Should I buy a...?

[Charly]

This comes across as a bit of a dig at me since I recently posted something similar to the TLR forum.

I'm not experienced with TLRs or any MF gear at all. The reason for asking was simple - to find out if there was anything I ought to avoid due to mechanical fragility or being over valued by collectors. Additionally, it could have been that there are "hidden gems" - unloved but very capable equipment that would suit me well.

To follow Roger's analogy into cars, compare a Mk1 Golf GTi with a Peugeot 205 GTi. Given a similar condition and price, which is better? I might be a girl but I know a few things about spanners from a mispent youth and I can promise you that for my money, the choice is very easy and very German. Is it better to drive? not really. Is it better made and easier to fix? Definitely! How do I know? I've owned both. I was simply looking for advice upon similar lines based upon similar experience. No shame in that - unlike how much of this thread has continued.

 

[kevin m]

Charly, I don't know about the other replies in this thread, but I don't think the original question was intended as a dig at anyone. He was just asking how the advice might vary considering the cameras in question are now 50 years old. 🙂

I agree with you about the Mk1 VW, btw! 😀

 

[ClaremontPhoto]

In the past thirty minutes I have received an email:

RFF is going nowhere with this gear obsession

Wake up Stephen and back alley. Widen it up and embrace the diversity of interests, buyers, members. Also, be nice to people even when they disagree with you.

 

[Dave Wilkinson]

there are many misguided folks out there that believe a non interest in gear makes them 'artists'!
and that being an artist makes them better than those who have an interest in gear.

i pity them.

I cut and shaped metal on machine tools for forty years, and still like it!,-and I'll happily sit and discuss lathes, millers, etc. and how to get the best out of them! - so what's the problem here? 🙁

Dave.

 

[oscroft]

In a few days back alley will be asking about a Zeiss Ikon lens hood, and I'll be talking about a photo

And what's wrong with either of those?

 

[ClaremontPhoto]

Photography is science and art.

Both together lead to good outcomes.

At Lomo there is typically a lot of art, and not so much science.

At RFF there is sometimes too much science, and not so much art.

Some of us try to keep the science and art in balance.

One RFF member recently told me they had gone to an RFF meet. There was in-depth talk about cameras, but no talk about images.

That's like going to a Ferrari owners' meeting and taking the car on a trailer.

 

[ferider]

Wake up Stephen and back alley. Widen it up and embrace the diversity of interests, buyers, members. Also, be nice to people even when they disagree with you.

Hmm. So Joe is lacking nicety and tolerance ?

I suspect the 'should I buy' crowd are drama queens who need attention.

Like this ?

 

[ClaremontPhoto]

And what's wrong with either of those?

Nothing wrong at all. It's just the way we live here. He'll do his thing, and I'll do mine. End of story. We've done it for years.

 

[back alley]

In different times, the saying was I take offense, rather than, I am offended. It makes one an active participant in one's own emotional state, rather than the victim of whatever circumstance brings.

just to clarify, i do not feel like a victim and i'm not all that offended either.

my main point is that these people who claim to be into the images often make this claim as an attack on those who like the gear end of things.

i detest the 'moral superiority' expressed.

 

[back alley]

In the past thirty minutes I have received an email:



Wake up Stephen and back alley. Widen it up and embrace the diversity of interests, buyers, members. Also, be nice to people even when they disagree with you.

wake up yourself jon and look around at the changes here at rff.
there has been a greater emphasis on images of late.

if you really want to be useful, go to my flickr account and give me some feedback on my images, honest feedback that will help me grow as a photographer, instead of mocking me because i also like to discuss lens hoods.

joe

 

[back alley]

I cut and shaped metal on machine tools for forty years, and still like it!,-and I'll happily sit and discuss lathes, millers, etc. and how to get the best out of them! - so what's the problem here? 🙁

Dave.

no problem dave, i think we are in agreement.

joe

 

[kevin m]

i detest the 'moral superiority' expressed.

Ah, gotcha.

Happens alot around here, and I'm sure I've been guilty of it myself. It can be difficult to tell whether someone's being an intentional ass, or if they're just a bad writer. 😀

 

[oscroft]

Nothing wrong at all. It's just the way we live here. He'll do his thing, and I'll do mine. End of story. We've done it for years.

So what's the problem? The www is a huge marketplace with many sites contributing to the supply and many people providing the demand, and it is up to us as individuals to visit the sites that give us what we want rather than criticise the sites that don't. Would you complain about the butcher because he won't sell you bread? No, you'd go to the baker. Likewise if RFF has a booming membership who might talk more about cameras than about images, what should you do? Should you treat RFF like the butcher who won't sell you bread, or should you appreciate the meat he sells and go get your bread elsewhere? It seems simple enough to me.

 

[back alley]

Ah, gotcha.

Happens alot around here, and I'm sure I've been guilty of it myself. It can be difficult to tell whether someone's being an intentional ass, or if they're just a bad writer. 😀

sorry kevin, i wasn't directing that last statement at you.

the internet has to be the best worst place to attempt direct communication.

 

[back alley]

So what's the problem? The www is a huge marketplace with many sites contributing to the supply and many people providing the demand, and it is up to us as individuals to visit the sites that give us what we want rather than criticise the sites that don't. Would you complain about the butcher because he won't sell you bread? No, you'd go to the baker. Likewise if RFF has a booming membership who might talk more about cameras than about images, what should you do? Should you treat RFF like the butcher who won't sell you bread, or should you appreciate the meat he sells and go get your bread elsewhere? It seems simple enough to me.

i wish i could have said it as well as you sir.

joe

 

[kevin m]

the internet has to be the best worst place to attempt direct communication.

True. I think it's just as bad as the automobile. Both the computer screen and the windshield seem to amp up the aggravation level.

 

[ClaremontPhoto]

My father loves cameras, typewriters and lawnmowers. He collects them.

One day I'll inherit some Barnack Leicas, a Reid with a Taylor Taylor Hobson lens, an Alpa, some Rolleis and so on.

When we talk, he talks cameras, and I talk photos. We get on just fine.

 

[oscroft]

i wish i could have said it as well as you sir.

And you, sir, are very kind 🙂

 

[ClaremontPhoto]

if you really want to be useful, go to my flickr account and give me some feedback on my images, honest feedback that will help me grow as a photographer, instead of mocking me because i also like to discuss lens hoods.

I recall about six months back I gave you a lot of help getting your avatar and business card looking right. A photo of a mailbox with your name superimposed on it.

Other people helped you also.

You never thanked any of us.

 

[oscroft]

Hi Jon,

I recall about six months back I gave you a lot of help getting your avatar and business card looking right. A photo of a mailbox with your name superimposed on it.

Other people helped you also.

You never thanked any of us

I hope you'll take this the right way, because it's meant constructively - I know you only from reading quite a few of your posts, and I know Joe only from his (much appreciated) work in the running of this site and his posts, and on those counts I have respect for you both. But this really is beginning to look like you're getting more petty by the post and turning what might initially have been a valid critique of RFF into a personal spat. And I have to say Joe is the one who's looking the more grown-up right now.

Best regards,