vincentbenoit
télémétrique argentique
Hehe... Just a bit of teasing on my part... I expected someone to pick up on it. 
Let me elaborate: The AE lock button is certainly not unusable, but it would be much more convenient to use if it were located a bit closer to the left-hand side of the camera, à la Bessa R2A/R3A. I for one found it very difficult to operate the Ikon as I would like, which is with the forefinger on the shutter button, the long finger on the shutter speed dial AND the thumb on the AE lock button, so as to have control on all the parameters simultaneously (the left hand controlling focus and aperture settings on the lens) while keeping one's eye at the viewfinder. I'm sure some people can do it (can you?) but why make it more difficult than necessary for people with smaller-than-average hands? Left-eyed shooters are even more penalised when it comes to operate the AE lock button, for obvious reasons.
I admit that these ergonomics issues are only limiting in the case of fast work, but then again for slow work in which the photographer has time to set the controls one by one, any old Zorki will do the job just as well.
Vincent
Let me elaborate: The AE lock button is certainly not unusable, but it would be much more convenient to use if it were located a bit closer to the left-hand side of the camera, à la Bessa R2A/R3A. I for one found it very difficult to operate the Ikon as I would like, which is with the forefinger on the shutter button, the long finger on the shutter speed dial AND the thumb on the AE lock button, so as to have control on all the parameters simultaneously (the left hand controlling focus and aperture settings on the lens) while keeping one's eye at the viewfinder. I'm sure some people can do it (can you?) but why make it more difficult than necessary for people with smaller-than-average hands? Left-eyed shooters are even more penalised when it comes to operate the AE lock button, for obvious reasons.
I admit that these ergonomics issues are only limiting in the case of fast work, but then again for slow work in which the photographer has time to set the controls one by one, any old Zorki will do the job just as well.
Vincent
back alley
IMAGES
i hit the ae lock buttom when the camera is aimed at the ground.
then focus & shoot.
pretty quick i think.
then focus & shoot.
pretty quick i think.
vincentbenoit
télémétrique argentique
Sure, but I was thinking more in terms of "focus and recompose" kind of shooting, with several moving targets (eh, subjects) in contrasty light. (Don't mean to make it sound like it's a video game...)back alley said:
Huck Finn
Well-known
Vincent, after trying your method, it seems that your right hand must be curled around pretty far to the front of the camera, so I can see why you'd have a problem with the ZI. Every tool requires that you adapt to ints ideosynchrasies to some extent. so, how about the long (middle) finger on the shutter release button & the forefinger on the shutter speed dial. The ZI's shutter speed dial moves pretty easily, so I was able to do this although I'd need some practice to become proficient.
As Back Alley says, however, a quick hit on the button & exposure is locked in for 20 seconds so there's really no need to have the thumb availabe to keep the AE button depressed. This is different than the R2/3A of course which requires that the button remain manually depressed to function.
It can be a problem to look at a question like this out of context. The AE lock button on the ZI is located in exactly the same position relative to the sides as is the AE lock button on the M7 - although the button on the ZI is slightly lower. Given the longer rangefinder base on these 2 cameras vs the R2/3A as well as all the additional internal connections for auto frame selection, there may be compromises in positioning of parts that are required to make everything fit together that are different than what can be achieved on the R2/3A. Looking at the 2 packages as a whole - ZI vs R2/3A - I prefer the ZI package.
Huck
As Back Alley says, however, a quick hit on the button & exposure is locked in for 20 seconds so there's really no need to have the thumb availabe to keep the AE button depressed. This is different than the R2/3A of course which requires that the button remain manually depressed to function.
It can be a problem to look at a question like this out of context. The AE lock button on the ZI is located in exactly the same position relative to the sides as is the AE lock button on the M7 - although the button on the ZI is slightly lower. Given the longer rangefinder base on these 2 cameras vs the R2/3A as well as all the additional internal connections for auto frame selection, there may be compromises in positioning of parts that are required to make everything fit together that are different than what can be achieved on the R2/3A. Looking at the 2 packages as a whole - ZI vs R2/3A - I prefer the ZI package.
Huck
Marko
Established
I have one question to the shutter sound of the ZI. I use a Voigtländer Bessa R3a and the shutter of the Bessa is ugly loud (is the only problem that i have with my Bessa)! So my question, is the shutter of the ZI quieter than the shutter of the Bessa? Both cameras where manufactured from Cosina. So i think there is no big differnce between these cameras!
W
Way
Guest
I believe the ZI's shutter is quieter than any of the Bessa's. My MP is quieter
than the ZI, so I may do what Joe did and buy a Luigi half case to help
deaden the volume.
Way
than the ZI, so I may do what Joe did and buy a Luigi half case to help
deaden the volume.
Way
Marko
Established
Thanks for the hint with the half case. Hm.. louder than the Leica MP.. the MP is the loudest of the "new" Leicas.. My Yashica Lynx 14 has a very, very quite shutter (a dream..) But the problem is, the Yashica Lynx is to big for the inconspicuous photographie! On the ZI i found that the viewfinder has a bigger round eyepiece than the Bessa so i think there is a better "viewing"
On the ZI i found that the viewfinder has a bigger round eyepiece than the Bessa so i think there is a better "viewing"
W
Way
Guest
Of the modern Leicas, the M7 has probably the quietest shutter. The MP
is just slightly louder, but not my much. I use the MP during symphony
rehearsals and concerts with no problems. I don't think I could do that
with the Bessas and not get noticed. Have yet to try the ZI in the same
situation. The viewfinder of the ZI is quite large - makes my MP's .72
seem cramped. Focusing is accurate and, like I've posted before, the feel
of the shutter release is great. Tonight I've shot many at 1/4 and 1/8.
Even tried a few at 1/2 just to see how steady I can be. Due
to the shutter release, I feel confident that they will come out pretty clear.
If any of the pics are interesting, I'll post some in a couple of days.
Way
is just slightly louder, but not my much. I use the MP during symphony
rehearsals and concerts with no problems. I don't think I could do that
with the Bessas and not get noticed. Have yet to try the ZI in the same
situation. The viewfinder of the ZI is quite large - makes my MP's .72
seem cramped. Focusing is accurate and, like I've posted before, the feel
of the shutter release is great. Tonight I've shot many at 1/4 and 1/8.
Even tried a few at 1/2 just to see how steady I can be. Due
to the shutter release, I feel confident that they will come out pretty clear.
If any of the pics are interesting, I'll post some in a couple of days.
Way
Marko
Established
Okay, i think i will sell my Yashica Lynx 14 next time and then i will purchase a black ZI. Do you know when the black ZI comes?
Huck Finn
Well-known
Marko, the black ZI is scheduled for release by the end of March, which means that it should be to the dealers in April.
Just a note about your comparison between the ZI & the R3A. Although both were manufactured by Cosina, almost everything about them is different - just as an F6 & an N55 are both manufactured by Nikon, but there is a world of difference between these 2 cameras. Futher, the ZI is has been developed through a partnership between Cosina & Carl Zeiss. Zeiss has been an active partner involved in design, testing, standards, & quality control. This has introduced a whole new element into Cosina production. I have written a review explaining what is different about the ZI, which will be posted some time in the next week at elekm.net/zeiss_ikon.
Huck
Just a note about your comparison between the ZI & the R3A. Although both were manufactured by Cosina, almost everything about them is different - just as an F6 & an N55 are both manufactured by Nikon, but there is a world of difference between these 2 cameras. Futher, the ZI is has been developed through a partnership between Cosina & Carl Zeiss. Zeiss has been an active partner involved in design, testing, standards, & quality control. This has introduced a whole new element into Cosina production. I have written a review explaining what is different about the ZI, which will be posted some time in the next week at elekm.net/zeiss_ikon.
Huck
hinius
Member
The black Zeiss Ikon is out in Asia; Joseph Yao has then in stock. Mine arrived last week... sweet camera.
Huck Finn
Well-known
Great! For a change, a Zeiss ikon has arrived on the early side of the final target date.
We'll have to wait & see what happens at CameraQuest & Popflash. They didn't receive their first samples of the silver version until a couple of months after Dr. Yao (joseph@yao.com) had his.
Huck
For a change, a Zeiss ikon has arrived on the early side of the final target date.We'll have to wait & see what happens at CameraQuest & Popflash. They didn't receive their first samples of the silver version until a couple of months after Dr. Yao (joseph@yao.com) had his.
Huck
aizan
Veteran
hey, someone else in torrance! hellllllo!