Problems! Canon VI-L with 85mm F1.8

[cassel]

My new equipment from the end of 2014 is not working well- just got back the first roll and there are 4 acceptable shots out of 37. Pretty irritating to say the least. I also processed rolls from my L3 (since sold) and my FM2 with 105mm - they are also pretty bad- but more from technique than mechanical issues- We'll leave those to another time🙁

Here's the deal with the Canon set-up: Focus is off for almost all shots- seems to focus ok up close but not at middle to far distances- but I'm not 100% positive. Exposure is OK - not great- some seem underexposed. Film is 800 tungsten balanced.

Here are some examples- see what you think:

First shot above is close distance, wide open at 1/30

Next:

Mid Focus- f/16 @ 1/500

Next:

Mid Focus- f/4 @ 1/60 (why is this not blurry?)

Next:

Mid/Far Focus - same as above...

Next:

Mid/Far - F/8

The rest of the roll is more of the same- OK exposure, missed focus except for a few, mostly close shot- Here's one last shot that has an odd flare and focus is way off...

Physically, the lens look fine EXCEPT it looks like it won't focus all the way to infinity- seems to stop short between 20m and infinity...

Any thoughts??

 

[raid]

I would send the lens and the camera to DAG.

 

[farlymac]

I'd send it back. Someone has messed up that lens from all the distortion I see.

PF

 

[cassel]

I'd send it back. Someone has messed up that lens from all the distortion I see.

PF

It was cheap... but you get what you pay for, I guess. Sending it back (then finding another 85 f1.8- an expensive Canon lens) versus repair attempt is sort of a toss-up money-wise (assuming it can be repaired) - I will check my timeline for return options.

I think the body is OK- I shot the first 8 frames of the roll with a different lens and those shots were fine.

Any ideas why some shots were in focus? especially odd is the neon sign that is in focus... doesn't follow a pattern.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Canon-85mm-1-1-8-for-Canon-Leica-Screw-Mount-/391008903234?ssPageName=ADME%3AX%3ARTQ%3AUS%3A1123&nma=true&si=Z%252FsiK8km6%252FdrUyOqqn1aJgkE7dk%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

 

[cassel]

Looks like I'm past the deadline for a return by several days....

Unless I'm reading the policy wrong. EDIT - should be covered still by the 30 day Money Back on defective items

 

[02Pilot]

I've got a suspicion that there's an element reversed in that lens. Also possible that something is not tight internally and is rotating when you focus.

 

[raid]

I had a Canon 50/1.2 that had similar symptoms. It was focusing here and there but not at some distances. My local camera repairman could not identify the problem, so I sent the lens to DAG. His diagnosis: an internal glass element had moved. I got back a wonderful lens.

 

[cassel]

I had a Canon 50/1.2 that had similar symptoms. It was focusing here and there but not at some distances. My local camera repairman could not identify the problem, so I sent the lens to DAG. His diagnosis: an internal glass element had moved. I got back a wonderful lens.

Good to know- I have hunted for this particular 85mm for a while and it would be nice to get it working...🙄

 

[cassel]

Not sure if I want to pursue a repair here- I'm more interested in shooting other gear I own.

To be clear: the camera has TWO problems- self-timer does not work and the brightline frames in the finder are faded out- otherwise it works fine- I have shot it with the 50mm I have it the shots turned out fine

The lens, well, read above and you will see the problem😕

Let me know if you think I should get it fix (just shelf it for now) I know DAG was one suggestion.

 

[kuuan]

My copy of the Canon LTM 1.8/85 also wasn't sharp when shot at wide apertures, produced glares and did not focus to infinity.
After having found the lens diagram here: http://www.taunusreiter.de/Cameras/Canon_RF_2.html#CANON_RF_1.8-85mm
I screwed off the back group, which is very easy to do, and discovered that the two rear elements had been assembled wrongly. Now it is working perfectly well.

Have you ever opened a lens yourself? If you don't find anyone for repair I would try to help you as much as I can by PMs or comments here.

 

[cassel]

Here's a rear view of the lens-with the focus turned as far as it will go towards infinity-- looks like the roller does not come all the way to the infinity stop? If I'm looking at it right. Not sure about disassembly!

 

[kuuan]

Here's a rear view of the lens-with the focus turned as far as it will go towards infinity-- looks like the roller does not come all the way to the infinity stop? If I'm looking at it right. Not sure about disassembly!

from this photo it is difficult to judge, but I would think that it does go as far as it should. Look at mine, at infinity, as indicated by the red lines, the distance of the ring with the distance markings to the silver ring is 6,5mm, all the way to the mount 10mm:

If your's does go that far too, I'd day chances are, as had been the case with my copy, that inner lens elements had been reassembled wrongly. If you want to ceck, here first how to look into the rear lens block:

Canon LTM tele lenses can be screwed apart in the middle, it leaves the complete optical black separated from the focus helicoid:

the rear side of the optical block will look like this:

see the two notches, that's where your lens spanner should go, or any other tools that you find to counterclockwise screw off the rear optical block

once this is done it's 'cap' can be unscrewed ( should do just by hand )

if you go that far just be careful, the two lenses inside this block, if turned upside down, will fall out ( do this over a soft surface )

and if you get that far, check if the two lens elements are assembled as shown at the lens diagram in the site of 'Taunusreiter' that I had linked in my last post, here it is again: http://www.taunusreiter.de/Cameras/Canon_RF_2.html#CANON_RF_1.8-85mm

The thinner lens goes in first with the flatter side down, than come a spacer tube that is cut out on one side, that side goes in first and holds that first lens tight, then comes the thicker element with the convex side first, the concave part up.

It's not difficult and worth the try, I'd say.
If that doesn't solve the problem next I'd look into the front block, the name ring has two grooves for a lens spanner.

 

[cassel]

Thanks for the detailed write-up and pictures- wow!

Looks like my focus helicoil does NOT go as far as it should:

I suppose I should address that issue first...

 

[cassel]

Probably not pressure plate as I was able to get decent shots with another lens- 50mm nikkor. Lens is suspect- especially not turning all the way to infinity...

 

[kuuan]

Thanks for the detailed write-up and pictures- wow!

Looks like my focus helicoil does NOT go as far as it should

for how much I can see I'd contradict and say that it does, to be more clear I'd recommend to measure.

 

[cassel]

The lens DOES NOT go all the way to infinity- also confirmed when mounted on the camera. It stops between 20m and infinity. Showed it to a repair shop today- they guessed the elements are fine after an inspection- no way to tell 100% without taking it apart. Their concern was the focus issue- goes too far on the close end and not far enough on the infinity end.

They wanted $200 to look into it-- no thanks.

I may attempt a careful exploration- disassemble.

 

[cassel]

Trying to UNSCREW lens in the middle- as pictured above- it does unscrew a few degrees but then it STOPS - binds up and won't turn any further. Ideas?
Turns a lot farther at minimum aperture- but still won't unscrew. Un-do the screws on the aperture ring?

 

[cassel]

No luck----

how do I get to this point? (not my lens in the picture, mine won't come apart)

 

[cassel]

Either I'm stupid- quite possible OR something is seriously wrong with this lens...at f/22 it (the front/optical group) will turn counterclockwise (no evidence of actual unscrewing- the gap distance along the ring does not "grow") but then it stops abruptly-- not really binding up. So, I've rocked it back and forth-- tried pulling gently apart at different degrees of the turn- nothing.

The lens -- even when tightened back up-- has a subtle rattle to it- something is loose and moving internally. Can't see what it is... this lens is FUBAR