owners reading this. First, are these kinds of defects normal in LTM lenses of this age, or could I have done much better? Second, will lenses with these problems cause the low contrast photos I've gotten with the camera? And finally, if they do, should I just write the camera off as a lost cause and sell the whole kit on eBay for whatever I can get, since I've read that repairing lenses with such defects, even where possible, is an expensive proposition? Maybe I'd just be better off to start all over again with something in much better shape.

Thanks in advance for whatever advice you can offer on this.

 

[FPjohn]

Worth some effort

Worth some effort

Sherry Krauter

and see this

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=28964&highlight=krauter

 

[VictorM.]

Don't feel bad, everybody buys lenses with problems. Even when they know what to look for. A less expensive alternative to cleaning your existing lenses would be to buy a couple of Russian lenses. They're cheap and, from what I've seen, good.

 

[edodo]

i will keep the IIIc if you had it clad and that all the speeds are fine and theres no light leak left. Then there are nice lenses for the ltm leitz

 

[FPjohn]

Classic kit

Classic kit

Hello:

You have an enviable classic ltm kit. CLA for all three lenses will cost about what a single modern CV 50mm would. A Russian lens or a CV will make you good to go at once.

yours
Frank

 

[VictorM.]

Another thought: if you do decide to sell, list it here first; a DAG-cla'd body will go fast and bring as much as ebay with less pain.

 

[Ash]

go for some russian glass. A Jupiter-8 or Jupiter-3 for a fast 50mm. For a Elmar clone go for the Industar 50 or Industar 22, maybe even a Fed-50 if it's cheap. Jupiter 12 for wide angle. They'll be muuuch cheaper than getting Leitz lenses, and will mean you have something good to shoot with until you sort out the other lenses.

 

[Film dino]

IIIc- a cause worth fighting for..

IIIc- a cause worth fighting for..

The IIIc is a fine platform for LTM lenses- Leitz, Canon, VC.... It'd be a shame if you disposed of the camera because of issues with the lenses you've got now.

David

 

[aad]

Of my 3 Leitz lenses, the Summarit shows the most haze/scratching/coating defects, but it still seems ok, a little soft.

The Elmar 50 and 90 are awesome, and I prefer the 50 to the CV Nokton. Neither of these lenses show any defects. The came to me that way.

 

[FrankS]

Don't throw the baby (IIIc) out with the bathwater! (fungusy/scratched lenses)

 

[Ash]

But if you wanted to unload it all cheap, I'm willing 😀 😀

 

[reagan]

I agree with what's been said. With no lenses at all, the Leica is still a keeper. A clean Industar collapsable [22 or 50] attached will provide very enjoyable results at pocket-change investment. This will at least help you determine if the Leica is for you.

 

[sircarl]

For all you saying I should hang on to the camera body -- I only thought of selling it because it would make the lenses easier to sell, since a buyer would then have a complete IIIc kit with a nice lens assortment. Otherwise, of course I would agree with you.

 

[OldNick]

Try ordering a Jupiter 12 from Fedka, and use it on the IIIc with the Universal Finder. Go out and shoot a few rolls and see if your opinion of the camera has improved. I use a J12 on my IIIf as a favorite general purpose combination. I considered the Summaron, but had heard tales of the haze problem and decided on the J12.

Jim N.

 

[Keith]

The lenses would not be hard to sell ... depending how much you want for them of course! Absolutely no point in selling the IIIc though ... a couple of hundred dollars US in the bank is no substitute for the beauty of a screwmount leica body ... even if you just sit it on the mantlepiece! 😎

 

[FPjohn]

Great P&S (see atavar)

Great P&S (see atavar)

Hello:

It cost me $200US to put a IIIb and lens kit in working order (DAG). The Snapshot Skopar seems made for it. The Elmar 50mm F3.5 is equally neat. These combinations make the M3 seem a beast in comparison.

yours
Frank

 

[FrankS]

For all you saying I should hang on to the camera body -- I only thought of selling it because it would make the lenses easier to sell, since a buyer would then have a complete IIIc kit with a nice lens assortment. Otherwise, of course I would agree with you.

Hi Carl,

Acually I think it would be easier to sell individual items rather than a full kit. For sure the seller can do better that way too.

And offer them here first, okay?

 

[John Shriver]

Those sorts of defects in the lenses aren't normal, but neither are they uncommon. There's a good chance that a proper internal cleaning by DAG will get the Summaron and 90mm Elmar in order. The front lens of collapsible Elmars can get pretty beat, there may be less hope for it. (Too many cleanings with a necktie.)

Don't expect these lenses to be as sharp or as contrasty as a typical 1970's Japanese SLR lens. But stopped down a few stops, they are fine lenses, compact and lightweight. (OK, the 90mm isn't lightweight.)

 

[PeterL]

Hi Carl,

I agree with all of the above. I bought a iiic with a Summitar 50/f2 collapsible fairly cheap on eBay, and of course, it was in need of a CLA. The slow shutter speeds didn't work at all and the lens gave extremely soft results (though I could hardly see any haze when looking through it). A good clean-up later, the camera works fine now and feels like the legendary precision machinery everybody raves about. The lens is now as people describe it: sharp when stopped down, nice and soft when wide open, i.e. perfect for portraits. I love the combo (though my iiic is very hard to focus sometimes) and I don't regret the purchase nor the CLA. Get the lenses cleaned up and enjoy your combo for a long time to come !


Peter.

 

[sircarl]

With all these words of encouragement, I've sent off an e-mail to a repair outfit called Focal Point Lens (recommended on some photo Websites), asking for an estimate to clean all three lenses. If it's within my budget, I'll ask them to tackle it. Otherwise, I'm afraid they'll have to be sold. Keeping my fingers crossed, for I do want to keep the lenses and finally see what the fuss is all about!