Sad day for me - my M9 died

As much as I complain about the quality/reliability of M Digital Leicas, the one thing they do right is the one thing I care about the most. They essentially are film cameras with digital backs, and that is really all I want. And no-one else does that.

If Cosina stepped up and made a digital Zeiss Ikon ZM, then I'd be there.
 
xichlo said:
Nothing wrong with putting Leica lenses on other bodies, people are doing that with Sony A7xx.
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But they are so miserable to use with adapted lenses. Tried it, hated it. Feels like a computer with a lens. And they don't work well with most 50 and under glass. Most 50s are ok, but Summilux Asph etc suffer.
 
Huss said:
As much as I complain about the quality/reliability of M Digital Leicas, the one thing they do right is the one thing I care about the most. They essentially are film cameras with digital backs, and that is really all I want. And no-one else does that.

If Cosina stepped up and made a digital Zeiss Ikon ZM, then I'd be there.
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Cosina should bring back the R-D1 with an updated sensor. The RD-1 is closer to a film camera with a digital back than any digital Leica is.

Shawn
 
I recently bought a used M240, partly in anticipation of the day when my M8.2 will die.

I do like CCDs and strongly considered an M9 with a replacement sensor. But so far my M8.2 is working fine, and aside from the crop factor the output would have been very similar. Based on the pricing it seems many people keep their M9 even when they upgrade.
 
Huss said:
But they are so miserable to use with adapted lenses. Tried it, hated it. Feels like a computer with a lens. And they don't work well with most 50 and under glass. Most 50s are ok, but Summilux Asph etc suffer.
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I agree with you about feeling like a computer with a lens ; although I don`t notice any problems with my 28 Summicron asph ,50 Summicron and 90 elmarit .

Thing is I have little need for manual focus lenses these days and the Sony body ,despite as you say feeling more like a TV remote ,is therefore a good compromise given that I also use it with three Zeiss Batis AF lenses.

I have thought of an M digital body many times but ,despite the superior ergonomics and feel ,it doesn`t represent value for money for me .

It`s all about flexibility .
 
Once setup with adapted lenses there isn't much of a reason to menu dive. Aperture on the lens, shutter on a command dial, iso mapped to a button and a button to toggle between evf and lcd. Main thing I go into the menus for is to turn on electronic first curtain or not when shooting action.

Shawn
 
raid said:
This is the price for having a slim looking camera that resembles a film camera while DSLRs look very bulky. Is this the main reason for Leica dying earlier?
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Many other examples of slim body digital cameras do not have these problems. The problem is initially Leica had to outsource the critical sensor assembly design and manufacturing quality assurance to others. This affected M8 and M9 sensor assembly reliability.

It is fair to state a fundamental product specification for a digital M camera is an imperceptible difference in body thickness compared to a Film M body. Meeting this requirement was a significant technical challenge. This only compounded the difficulties in relying on third-party expertise.

Fourteen years after the M8, Leica has acquired enough in-house digital electronics experience to produce digital cameras with robust sensor assemblies. The thin bodied M240 and M10 are no different than other brands in this regard.
 
David Hughes said:
Trouble is we only learn about the dud ones. There might be thousands out there unaffected. Leica could do a little more to reassure us...


Regards, David
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All the M8s have IR contamination issues and all the original M9 sensor cover glasses will exhibit IR filter layer corrosion. While other M8 and M9 problems (cover glass cracking, black vertical line failure and storage card incompatibilities) are less common, these types of electronic issues are rare for other brands from the same time period. The most common non-Leica failures involve mechanical shutters and lens electronics contact corrosion.
 
I have both the M 262(stripped down M 240) and M 10 and I would get the M 10. It is more responsive, better in low light and I like having the ISO dial on the top. I would do that or get the M 9 fixed. I liked my M 10 so much I bought another one.

I went all Leica a little over 4 years ago even for my pro work. Even with the recalls on my original MM and my M-E I have had less problems than I had with my Canons.

I went Canon digital in 2005 and had Canon digital for about a decade and I had far more issues with them than I have had with my Leica's. When NATO was in town in 2112 I did some work for them and I had a complete shutter failure on one of my Canons. I also had a 1Ds III show up from CPS dead on arrival.

The reason I say this is not to rip on Canon. I think they make great cameras, but to point out all mechanical and electrical things can and probably will break down at some point. Some are lucky with A and others have luck with B. Choose your poison.

One thing Canon does really well is service. CPS, for the most part, is really outstanding.

My original MM still rocking at 8 years old (heavy use and banged around some. I am not easy on equipment) with the sensor replacement as the only issue.
 
shawn said:
Once setup with adapted lenses there isn't much of a reason to menu dive. Aperture on the lens, shutter on a command dial, iso mapped to a button and a button to toggle between evf and lcd. Main thing I go into the menus for is to turn on electronic first curtain or not when shooting action.

Shawn
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I agree Shawn …. the menu diving only starts if you have AF glass on the bodies and want to make use of the full system capabilities.
Other than that ,with manual glass , its simple.
The menu argument is a red herring .
 
Leica NJ asked me to send them the camera body for inspection. I will do that and let you know about their estimation.
 
Bill Clark said:
Can you folks explain to me why you put up with that quality and longevity?

Sorry, I wouldn’t think of buying any Leica with electronics.

They must not care.
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Here is why for me. When film was the predominant medium, the film and chemistry were the consumable/disposable/single use components of the photography chain. When cameras became predominantly digital, this shifted to the cameras themselves being that consumable component of the chain. Want more resolution? Better ISO? No longer buy a new/improved film, you need to buy a new camera.

To me, it is wrong headed to think that an electronic system where you effectively pay nothing for individual photos should or will last indefinitely. You're using it up every time you press the shutter button.

Taking film photos, for me, costs about $AU0.3 per frame, once I consider film, chemistry etc. That's without my time to develop the film, which I need to do to see what I have. I take about 10,000 frames a year, of which a majority are for my work as a scientist. So if my Leica digital lasts 3.5 years I am already ahead financially on a $AU10K camera. Over the last 5 years I have got well ahead on my Typ246 and I get further ahead the more I use it. When I get an M10M the same will apply, and I plan to use it even harder.

Leica cares enough to design and build a camera that has what no other manufacturer delivers - a small camera with a monochrome digital sensor, simple controls and menus, for which there is really excellent glass available.

People say 'why would you?' I say "why wouldn't I?'

Marty
 
Huss said:
Remember when Leica advertised their digital M as lifetime cameras?
So much for that.

I’ve seen M240s at the $2k mark and they are rock solid. M10 is now $4500 used even though they are selling at $7200 new. The M-E is about $4k new right now. This is the version based on the 240.
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They meant the lifetime of the camera . . .
 
raid said:
I am actively using an M8 (once repaired) and an M9 (its third sensor in place). Both cameras work fine now. I am not fooling myself to believe that either M I own will last for another ten years. Therefore, I have been scouting the market for an additional digital M or SL or SL2. I am getting more and more inclined to look for an M10. The M8 shows a vertical white line when shooting at ISO 1000 or higher. The M9 "is hanging in there".
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Didn't you send the M8 in for vertical line issue in the last year or so and now the line has returned. $$$$$

I would consider Sony body like used A7II or A7RII for Leica glass and so many other fun options. The Leica bodies are an expensive gamble that I'm no longer willing to take. Been there, done that!:bang:
 
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