Graham Line
Well-known
Do you want Tillamook Extra Sharp, or Blue Heron camembert? Or some particularly nasty goat cheeses?
please read this...
- Thread starter back alley
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Trius
Waiting on Maitani
I've had Tillamook, but dunno if it was the Extra Sharp, so yeah, send some. I'll take all the others too. I'm not sure how goat cheese could be "nasty" unless it's improperly made.
Earl
Earl
GeneW
Veteran
So a stern admonishment to the membership turns into a cheese thread. Only on RFF 🙄
Gene
Gene
Bryan Lee
Expat Street Photographer
Trius said:
Sorry but no can do. I routinely travel 6 hours to Bangkok and 12 hours to Pnom Phen just to get my own cheese. Phom Phen has fantastic French Breads to go with the French Cheeses and I find it a appropiete setting for dineing at a sidewalk cafe and having nothing but Bread, Black Coffee, and some exotic and very exspensive cheese that has been flown in from France. My real Cheese Fetish and addiction in the last couple years is Tasmanian Cheese, Ill admit It is my first consideration upon arrival in Bangkok. My first stop is often my cheese dealer and Im just a hopeless Cheese Junkie. Ive even gone as far as eating it in a camera shop and refusing to share with others, once I get it home I do not let anyone near my double door commercial refrigirator. As I write I have no less than 10 different types of cheese from 5 different countrys. It would be great to have a camera and cheese photo thread.
Just to stay on topic, Everyone has been much nicer in the last few days. Maybe it was just a holliday stress thing that had the weather off. The best thing in Thailand is no commercial hype or stress for Christmas, and the Camera Shops arnt closed.
back alley
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GeneW said:
should i take this personally?
joe
JoeFriday
Agent Provacateur
why does that always seem to happen to me?GeneW said:
C
ch1
Guest
back alley said:
Joe,
Jeez - "CHEESE!!!".
Of course! How else can you get a bunch of photographers to behave themselves and smile? 😀
You're a genius!
Next time - just tell us to say: "CHEESE" !
George
copake_ham
back alley
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copake_ham said:
well, i agree with the genius part...😉
joe
DougK
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Mmmm... Tillamook Extra Sharp... I did an Army Reserve annual training assignment at Camp Rilea back in 1992 and got a chance to do the factory tour; bought two pounds of it from the factory and it lasted less than a week (of course, I was forced to share). A nice reminder of home, wish I could get it in Ohio. 🙁Joe Brugger said:
pbjbike
Established
I'm guilty of using the "t" word ;^(. Apologies. I love this site. Civillity is the minimum we should expect from ourselves. Thanks, Joe.
bmattock
Veteran
I have been holding off responding to this thread, until I felt that I could get my thoughts in order. I hope that this is taken in the spirit in which it is meant.
I promise to do my best to be less incendiary around here. Less bombastic, less direct, less absolute. I realize that many people cannot deal with a confrontational approach to conversation - they feel I am angry when I am not. I am not sure when 'confrontational' became a dirty word, but I accept that it is.
Personally, I feel that strongly-held beliefs should be worth defending, or what's the point of having them? That doesn't mean being close-minded, it means defending one's point with logic and vigor. The very nature of debate.
Does one nod and agree with every statement that a good friend makes, or does one take exception when they hear something they disagree with and say "No, I think you're wrong about XYZ, here's why?" I have more respect for my friends than to pretend to agree with them; I feel they deserve my honest responses to their statements, as I would want to hear their objections to things I say or do.
However, I now understand that this needs to be brought down to the level of 'chat' as opposed to 'debate' or even 'discussion'. I mean no insult, but I realize that many here can't take direct, strong, opinions aimed at their own statements, so I will do my best to stop doing it.
But while we are chatting amiably about rangefinder cameras and avoiding talking about things we know will make others angry, is there any way we can try to stop TAKING offense at who or what a person is? I always thought that PC meant being more tolerant, not forcing others to stop offending one.
I'll try to stop mentioning all the things about my life that squick everyone around here. Maybe some of you could be a bit less quick to be offended if you happen to find out what my religion is, or whom I voted for or how I feel about firearms. I will try very hard to only speak of rangefinder cameras. Or cheese, which apparently engenders no hurt feelings.
I suppose if I say I like Velveeta or Kraft American Singles, though, I'll be told I'm hurting someone's feelings and asked to cut it out.
Best Regards,
Bill Mattocks
I promise to do my best to be less incendiary around here. Less bombastic, less direct, less absolute. I realize that many people cannot deal with a confrontational approach to conversation - they feel I am angry when I am not. I am not sure when 'confrontational' became a dirty word, but I accept that it is.
Personally, I feel that strongly-held beliefs should be worth defending, or what's the point of having them? That doesn't mean being close-minded, it means defending one's point with logic and vigor. The very nature of debate.
Does one nod and agree with every statement that a good friend makes, or does one take exception when they hear something they disagree with and say "No, I think you're wrong about XYZ, here's why?" I have more respect for my friends than to pretend to agree with them; I feel they deserve my honest responses to their statements, as I would want to hear their objections to things I say or do.
However, I now understand that this needs to be brought down to the level of 'chat' as opposed to 'debate' or even 'discussion'. I mean no insult, but I realize that many here can't take direct, strong, opinions aimed at their own statements, so I will do my best to stop doing it.
But while we are chatting amiably about rangefinder cameras and avoiding talking about things we know will make others angry, is there any way we can try to stop TAKING offense at who or what a person is? I always thought that PC meant being more tolerant, not forcing others to stop offending one.
I'll try to stop mentioning all the things about my life that squick everyone around here. Maybe some of you could be a bit less quick to be offended if you happen to find out what my religion is, or whom I voted for or how I feel about firearms. I will try very hard to only speak of rangefinder cameras. Or cheese, which apparently engenders no hurt feelings.
I suppose if I say I like Velveeta or Kraft American Singles, though, I'll be told I'm hurting someone's feelings and asked to cut it out.
Best Regards,
Bill Mattocks
back alley
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gezz bill, do i sound THAT bad? i'm not trying to emasculate anyone here.
in my 'real' life I AM THE SHIT DISTURBER and there are those who dread when i open my mouth.
i just think that here in cyber space where it's so very easy to mis speak or mis interpret that a bit of extra effort needs to be taken so we can keep it friendly.
it's interesting also, in that i did not have arguments in mind when i wrote my original rant above. it was aimed more at those who would create ridgid rules to control others and those who seem to enjoy getting a few people going and then sit back and watch.
i do enjoy a good argument, it's the bullying and name calling that i find offensive, here or in person.
i have never found you be either bullying or offensive.
joe
in my 'real' life I AM THE SHIT DISTURBER and there are those who dread when i open my mouth.
i just think that here in cyber space where it's so very easy to mis speak or mis interpret that a bit of extra effort needs to be taken so we can keep it friendly.
it's interesting also, in that i did not have arguments in mind when i wrote my original rant above. it was aimed more at those who would create ridgid rules to control others and those who seem to enjoy getting a few people going and then sit back and watch.
i do enjoy a good argument, it's the bullying and name calling that i find offensive, here or in person.
i have never found you be either bullying or offensive.
joe
S
Socke
Guest
Bill, I'm with you, but calling somebody else an idiot is too far from a friendly debate. Unluckily this happend.
A heated debate is ok with me, as long as it stays a heated debate under friends who might disagree on anything but where to go for the next drink 🙂
A heated debate is ok with me, as long as it stays a heated debate under friends who might disagree on anything but where to go for the next drink 🙂
oftheherd
Veteran
back alley said:
Me either Bill. At least not bullying. 😀
I don't think anybody here minds anyone else defending their views. I certainly don't. And I think everybody knows how to be civil, whether they choose to be or not. Fortunately, most here are civil. That is one of the things (besides the vast amount of knowledge) that I like about this site. And for what it is worth, I have never personally taken any offense at anything you posted, whether I have always agreed or not doesn't matter. We are all entitled to our opinions.
But probably the below said it best anyway:
Socke said:
🙂
JoeFriday
Agent Provacateur
many people don't realize that there is an art to debate.. a way of disagreeing without insult.. instead of saying "you're wrong", use the words "that statement is incorrect".. it means the same thing, but with a different connotation.. in the first instance, the focus is on the person.. in the second instance, the focus is on the statement
just something to keep in mind
just something to keep in mind
Flyfisher Tom
Well-known
VinceC said:
Growing pains. And, part of this stems from the unusually large number of posts nowadays from new members whose first and continuing posts seem to be FS/For sale posts one after another ... typically, with no effort whatsoever to participate in discussions. I suspect this makes people a little more on guard for 'trolls' and other unsavory characters.
Though I am a libertarian at heart, I certainly would not object too strenuously to banning new members whose first 1-20 posts are related to a M6 they have for sale 😉
With growing membership, comes growing pains. I would like to give new members, indeed anyone, the benefit of the doubt at least once. Just have to keep that in mind while we read through the threads. The other thing to keep in mind is to refrain from saying anything that you would not be comfortable saying to a person face to face. Easy rule. There is a 'culture' here that is different than other forums. It is worth preserving ... with kind and constructive suggestions to those who violate the rules of that culture. If offenders persist, then let Joe take care of it in terminal fashion. Mud wrestling in the dirt with them is largely a waste of time.
Haven't logged on in a few days, I must have missed some fiery conversations 🙂
Happy holiday Joe, keep up the good work.
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FrankS
Registered User
I agree with that statement Brett. (That's good.)
Only an idiot wouldn't. (That's bad.)
Only an idiot wouldn't. (That's bad.)
N
NelsonFoto
Guest
I've PM'd Joe my thoughts on the matter, but I will add this public bit.
There is a problem with many forums in that you have those who cannot separate vigorous-but-civil discourse from undesirable ad hominem attacks. It is super-destructive to communities, and my opinion is that forums like this one as well as my own have a singular charge, a duty, to see that community is nurtured.
A second problem to consider is that of ownership, that is, members who become territorial because they were "here first" and therefore assume some cloak of immunity from rules and regulations, or worse become self-appointed magistrates.
For my own 40-acres and mule, the policy is very clear on the matter. Those who stoop to ad hominem attack in the heat of discussion or as simple trolling behavior will be dealt with swiftly and strongly. Those who attempt to discipline offenders become themselves offenders and will likewise be deactivated without further argument.
By taking this position, the troll finds no toys. The wannabe sherrif finds no honor. The community does not cannibalize.
I'm not passing judgment on any at RFf. I've been a persistent reader for months on end now, though I contribute little. I've had no personal problems with any here. I've even done a trade or two to my satisfaction. I will only say that those who love this community will learn that silence is golden when they feel compelled to rebuke fellow members they feel sleighted by and will instead report it to the admin and let chips fall as admin sees fit. Those who come seeking conflict cannot enjoy chaos if the only response to their jabs is silence.
My two cents.
Long live RFf!
Craig
There is a problem with many forums in that you have those who cannot separate vigorous-but-civil discourse from undesirable ad hominem attacks. It is super-destructive to communities, and my opinion is that forums like this one as well as my own have a singular charge, a duty, to see that community is nurtured.
A second problem to consider is that of ownership, that is, members who become territorial because they were "here first" and therefore assume some cloak of immunity from rules and regulations, or worse become self-appointed magistrates.
For my own 40-acres and mule, the policy is very clear on the matter. Those who stoop to ad hominem attack in the heat of discussion or as simple trolling behavior will be dealt with swiftly and strongly. Those who attempt to discipline offenders become themselves offenders and will likewise be deactivated without further argument.
By taking this position, the troll finds no toys. The wannabe sherrif finds no honor. The community does not cannibalize.
I'm not passing judgment on any at RFf. I've been a persistent reader for months on end now, though I contribute little. I've had no personal problems with any here. I've even done a trade or two to my satisfaction. I will only say that those who love this community will learn that silence is golden when they feel compelled to rebuke fellow members they feel sleighted by and will instead report it to the admin and let chips fall as admin sees fit. Those who come seeking conflict cannot enjoy chaos if the only response to their jabs is silence.
My two cents.
Long live RFf!
Craig
bmattock
Veteran
back alley said:
No, Joe, it isn't you. I get emails and remarks - this person does not appreciate my reference to owning XYZ (the g-word), that person dislikes my stating my faith is ABC. Another person finds my avatar intimidating. Yet another disliked that I had posted a photo of myself with a cigarette in my hand. All felt that I should change to avoid offending them.
And I suppose they are right. And I am trying to do it. But I find myself in a very small box. It is hard to express myself without revealing bits and pieces of who I am, where I've been, and what I've done - and that, apparently, is offensive to many.
Thank you, but when I applied what I know about myself based on the private emails I have gotten about my postings here to your warnings about not stirring the pot, I applied it to myself and decided that I was the one who needed to change.
Best Regards,
Bill Mattocks
back alley
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i have really mixed feelings about this whole p.m. thing.
i need to think on it a bit...before i say anything.
joe
i need to think on it a bit...before i say anything.
joe
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