[New test photos released] Leica Summicron 35/2 Eight Element copy made in China

The Summaron 35mm f/2.8 (and the f/3.5) are great lenses.

gelatine silver print (summaron 35mm f2.8) leica m2

Erik.

49589738087_43e8f81def_b.jpg
 
james.liam said:
The first batch hasn’t even yet been delivered fully and after that it’ll be double or triple the $500. A 6-bit coded lens from Leica with a warranty that you can order and be assured of delivery is very compelling.
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I meant the "real Leica lens" mentioned above.
 
alex.wheatley said:
Does anyone know if those of us still waiting for our lens from Kevin will now be able to get the improved aperture scale design?
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My black paint version is supposed to ship in the next day or so. Based on the photo of it sent by Kevin, it has the new aperture ring design and new serial number sequence. Coating appears to be the orange type. In his note he said it was the new version but didn't specify what all the changes were. The equal aperture scale spacing was the only obvious functional difference I could see from the photo.

FWIW, mine was delayed several weeks because it didn't pass Kevin's quality control and had to be returned to the factory. Kevin didn't specify what the problem was and I didn't ask because I don't want it to potentially bias my thinking when I do my own QC tests.

I'm curious if anyone else was informed their lens didn't initially pass Kevin's QC tests?
 
Yes, this happened with my black lens too. Kevin sent it back as he was not satisfied with it. I also did not ask him what was wrong with the lens.
 
Hi,
I received one of the early black paint samples and it was not perfectly reaching infinity on a RF properly calibrated M10. Luckily my local Leica shop technician adjusted the lens for me.
I did mention it to Kevin back then.
 
rscheffler said:
My black paint version is supposed to ship in the next day or so. Based on the photo of it sent by Kevin, it has the new aperture ring design and new serial number sequence. Coating appears to be the orange type. In his note he said it was the new version but didn't specify what all the changes were. The equal aperture scale spacing was the only obvious functional difference I could see from the photo.

FWIW, mine was delayed several weeks because it didn't pass Kevin's quality control and had to be returned to the factory. Kevin didn't specify what the problem was and I didn't ask because I don't want it to potentially bias my thinking when I do my own QC tests.

I'm curious if anyone else was informed their lens didn't initially pass Kevin's QC tests?
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Thank you! Good to know and saves me pestering Kevin 🙂
 
I don't have hands-on experience with the original 35 Cron 8E. Wondering what I should expect in terms of optical performance from the replica...

One aspect that interested me in the lens is its wide open character. But I would also like to use it as a general purpose lens (on a digital Leica). With this in mind, is across-frame sharpness pretty good stopped down? If so, at what point should it be pretty good? Also, is there much, if any focus shift on stopping down or field curvature quirks to consider?

Thanks in advance!

Ron
 
Leica0Series said:
Paid for my lens today! Very excited. Ended up switching to black paint because the brass ain't happening anytime soon. Many thanks to Kevin. Can't wait to get the lens ... well, I guess I can, but you know what I mean.
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Likewise!
Its a shame that the brass color can't be had for the current production costs. Black paint will do!
 
raid said:
The better coating makes the replica more contrasty than the Summicron.
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But coatings don't necessarily affect aspects such as focus shift and field curvature.

I received my lens and I have mixed feelings about it when used stopped down because of strong focus shift combined with "W" shaped field curvature. These are my impressions about it with my M240 after both casual photos at various distances as well as putting it on a tripod and doing some careful tests at a range of distances (because of the behavior I noticed in those initial casual photos).

If focused by RF at f/2 and not refocused:

f/2: is kind of glowy due to SA, but sharp enough, which I expected and fully accept, with good flatness of field across the frame.

f/2.8: increases contrast a lot and there seems to be a touch of focus shift, but not much. Center frame sharpness is slightly underwhelming and signs of a mid zone drop in sharpness.

f/4: focus in the center 1/4 to 1/3 of the frame shifts considerably behind the subject while the rest of the frame is pretty sharp with signs of a mid zone dip.

f/5.6: focus in the center shifts even more behind the subject and affects about the center 1/3 of the frame, while the rest of the image remains sharp.

f/8: depth of field begins to recover central sharpness and the outer 2/3 of the frame is good. But central sharpness is still not acceptable, nor as good as the outer 2/3 of the frame.

If I use live view and refocus as the lens is stopped down, the center 1/4 of the frame is sharp and the rest of the image shows considerable field curvature towards the camera. Even depth of field at f/8 is insufficient to recover the mid zone of the image, though the very edges are sharp.

For example a scene nearly at infinity, based on RF focus, f/2 was accurate (as sharp as can be expected). Refocusing with live view at f/4, optimal central focus was with the focus ring at around 10m to get 'infinity' in focus in the center of the image (the rest of the image at that distance is very soft). At f/5.6 optimal near infinity central sharpness had the focusing ring between 5-10m (again, the rest of the image is soft at that distance). At this point, looking through the optical viewfinder, the RF patch was significantly out of coincidence.

I can confidently RF focus my copy at f/2, and with slight front focus, f/2.8. As the lens is stopped down, the "W" shaped field curvature becomes very strong, shifting optimum center sharpness away from the camera and making RF focus placement at f/4 and f/5.6 very difficult without resorting to live view. However, if I RF focus at f/4 or f/5.6 and place the subject in the rule of thirds zone, it will be correctly focused. It would seem the lens's RF calibration is set to cut through the middle of the "W" to keep good average sharpness across the frame but sacrificing the center at f/4-8.

Based on the MTF and field curvature documentation supplied with the lens, it appears "W" shaped field curvature is a characteristic of the lens. What I'm unable to determine from using just my copy is whether its performance is consistent with others, or at the extreme end. In other words, can you RF focus your copy and get a sharply (or acceptably) focused photo of your subject dead center in the frame at f/4 and f/5.6?

Ideally, I would like to use the lens for both wide open character/rendering as well as stopped down use (with good across-frame performance). Maybe it's too much to expect from this era of 35mm design?
 
I was contacted by Kevin today, and have made payment! I may have been among the last to sign on to this project, as I sent my interest form on Dec. 15, 2019. 364 days later, my turn came around. 🙂
 
This is the mail i got -

And I need to explain the situation to you first. That is due to the high production cost of the brass version, failure to produce the right anti-dioxide coating, they stopped making the bare brass version they announced in 2019. Maybe they will start to produce the brass version again in the future, but that will be different than the one we have seen before and with a much higher cost. I am very sorry about it. This is really out of my control. I kept waiting for them to give me good news on the brass version. But unfortunately, they cannot make it happen.
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So sad rn
 
Actually guys, i need an advice.
As a 35mm i already have my beloved Canon 35mm 1.5, do you think this "new" summicron might me better? or.. worse? or different?
Do you think it's worth buying this lens if i already have the Canon?
 
^^rscheffler, interesting examination and analysis ^^

It would be good to find out if your observations are typical of the replica production... Or for that matter typical of the original 8-element Summicron. As to the latter I don't think so, though I have not closely studied its behavior in the way you did. But I've had my Summicron v.1 since new in 1968 and have not noted anything like this in normal usage.

As recently as Sept 2019 I used it exclusively on a vacation trip to the Canadian Rockies with my Leica M-D 262. See photos in my Gallery with batch numbers 190914 and 191003, numbers representing the date of the last photo in each batch. Or just search for that lens and user= Doug
 
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