Sensor Replacement Policy 2017

The thing I would worry about if I were an M9 owner is..why exactly now...in other words..why charge for all this right now..as of Aug 2017..when the truth of the matter is..Leica sold M9s with crappy sensors for years...and now want to charge for replacements..when the entire matter was 100% their fault to begin with..
So..
Are they finally running out of sensors..is the day coming soon..when the M9 is going the way of the M8..and suddenly..no sensors available anymore...as in..we aint fixin them anymore...so just..buy an M10..and put your M9 away ..for good..
 
If you have a sensor replaced in 2015 or earlier just make sure it wasn't replaced with the 'old' sensor.

If it was replaced with the 'old' sensor, have you camera checked for corrosion before august. Not sure how Leica will treat replaced 'old' sensors gone bad. Probably there will be a good arrangement since the problem is almost certainly going to come back with these sensors.
 
Both my Monochrom and M9-P (corrosion developed after 140 pictures!) are having new sensor replaced but I have to rant here: what a lame **** Leica is!
And I will repeat here what I have written in other thread as well - based on my experience I think that EVERY SINGLE M9 type of camera will develop corrosion sooner or later.
 
There is no evidence of the corrosion problem being universal. In fact, the number of reports in the forums has dropped to nearly zero. So let's not start a myth. My M9 from 12 September 2009 does not show any trace, for instance.
Having said that, I think Leica lost a lot of credibility by this change of policy - I for one am quite negative about it.
 
Rayt said:
I have a low mileage CCD MM with no issues so far but understand it is inevitable. So I can choose to "upgrade" to a CMOS MM now or later when the problem is confirmed?
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Unfortunately, you can't do this a prophylactic basis. They will replace the sensor or offer you the upgrade to the CMOS MM once the symptoms are in.
 
jaapv said:
There is no evidence of the corrosion problem being universal.
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Hmmmm...I was under the impression that humidity will eventually corrode the M9/MM CCD sensor. I live in the NYC area, which is hot and humid in the summer. My M9's sensor was corroded after 4 years (admittedly with a few wet cleanings too). My MM still has no symptoms, though I wish it would so that I can get it over with.
 
JMQ said:
Hmmmm...I was under the impression that humidity will eventually corrode the M9/MM CCD sensor. I live in the NYC area, which is hot and humid in the summer. My M9's sensor was corroded after 4 years (admittedly with a few wet cleanings too). My MM still has no symptoms, though I wish it would so that I can get it over with.
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I had the same experience but with a Monochrom; two summers in New York, and the rot appeared. Since you live in northern NJ, you should take a quick ride to the Leica repair center there and have them look at it because it may be imperceptible to you or in a location on the sensor not readily noticed. It takes 15 minutes for them to confirm and since the policy has changed, it couldn't hurt. It's residual value with the old sensor will be nil since no one will be willing to risk it.
 
Out of 9 M9/M9-P/M-E/Monochrom bodies that I owned in last 6 years 7 had sensor replaced. For those 2 remaining I dont know only because I am not in touch with current owners.
Plus I know 6 people around me experiencing corrosion.

jaapv said:
There is no evidence of the corrosion problem being universal. In fact, the number of reports in the forums has dropped to nearly zero. So let's not start a myth. My M9 from 12 September 2009 does not show any trace, for instance.
Having said that, I think Leica lost a lot of credibility by this change of policy - I for one am quite negative about it.
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james.liam said:
I had the same experience but with a Monochrom; two summers in New York, and the rot appeared. Since you live in northern NJ, you should take a quick ride to the Leica repair center there and have them look at it because it may be imperceptible to you or in a location on the sensor not readily noticed. It takes 15 minutes for them to confirm and since the policy has changed, it couldn't hurt. It's residual value with the old sensor will be nil since no one will be willing to risk it.
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I will defintely drive over to Allendale to have them check it out prior to my MM's 5th year anniversary. Thanks James.
 
I think a reasonable hypothesis for the onset of IR filter layer corrosion is:

  • During manufacturing the sensor cover glass coating was misapplied. This resulted in invisible, physical channels for water intrusion (usually in the form of water vapor) that slowly delaminates the IR filter layer. All sensor assemblies in this catagory will eventually become defective. By now, practically all of these will qualify for replacement.

    OR
  • The protective cover glass works as intended. Water vapor can not reach the IR filter glass. The IR filter will retain it's integrety indefinitely. However, if the sensor cover glass coating is compromised due to physical contact (usually during cleaning) water vapor can reach the IR filter and delamination will occur. The rate of corrosion could be very slow when the post-manufacturing cover-glass damage is slight (e.g. an extremely shallow scratch during cleaning).

    Given the reports that some original sensors remain corrosion free, it seems reasonable to assume thermal contraction and expansion alone does not compromise the cover-glass protective coating.

So:

If your M9's original sensor is corrosion free, be extremely careful when it's time to clean it.

After August, do not buy a M9 with an original sensor unless you have about $1K set aside and don't mind waiting for a repair. That said, low levels of delamination are only visible at the narrowest lens apertures. Photographers who rarely use high f stops might be able to avoid replacement for many years.
 
A little more lead time of the date the change in policy comes into effect might have been helpful. Perhaps to the end of the year?

For those who own an M9 without the sensor replacement it might be prudent to check now. From the Q&A at the Leica announcement it seems that they honor the goodwill program from the date the problem is reported to Leica.
 
raid said:
This does not sound good. Basically, Leica is moving users to the M10.
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And perhaps to a Sony A8/9.....

Leica has been building up a LOT of Good Will over the past few years. Do it at cost of parts and 1/4 labor costs as a program.

They will be amazed at how fast Good Will can vaporize in this world of instant gratification.

B2 (;->
 
JMQ said:
It's also the hassle of having to wait 4-5 months in addition to the cost...I don't know about sensors being immune, I thought it's a matter of "when" and not "if"
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Jean-Marc,

The wait is actually 6 months, but there is also a list that allows one to keep their camera for 4 months to use. I did this and was told the turnaround would be 8-10 weeks, but it ended up being 12 weeks. Know there are 4.3 weeks in a month.

Of course this was of no cost to me, not even shipping, nada.

So the real wait is just under 3 months in my experience, and only if one gets on this list. I know Mervyn sent his MM in and waited a full six months, but know you don't have to.

Cal
 
BillBingham2 said:
And perhaps to a Sony A8/9.....

Leica has been building up a LOT of Good Will over the past few years. Do it at cost of parts and 1/4 labor costs as a program.

They will be amazed at how fast Good Will can vaporize in this world of instant gratification.

B2 (;->
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Yeah, I could understand dropping the free repair for second-hand owners. But for original owners?

That's just not right because it's a defective product. One that they kept selling with a commitment to make it good, if necessary.

John
 
It is not dropped for second hand owners. That would be illegal for a german company and is not stated in Leica's announcement.
It is dropped for cameras with an original purchase date five years ago or more.
 
Keith said:
This will have to create a few M9 bricks unfortunately ... but not too many hopefully.

As someone pointed out the party couldn't last forever.
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Keith,

In my case I am a pleased MM owner who really enjoys my camera. Having my sensor replaced for free (not even charged for shipping), and basically having my 5 year old camera CLA'ed and updated for free was a bonus.

So what I waited 12 weeks. Oh-well.

To bridge me over I ended up buying a Leica SL.

I have no bricks to throw.

Cal
 
Bottom line is..to Leica owners...1K...isn't that big of a deal...not that much to spend on this kind of a fix..it allows Leica to make a profit..and continue in the M business..so you are really just supporting Leica that's all...lol...
 
jaapv said:
It is not dropped for second hand owners. That would be illegal for a german company and is not stated in Leica's announcement.
It is dropped for cameras with an original purchase date five years ago or more.
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Yes, upon more careful reading I see that's the case. An important clarification. Thanks.

John
 
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