New Sigma Quattro DP2?

GaryLH said:
So how's the sd1m so far?

Gary
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Really like it ... though I don't think the 50mm f1.4 (old version) is exactly stellar but the new 'art' 35mm f1.4 is a stunner!

I have my eye on the 18-35 f1.8 ... apparently it's a brilliant lens. :)

The shutter sound amazes me ... probably one of the quietest I've heard and is more of a soft 'crunch' than any other description.
 
Yeah art series so far has been great performers. That what I would aim for in fixed focal length.

I think the Quattro may end being a better monochrome camera then the Merrill. I am waiting for pre-orders to open.

Gary
 
Keith said:
Really like it ... though I don't think the 50mm f1.4 (old version) is exactly stellar but the new 'art' 35mm f1.4 is a stunner!

I have my eye on the 18-35 f1.8 ... apparently it's a brilliant lens. :)

The shutter sound amazes me ... probably one of the quietest I've heard and is more of a soft 'crunch' than any other description.
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hi Keith, could u describe SD1m autofocus vs. Nikon D700? others please share your experience too :)

bit of off the topic, but am extremely curious about this :p
 
jarski said:
hi Keith, could u describe SD1m autofocus vs. Nikon D700? others please share your experience too :)

bit of off the topic, but am extremely curious about this :p
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Not even close to the D700 ... but I knew this before I bought it.

I'm currently using the camera's focus system via the AF button and not the shutter button (half press) ... I actually prefer my D700 this way also.

The SD1M faffs about a bit when focusing ... particularly in lowish light though I do find it easy to focus manually which is a pleasant surprise because I wasn't expecting the viewfinder to be as good as it is.

At some stage I'll probably do a review and post it in the SLR forum ... I currently haven't really used the camera enough to do this. Work and all that!
 
ty! checked also what DPreview had to say about this (end of link). seems that finder and focusing are improved quite a bit from SD15, but its not as good as what Canon/Nikon have been capable of making.
 
It won't affect me because I intend keeping my current Merrills and using them along side the SD1M but I hope Sigma doesn't lose the uniqueness of the foveon sensor with this latest offering.

I believe the foveon sensor, warts and all, is unique in the current digital world and has a look all it's own ... and I personally don't want that to change.
 
jarski said:
ty! checked also what DPreview had to say about this (end of link). seems that finder and focusing are improved quite a bit from SD15, but its not as good as what Canon/Nikon have been capable of making.
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I think af speed is about Nikon d200-300 range or Fuji x100 if that gives any reference points.

Gary
 
Keith said:
I have my eye on the 18-35 f1.8 ... apparently it's a brilliant lens. :)
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That's one of the things I really like about Sigma's Foveon APS-C line. Between the 8-16 and that 18-35, they have a lens line up for the Foveon sensor that hits a number of key buttons (for me).
 
Anyone know if this is true..??

Anyone know if this is true..??

Another interesting post by raistd over at getdpi. I think he is saying that he found this out from the sigma presentation at cp+ which btw is in Japanese. It appears that the top blue layer is sensitive to not only blue but the other colors (red and green). Then it could be that the blue channel rarely does not contribute any info. I wonder if the Merrill blue channel is the same?

-------------- cut and paste -------------

Originally Posted by Hulyss Bowman
Some explanations from da Boss :

CP+2014
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This is a great video, someone translated and summarized the gist of it at dpreview.

I also took notice of the color responses of the layers, so the top layer can indeed be called a "type of blue" but it does register red and green luminance too. This means that the B&W won't be as pure neutral as I thought but on the other hand, color accuracy can increase a bit.

So more than reducing wholesale the whole chroma to 1/4th, it's more like Blue = 19.6 MP but red & green ( and I am using the color terms loosely, it's not exactly RGB) are 4.9 MP.

Because the top layer is 1/2 sensitive to green and 1/4th sensitive to red (approx.) there are some guesstimates that could be done to increase the resolution, in particular of red- but not in all situations, and is tricky. But it's better than nothing.

While B&W is not as good as I had thought if this was a pure or mostly pure luminance layer, (the top one), it should still be pretty good.

And given the noise the Merrill has in red in particular, vs the old design, this design may very well capture in many situations as much detail with that color.

The top layer is effectively (take out your favorite photoshop RGB color wheel) - 255 B , 128 G, 64 R = a type of cyan.

Also the Sigma CEO mentions they improved the sensitivity by 1 ISO stop but they are still working on it. A bit of a bummer I was counting on two, but maybe they can eek out 1.25-1.5.

Also in a refreshing act of candid honesty, he mentioned that "Foveon's strong suit is not low light, and probably will never be, so if you are shooting in low light you should probably be using a better tool (camera) for that" (paraphrased). I respect and applaud his candid honesty here.

Given my experiments with the Merril at ISO 1600, 3200 and 6400 in B&W, I am still hoping that the new sensor could do decent B&W at ISO 6400 and I still wonder how much gain it would be in color when using Low Raw (true X3 capture with a super sampled "blue layer").

- Ricardo
 
GaryLH said:
Another interesting post by raistd over at getdpi. I think he is saying that he found this out from the sigma presentation at cp+ which btw is in Japanese. It appears that the top blue layer is sensitive to not only blue but the other colors (red and green). Then it could be that the blue channel rarely does not contribute any info. I wonder if the Merrill blue channel is the same?

-------------- cut and paste -------------


This is a great video, someone translated and summarized the gist of it at dpreview.

I also took notice of the color responses of the layers, so the top layer can indeed be called a "type of blue" but it does register red and green luminance too. This means that the B&W won't be as pure neutral as I thought but on the other hand, color accuracy can increase a bit.

So more than reducing wholesale the whole chroma to 1/4th, it's more like Blue = 19.6 MP but red & green ( and I am using the color terms loosely, it's not exactly RGB) are 4.9 MP.

Because the top layer is 1/2 sensitive to green and 1/4th sensitive to red (approx.) there are some guesstimates that could be done to increase the resolution, in particular of red- but not in all situations, and is tricky. But it's better than nothing.

While B&W is not as good as I had thought if this was a pure or mostly pure luminance layer, (the top one), it should still be pretty good.

And given the noise the Merrill has in red in particular, vs the old design, this design may very well capture in many situations as much detail with that color.

The top layer is effectively (take out your favorite photoshop RGB color wheel) - 255 B , 128 G, 64 R = a type of cyan.

Also the Sigma CEO mentions they improved the sensitivity by 1 ISO stop but they are still working on it. A bit of a bummer I was counting on two, but maybe they can eek out 1.25-1.5.

Also in a refreshing act of candid honesty, he mentioned that "Foveon's strong suit is not low light, and probably will never be, so if you are shooting in low light you should probably be using a better tool (camera) for that" (paraphrased). I respect and applaud his candid honesty here.

Given my experiments with the Merril at ISO 1600, 3200 and 6400 in B&W, I am still hoping that the new sensor could do decent B&W at ISO 6400 and I still wonder how much gain it would be in color when using Low Raw (true X3 capture with a super sampled "blue layer").

- Ricardo
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Extremely interesting. And a bit more sad news to my ears (eyes). How is the top layer gathering so much of the colour information without single-layer interpolation (not including the 4.9mp layers)? Right now, I'm banking on the rumored monochrome Sony FE camera.
 
If this is true, I think the info about what the real colors are, must be done in the digital processing engine later, by taking into account the info in all three color channels.

Gary
 
Samouraï said:
Extremely interesting. And a bit more sad news to my ears (eyes). How is the top layer gathering so much of the colour information without single-layer interpolation (not including the 4.9mp layers)? Right now, I'm banking on the rumored monochrome Sony FE camera.
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Since I mostly shoot monochrome w/ the dp cameras and color w/ the sd1, I am still going to put my pre-order in. I kind of wonder if the difference in color response we will c between the Merrill and the Quattro cameras will be similar to what was happening between color vs slide film or between Etachrome and Kodachrome?

I would rather c a Fuji x camera w/ a monochrome sensor. I like the control layout so much better. I doubt this will ever happen.

Gary
 
Looks like it will be a while before anyone outside of Fuji (third party testing) will get to beta test this camera. According to someone who was at cp+, the sigma representative there told them that what they were demonstrating at the show was alpha level.. Sounds like they barely got it ready in time for the show.

Pretty much explains why there is no sample shots and places like b&h only have a place holder for it.

Gary
 
ergonomics further explained

ergonomics further explained

At around 4:12 in this video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QsT_3LDkfIg), the Sigma representative explains (in Japanese) the design decisions behind the new grip. The design was made specifically with a certain posture in mind: the arms outstretched, LCD in front of the photog posture.

So even though they have revamped the external OVF line, the camera is essentially optimized for viewing and framing with the LCD at arm's length.

:(
 
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...And it really looks huge...

Hmmm, no small irony: with the Merrills, we got smaller bodies and larger files; with Quattros, it looks like larger bodies and smaller files (also one of the points mentioned in the interview above).
 
Where did the focus conf lamp go?

Where did the focus conf lamp go?

noimmunity said:
So even though they have revamped the external OVF line, the camera is essentially optimized for viewing and framing with the LCD at arm's length.

:(
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Add to that the fact that the dp2Q body seems to have lost the traffic light focus signal on the top deck edge next to the hotshoe (which made it possible to confirm focus even in silent mode), and it gets even more depressing.
 
cosmonaut said:
I can only imagine what Sigma engineers do on their off time. LSD comes to mind.
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No LSD for me ... real cameras don't need it!
no.gif
 
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