new Noctilux f/0,85 ?

[TJV]

It's funny how you totally fail to get the picture while posturing how much you know.

The revenge is Karma revenge for braggarts like yourself who are so insecure they feel the need to lord it over others who don't own a Noctilux in order to feel good about themselves. Now Mr. Hotshot Noctilux guy, you are being put in the position of owning the soon to be 2nd best high speed 50 by Leica itself. What could be sweeter Karma revenge than that?

Whether the new Noctilux is better than the old or not, it will be marketed as better, because Leica has to say that in order to justify the price increase. Besides, the Noctilux is a very old optical design. With new technology, it should not be hard for them to make a better lens.

Crash and burn? Yes, you did. But I doubt if you were aware enough to realize it.

Alex

Your comments are the most pathetic I've ever come across on any forum. Completely useless and poorly thought out, emotive and extremely arrogant. If you know Ned you'd know he actually uses his gear, uses it very hard and for good reason. Build a bridge and get over it.

 

[larmarv916]

Does anybody have any tangible evidence of the "new" product or a press release....Something we could call hard documentation. I personally would be much more interested in a super fast 28mm F1.4 ASPH But as it stands the real question is when you see the technical data ...MDF charts. Plus some test images of direct comparison between the Noctilux, the Summilux ASPH 50mm and a supposed new Noctilux....The can we see a "value Added" that is worth the retail cost to us the retail clients.????

Please if some has something real.....Post it !

Best Regards......Laurance

 

[Keith]

Thanks for your kind words, Keith. I have to agree that never mind which lens, my style wouldn't change (same for all of us). But in all honesty, if the Noctilux wasn't that impressive from the moment I tried it, I probably would have sold it long ago (remember, I bought it when there was no hype around it and keeping it was based on its performance alone).

The Noctilux outshines the Noct-Nikkor, one of my (D)SLR workhorse lens for weddings and such applications... and I love the Noct-Nikkor. But the Noctilux is just above it. Not as romantic but definitely more character. I wouldn't say no to a Canon f1.2 but I have to admit the 60 1.2 Hexanon is tempting me a lot.

Ned .. I have to ask what you feel you could do with a Hex 60mm f1.2 that you don't do with your Noctilux? What would be the attraction ... the slightly tighter framing or the different signature or is there something else that interests you about it?

 

[Tonaility]

It "news" comes from a very reliable source in the UK.

 

[Leicabug]

From a economical or profit perspective, a new noctilux doesn't make any sense at all. Leica would be hobbyists' heaven if a new noctilux is introduced later this year. That means Leica is still willing to invent and invest something that doesn't make much economical sense.

 

[Roger Hicks]

From a economical or profit perspective, a new noctilux doesn't make any sense at all. Leica would be hobbyists' heaven if a new noctilux is introduced later this year. That means Leica is still willing to invent and invest something that doesn't make much economical sense.

Eh?

First, why shouldn't they make a profit on a new Noctilux?

Second, as has already been pointed out, people may well buy into a system which includes lenses they will never buy, because of the reflected glory of those lenses. In other words, it can be seen as part of the advertising budget. This works -- look at the Noctilux threads on this forum alone.

Third, what's wrong with hobbyists if they buy the kit? The Sultan of Brunei is not, as far as I am aware, a professional photographer, but he must be a very welcome customer.

Cheers,

R.

 

[Rayt]

I asked the official Leica agent here in HK and was told the new Noctilux will be a very limited production exact numbers unknown and will list for roughly US$10,000. I then asked a Leica dealer and was told he had ordered a few and he also confirmed the lens will be a very limited edition. I then asked him jokingly to reserve one for me but he said they were all spoken for. Too bad.

 

[tomasis]

CSB 5858, stop to smoke weeds. you wandered in your fantasies enough by judging your comments. Though I don't have against Vancouver and its local production 😉 I happen to like bikes 😀

 

[Tom A]

The Ultra-fast 50's are a kind of flagship lenses for manufacturers. The Canon 0.95, the Nikon 1.1, Zunow's 1.1 and the Hexanon 50/60mm f1.2's. It was a matter of pride to make them. From practical standpoint they are in most cases "overkill". I have been seduced by Nocti's multiple times (6 of them over the last 3-4 decades), even the Canon 0,95 briefly and the 60f1.2 Hexanon for a couple of years (the best of the bunch in my estimation). In the end they were all disposed of as I was tired of hauling them around and for my type of shooting, they did not work.
The Noctilux F1 was a Dr Mandler design (Leica Midland Canada), mainly because he did not like the f1.2 Aspherical. Too difficult to make, too expensive to sell and really, not that good!
Leica's sales of Noctiluxes were small (one figure I heard was 200-250/year at its peak) and if you can trace the ownership of a Noctilux, you will probably find that most of them are bought used and go through multiple owners over the decades. Out of my 6, three were bought new (the 50f1.2, one early F1 and one late version with the collapsible hood). The other ones were trades for stuff I felt I needed even less than a F1!!

A superfast 50. a 0,85 or 0,95 is probably quite useless in practical terms. At close focus you have a depth of field in millimeters and even focussing on the eye. you will have eyelashes "fuzzy" and the nose looking like a blob! Focussing accuracy and rangefinder alignment would be critical and almost require dedicated bodies for the lens.

What would be interesting is what the performance would be like with 21st century technology. The Noctilux is an old design (40+ years) and today we have far better technology available for glass and coatings. A new design. using the latest technology could be interesting, though it might have a far more clinical look than the Noctilux of the past. Of course, this is hypothetical as the price for a Leica one would be staggeringly high and my hope is that either Voigtlander or Zeiss takes up the challenge and makes one at an affordable price - they have the technology to equal or even better a Leica effort. If that happens, I might even be seduced by it and get one - at least until I get tired of dragging it around or chasing focus points in the enlarger!

 

[BillP]

I demand proof.

I am an ag-noct-ic.

Regards,

Bill

 

[larmarv916]

Remeber all the discussions on how Leica could best spend it's marketing budget or what Leica should do to close the gap with advanced digital products. So lets say that this mythical new "Nocti" is a reality....Then again , you have to ask yourself why and what is the major upside for increased sales world wide.

I comes back to..If True...the internal management decisions that make this the top...must do first on the list "turn around" magic And after "sacking" the head of the company.

My head spins when you think that this new Noctilux had to have been in the works for sometime. were talking serious money spent for the greater glory of what??? I mean do you really see this as increasing shareholder value? Or once again secretly releasing products and yet not making the program public so that if "real " demand was found.....Ha Ha

A larger market would have made the production cost lower for Leica. This really smacks of stupid. Please someone enlighten me on the benefit to anyone.

Best Reagards....Laurance

 

[Nemo]

The problem is not "to make a profit" but to make the highest profit possible for a particular investment. I also doubt superfast lenses should be the priority at this moment, considering the M8 limitations in terms of focus accuracy.

 

[RichardB]

"I am an ag-noct-ic."

Very clever! I like it! -Dick

 

[Tom A]

Wether the Ultrafast Noctilux will be made or not is open to question. The facts are that Dr Kaufman hinted at it at LHSA last year in Rochester. This does not mean they will make it, of course. With the looming recession a $10 000 lens is not going to be a hot seller!
The Noctilux was always an anomaly in the lens parade for the last 40 years. It did not sell well, at the most I suspect that less than 8000 were made. The reputation and desire for one was usually in the used market - I suspect that most Nocti's has had multiple owners. Everybody wanted to try one, bought it and resold it later. It is not an easy lens too use. Minimal depth of focus at f1.0, not that good in the mid-range, heavy to carry etc. I have been victim to Noctilust multiple times, having owned 6 of them (three bought new and three used). After a while I got tired of a/having to recalibrate cameras to work with it and b/trying to find the focus plane when enlarging negs.
There are few shooters who have used it to its full potential over the decades (Ted Grant is the master).
A 0.95 or even a 0.85 is not going to make much of a difference - the DOF will be so miniscule that you will need a calibrated body for it! It will be massive, probably a 62-68 mm front element as the rear is restricted to what the M-mount can handle.
What it is interesting is the application of 21st century technology to a design like that. After 40 years we have new glass, new coatings and far more sophisticated programs for design. There is a trickle down effect for things like that. With the Noctilux it was the 75f1.4 Summilux and the unfortunately stillborn 75f2,4 Apo Elmarit M. If there is a new Super Duper 50f0,85 - it can only help with the design of newer and better moderate speed lenses -an upgraded 50 Summicron maybe, a fast 28 or a 90f1,4!
Rest assured that neither Leica, Zeiss or Cosina Voigtlander are ignoring this. A prestigious lens like a 0.85 50mm is a "flagship" - it might not sell that well, but it will keep the name of the manufacturer in the news and in these forums.
For those who liked the Noctilux rendering (massive vignetting at f1, soft contrast across etc) - dont hold your breath. Any new lens like this will be targetted as a showcase for optical exellence with most likely full use of aspherical elements, contrast boosting coatings etc. A bit like a 50mm f1.4 Asph on speed!

 

[Tuolumne]

I asked the official Leica agent here in HK and was told the new Noctilux will be a very limited production exact numbers unknown and will list for roughly US$10,000. I then asked a Leica dealer and was told he had ordered a few and he also confirmed the lens will be a very limited edition. I then asked him jokingly to reserve one for me but he said they were all spoken for. Too bad.

Does this mean my old Noctilux will now be worth $10,000? Oh, goody! 🙂

/T

 

[infrequent]

I don't think shareholder value is a problem anymore thanks to Dr. Kaufmann.

of course dr kaufmann is at the helm of leica out of sheer magnanimity.

 

[awilder]

A lens as fast as f/0.85 will have an even larger front element than the 50/1 potentially blocking more of the viewfinder. For this reason alone, I'm skeptical of something that fast being made by Leica. I'd expect a price of around $7000+ if such a beast were made, another reason I'm skeptical.

 

[usayit]

Why assume that the next (if one is to be) noctilux is a 50mm? With smaller than full frame M8, doesn't it make sense that the next will be a 28mm or 35mm?

 

[rxmd]

of course dr kaufmann is at the helm of leica out of sheer magnanimity.

No, that's not the reason. Leica is not a publicly traded company anymore; their stocks are 100% in the hands of one owner, and in 2008 they are planning to take the company off the stock market. Shareholder value doesn't matter if there are no shareholders whose whims you have to cater to.

Philipp

 

[monochromejrnl]

No, that's not the reason. Leica is not a publicly traded company anymore; their stocks are 100% in the hands of one owner, and in 2008 they are planning to take the company off the stock market. Shareholder value doesn't matter if there are no shareholders whose whims you have to cater to.

Philipp

I'm willing to bet that shareholder value matters to Mr. Kauffman, if it doesn't then Leica won't exist for long... it's far to expensive to run a company with as many obligations as Leica Camera AG for 'sh8ts and giggles'... he'd better be in the game to make money...