"recently cla'd" yeah, right

[chris91387]

ok, i've been browsing evil-bay and am getting close to pulling the trigger on either an m4 or m6, and as i am getting close for the right moment i have asked a few sellers if they could prove the "recently cla'd" statement in their add and by whom was the cla performed. NOT ONE seller has responded to my question. really makes me suspicious.

i'd be willing to spend a few hundred more on a camera that has indeed been recently cla'd but i want to see proof. otherwise i'll wait for a cheaper camera and plan on the cost to send it off to get all gussied up.

at least we could look at images to try and get an idea about the "minty-ness" of the item being sold (aren't they all "minty" these days?) but a cla is pretty tough to see in a few pictures.

anyone else ever had this thought?

- chris

 

[ocean7]

Ebay is a source for desastrous buyer experience if you are not extremely cautious. During my quest for a M body I emailed sellers a lot, just to realize that very few of them know what they are talking about. That is when they respond. And "mint" is a statement that is used very lightly there. So you'd better look for a seller here on RFF with a good reputation.

Not to be totally negative about eBay there are indeed some good sellers there. Matsuiya Store, Henry's and Youxin Ye himself! I bet he knows what he is talking about 😀

Youxin has an CLA'd M4-2 for sale that ends in less than 5 hours : item #230208351514 That is what I would purchase.

Good luck!

 

[spiderfrank]

try www.newoldcamera.it (or .com? I don't remember) they give a one/two year warranty on their used cameras

 

[Thardy]

Is a receipt provided with a CLA? Maybe they could scan and email that to you. I think they MAY be truthful about the CLA but figure it's too much work to provide proof. A little presumptive on their part? But the way people are bidding up these cameras...

 

[CSB 5858]

ok, i've been browsing evil-bay and am getting close to pulling the trigger on either an m4 or m6, and as i am getting close for the right moment i have asked a few sellers if they could prove the "recently cla'd" statement in their add and by whom was the cla performed. NOT ONE seller has responded to my question. really makes me suspicious.

anyone else ever had this thought?

- chris

Try looking at it from the seller's side. Your question amounts to an accusation they are lying about the CLA. That gives the signal you are more likely to be a problem buyer as well as suspicious bidder.

Why should the seller waste their time on a suspicious bidder when it is much easier to sell to bidder not sending up such red flags?

It makes sense to evaluate and read the ads carefully. Seller feedback is probably the best way to look at the seller. But suspicious questions like "proving a CLA" don't deserve an answer. To the seller it's a signal you are a suspicious bidder waiting to be a troublesome buyer.

Alex

 

[ocean7]

Alex if you are selling a camera for $1k saying it has been CLA'd I guess the least you can do is prove that the work has been done. A CLA for an M6 would cost up to $400. You are not insulting the seller when you ask him to show a piece of paper.

 

[Al Patterson]

Try looking at it from the seller's side. Your question amounts to an accusation they are lying about the CLA. That gives the signal you are more likely to be a problem buyer as well as suspicious bidder.

Why should the seller waste their time on a suspicious bidder when it is much easier to sell to bidder not sending up such red flags?

It makes sense to evaluate and read the ads carefully. Seller feedback is probably the best way to look at the seller. But suspicious questions like "proving a CLA" don't deserve an answer. To the seller it's a signal you are a suspicious bidder waiting to be a troublesome buyer.

Alex

When I bought my CL, the seller sent along a copy of the paperwork from the CLA, so I'm also one of those "troublesome buyers". With a 100% feedback rating.

 

[David Murphy]

I've never paid more than $180 for a CLA on a rangefinder -- $100 is more typical. The key to getting reasonable repair rates is to avoid most of the national repair places (except a few key ones like DAG -- when really needed). Cultivate a local repair person. Any competent camera tech can fix any Leica M or screw mount series -- this is very basic. Camera repair is not rocket science -- it take training and experience, but it's routine, even if it's a Leica.

If you buy online ask for a receipt as stated above. You are taking chances otherwise. I recently bought a Canon P online on eBay that was said to have been CLA'd. The owner even had excellent feedback, and the thing was a mess when I got it. (he had "lost" the receipt!). Overall the deal was still worth it since the lenses it came with were good, but I was a little miffed.

 

[chris91387]

david, i see you live in pasadena. i'm in "the valley". is there anyone in our neck of the woods that you recommend?

- chris

 

[oscroft]

Try looking at it from the seller's side. Your question amounts to an accusation they are lying about the CLA.

As a seller, I would never see questions about such things as accusations of dishonesty - if I was selling something that had had a CLA, I'd be more than happy to tell any potential buyer when and by whom it was done, and to provide evidence if I had any.

 

[rover]

Get the receipt. When I bought my M3 the seller sent two. One a quick shutter service he had done when he first got the camera, the second from DAG, Don inspected the camera, did some light cleaning and sent it back to the guy with the statement on the receipt, this camera is very clean and running well. Very little work was needed. At least I know it has been in good hands.

 

[eon]

Try looking at it from the seller's side. Your question amounts to an accusation they are lying about the CLA. That gives the signal you are more likely to be a problem buyer as well as suspicious bidder.

Why should the seller waste their time on a suspicious bidder when it is much easier to sell to bidder not sending up such red flags?

It makes sense to evaluate and read the ads carefully. Seller feedback is probably the best way to look at the seller. But suspicious questions like "proving a CLA" don't deserve an answer. To the seller it's a signal you are a suspicious bidder waiting to be a troublesome buyer.

Alex

That is a very odd statement you did.
It would render you an extremely low level of trustworhtiness.
Of course a serious/interested buyer has the right to get an answer.

 

[wgerrard]

Why should the seller waste their time on a suspicious bidder when it is much easier to sell to bidder not sending up such red flags?
Alex

By itself, that is one big reason I do not buy at ebay. If you're selling something, you have an obligation to answer questions, period.

I expect to be treated on ebay like I expect to be treated in any retail store. If I asked a question in a brick-and-mortar store that annoyed the clerk so much that he/she refused to answer, and then had the nerve to put me on some kind of internal blacklist of "bad customers", I'd raise a stink in the store, then go home and call the consumer protection office at my state's office of the attorney general. The notion that a customer on ebay has to contend with feedback from sellers is a complete turnoff.

In this instance, if the seller claims a recent CLA, then you are, in essence, buying that CLA and you have every right to expect to receive documentation confirming it took place as advertised. Even then, it would be easy for a seller to work a scam with someone else to 'verify' CLA's.

There's a reason people ask ebay sellers questions that amount to "Are you being honest?".

 

[btgc]

I can't believe that sellers of rather expensive gear like you are talking about here don't put two things next to description: one is clearly readable scan of receipt or "approval paper" from some reputable CLA authority (I wouldn't trust neighbour guy with screwdriver like me) and "that or that papers which were received with camera when came back CLA'ed - WILL BE INCLUDED IN PACKAGE".
If seller lost receipt, he can say "camera is clean and runs smoothly", but not claim it's CLAed recently. Just my thoughts...

 

[Pherdinand]

CSB, that is just plain ridiculous.
You are sending thousand bucks to a totally unknown person somewhere on the globe, via internet, and you think it is not ok to ask one stupid question? Is that a "troublesome buyer" sign??

Even high volume sellers can find two minutes to read a question and answer in a one-liner. It's not about buying a roll of film.

 

[cosmonot]

FWIW, my CLA'd OM bodies have a sticker inside from John H. at Camtech (the best!) stating the date at which service was done. Some of them will be for sale soon, and I hope buyers take that into account 😉 I save paperwork for lenses that have been CLA'd as well, but it only really matters if the serial # is mentioned in the work order.

All the paperwork for the repairs on the Leicas has been saved. Sherry K. seems to be pretty good about listing the details on each piece she works on. If/when resale time comes (I prefer not to think about that) I'd like to have something to show that the gear was taken care of, even if it's just a scan up on a ebay auction.

 

[greyhoundman]

Hmmmmm I'll refrain from using CLA for any of my gear.

 

[wgerrard]

FWIW, my CLA'd OM bodies have a sticker inside from John H. at Camtech (the best!) stating the date at which service was done.

That seems like a good idea that merits being adopted by other service techs. It would allow customers to buy with increased confidence. If nothing else, customers could avoid cameras serviced by people they've never heard of. Since any paperwork can be faked, the buyer would have the option of verifying the CLA by contacting the technician.

Little about this is particularly unique to ebay. It's common for used car buyers to ask for verifiable documentation of all service work, and then to have the vehicle inspected by a tech of their choosing.

 

[HuubL]

If I were to sell my CLA'd (2006, Will van Manen) M4 I would mention it was CLA'd. Unfortunately, I don't have proof anymore. My wife threw the receipt away thinking it was a worthless piece of paper. I now realize that piece of paper is worth 200 US$:bang: :bang: Luckely I'm not planning selling it..

 

[chikne]

I bought an M from a Leica dealer in Central London a few years ago, it was and still is my first one. The shutter speed control was so hard to turn that my finger would hurt after fiddling with it too often, of course I didn't know that it could be a lot smoother.
Then after a couple a weeks I found out that the rangefinder was sticky, I brought it in to have it serviced. They kept it for 3 BLOODY WEEKS, when I got it back, the shutter control was just as hard and the rangefinder was sticky.

They finally fixed it after the second CLA and another 3 weeks, though I'm pretty sure they didn't touch it the first time...