SP 2005 noisy focusing - US-based repairperson?

[Steinberg2010]

So I recently acquired an SP 2005 set (kind of a grail camera for me). It seems to be in excellent shape (unused) in terms of usability except for a little noise when focusing (intermittent squeak). I'm guessing that it needs a bit more lubrication (perhaps the original lubricants have dried out a bit?).

I've seen Richard Haw's excellent blog and I'm not necessarily completely against attempting this repair/adjustment myself (although I have essentially zero experience in this area - so far I have only done vertical alignment on Leica's). However, I'm also interested in advice from others who've done things like this before - particularly:

How much disassembly would be required? I can see that at the minimum I need to take the front plate off and then the helicoid too? I don't want to remove any glass from the windows if at all possible (I saw Richard cleaned those first - mine seem completely clear though). Or is there a way to lubricate this without disassembly?

Would I need to flush/clean the focusing gears first? I have no solvents for this and Richard seems to use naphtha/alcohol to clean the focusing gears.

Do I need to fully disassemble the helicoid as well (definitely beyond my comfort level/tools/solvents)?

Alternatively, I'm very willing to pay someone to work on this for me. However, I've struggled to find someone who still works on these cameras.

I emailed DAG and he said he was focusing on Leica hardware right now.
I emailed Stephen Gandy about an S2 and he said he no longer offered classic camera repair (unclear if this was Nikon RF specific).
I walked into Nippon Photoclinic in Manhattan and their receptionist said that they did not work on Nikon S2s (however, she was willing to ask the tech when they came in - it never got that far for unrelated reasons).

So all that being said - who do we know who actually does work on these in 2023? I've always found this site to be a useful resource for repairs and I'm guessing someone on here knows someone who works on these...

I don't want to hand this machine over to just anyone as it's actually unused (still has the paper over the shutter). I want to use it in perpetuity (as far as film is available). But I feel like I keep drawing blanks...

Thanks in advance!

~S

 

[Pál_K]

How much have you used the camera?

Is focusing stiff or are there places where focusing isn’t smooth as you focus across the full range?

Maybe a few days use will cause existing lubricant to spread within the focusing helical?

 

[Rayt]

Is this your first Nikon RF? Focusing is not going to be as smooth as Leica lenses. I owned the S3 Millennium and it did squeak a little If I turned the lens too quickly.

 

[Steinberg2010]

How much have you used the camera?

Is focusing stiff or are there places where focusing isn’t smooth as you focus across the full range?

Maybe a few days use will cause existing lubricant to spread within the focusing helical?

It’s interesting. I remounted the 35/1.8 and compared. The 35 is much smoother (perhaps from the external helicoil?). After remounting the 50mm SC it was less noisy and smoother. Perhaps after a while it will even out or perhaps break in. I think I shall shoot a few rolls and run with it. I did notice it seemed easier to run the focus from infinity to close and stiffer the other way. I felt greater resistance around 1.5m. Interestingly, it was stiffer without a lens mounted at all.

 

[Steinberg2010]

Is this your first Nikon RF? Focusing is not going to be as smooth as Leica lenses. I owned the S3 Millennium and it did squeak a little If I turned the lens too quickly.

Sort of - I originally got into this rabbit hole via an S3 2000 that I bought from a well-known NY retailer (used). However, it had problems shifting from high to low speeds (it would lock open at 1s as if on T) - I returned it after shooting a test roll through it. Loved the millennium 50 though.

 

[Miles.]

Jim at Vermont Camera Works has done good work for me (and others) with Nikon rangefinders and this would be an easy fix for him. Henry Scherer may take on the project as well but I wouldn't count on that (he's worked on Nikon rangefinder lenses for me but not bodies).

If someone is reading this in Asia then I'd recommend Kiitos and Kanto Camera. If Europe I'd likely contact Oleg at Okvintagecamera.

 

[Miles.]

It’s interesting. I remounted the 35/1.8 and compared. The 35 is much smoother (perhaps from the external helicoil?). After remounting the 50mm SC it was less noisy and smoother. Perhaps after a while it will even out or perhaps break in. I think I shall shoot a few rolls and run with it. I did notice it seemed easier to run the focus from infinity to close and stiffer the other way. I felt greater resistance around 1.5m. Interestingly, it was stiffer without a lens mounted at all.

Your experience is normal here. Things may improve greatly with a few rolls but my hunch is it wouldn't get to "perfect." Happy to be wrong.

 

[Steinberg2010]

Your experience is normal here. Things may improve greatly with a few rolls but my hunch is it wouldn't get to "perfect." Happy to be wrong.

Maybe - the S2 I mentioned in my first post was ‘Leica’ smooth and the S3 2000 was noticeably smoother than this SP. But both ended up being returned for their various issues. I do wonder if this will break in after a few rolls. It can’t be accumulated dirt or debris if it’s never been used!

 

[Sonnar Brian]

The 35/1.8 and other external mount lenses take the weight off the internal helical. Maybe it needs a little exercise.

Are you using the Sonnar formula 5cm F1.4 Nikkor-SC? Which version, chrome or black? The later Black 5cm F1.4 is lighter, really should not be too much for an SP helical. The new Millenium Nikkor 50/1.4 is a bit heavier, but never was an issue for my S3-2000 or original SP.

Removing the helical requires some work, not bad- but you need to be comfortable and have exactly the right fit screwdrivers. I've done this for a couple of S2 bodies, and removed the face plate of the SP, S3, S2, S4. The screw on the side of the SP can get stuck and it stripped on mine. Long time to cut a new slot with an exacto knife.

 

[enasniearth]

if you haven't taken a Nikon rf apart I wouldn't start with such an expensive one
you can mar the screws -- scratch the black paint parts ,
under the focus mount are small brass circular shims on each screw that
if you are not careful can fall into the body - once you get the helicoid out
you have to remove the infinity lock parts
the helicoid is lubricated with a special lubricant that you probably won't find

use the camera for awhile -- its new but 18 years old now - and probably will improve with use

 

[Sonnar Brian]

The service instructions for the original Nikon SP called for soaking the helical in gasoline. The additives in the gas penetrated into the metal, acted as a lubricant. Discussed this 20+ years ago with my mechanical engineer. It worked- but would not suggest anyone try this out without having a good bit of experience. The camera - was missing two of the shims from someone else working on it, so I had to take it apart. I shimmed it for a 50/1.5 Sonnar and adjusted the RF to focus properly with it. Used an 8ft optics bench for the work, advantage of having an office in an optics lab.

 

[enasniearth]

I have an original sp service manual
It states that the helicoid is lubricated
With a special substance that is unavailible
It recommends cleaning one surface only and reassembling
This is all 1950’s tech
It’s likely that the sp 2005 helicoid is lubricated with a synthetic silicon based lube - so completely different tech
On the older helicoid on an s2
I cleaned both parts with a toothbrush
& toothpaste — washed thoughly then used a drop of special silicone oil that I spread carefully with a q tip the least you can use is the best
Oil attracts dirt which can quickly cause the problem to return
It’s dust in the mount usually in combo with the old lubricant

 

[Steinberg2010]

The 35/1.8 and other external mount lenses take the weight off the internal helical. Maybe it needs a little exercise.

Are you using the Sonnar formula 5cm F1.4 Nikkor-SC? Which version, chrome or black? The later Black 5cm F1.4 is lighter, really should not be too much for an SP helical. The new Millenium Nikkor 50/1.4 is a bit heavier, but never was an issue for my S3-2000 or original SP.

Removing the helical requires some work, not bad- but you need to be comfortable and have exactly the right fit screwdrivers. I've done this for a couple of S2 bodies, and removed the face plate of the SP, S3, S2, S4. The screw on the side of the SP can get stuck and it stripped on mine. Long time to cut a new slot with an exacto knife.

The service instructions for the original Nikon SP called for soaking the helical in gasoline. The additives in the gas penetrated into the metal, acted as a lubricant. Discussed this 20+ years ago with my mechanical engineer. It worked- but would not suggest anyone try this out without having a good bit of experience. The camera - was missing two of the shims from someone else working on it, so I had to take it apart. I shimmed it for a 50/1.5 Sonnar and adjusted the RF to focus properly with it. Used an 8ft optics bench for the work, advantage of having an office in an optics lab.

Yes - the more I think about this the less sane it seems. Clearly, the camera otherwise is functioning fine (pending test roll for light leaks/egregious focusing errors etc.) No point in me disassembling as an inexperienced first timer. It would make sense for me to shoot several rolls and break it in - if the problem persists, I'll give Vermont Camera Repair a shot. It would at least give me an excuse to get some great hiking in!

if you haven't taken a Nikon rf apart I wouldn't start with such an expensive one
you can mar the screws -- scratch the black paint parts ,
under the focus mount are small brass circular shims on each screw that
if you are not careful can fall into the body - once you get the helicoid out
you have to remove the infinity lock parts
the helicoid is lubricated with a special lubricant that you probably won't find

use the camera for awhile -- its new but 18 years old now - and probably will improve with use

Agreed in retrospect - the odds of me screwing this up and getting out of my depth are too high for it to be worth it!

 

[enasniearth]

Your camera is so new I wouldn’t risk trying to relube
Shoot with it for a couple months
A new car always runs not great untill parts wear in

 

[splitimageview]

DAG would be my choice if you send it out.

@jonmanjiro has experience with Nikon helicals. Might want to drop him a PM. 😀

 

[Steinberg2010]

DAG would be my choice if you send it out.

@jonmanjiro has experience with Nikon helicals. Might want to drop him a PM. 😀

I emailed DAG (see first post of the thread). He’s avoiding non-Leica work at the moment.

 

[splitimageview]

You might try procamera.us or Gus Lazarri although I’m sure the latter is back logged months.

 

[splitimageview]

@jonmanjiro :

Nikon S3 2000 - Squeaky Helical

Hello all, I'm new to the forum, having just purchased an unused (supposedly, anyway :)) Nikon S3 2000 reissue. It appears I'm having an issue some others mentioned, which is a squeaky helical. I have read some other posts on the topic, but wasn't sure if it was better to bring up old threads...

www.rangefinderforum.com

 

[Gordon Moat]

I have an S3 2000. Same squeaky focus issue. Took some watch oil and lubed the helical through the back, leaving the shutter open on the T setting. Watch oil comes out a tiny bit at a time, so it took several applications, and working the mechanism, to get the squeak to stop. Now it’s completely smooth full range of focus. No disassembly required. I used Liberty 100% Synthetic Oil, which I got through EBAY.

 

[Steinberg2010]

You might try procamera.us or Gus Lazarri although I’m sure the latter is back logged months.

I've had a good experience with procamera in the past and would certainly be willing to work with them again, I remember the pricing seeming reasonable and the work was good.

@jonmanjiro :

Nikon S3 2000 - Squeaky Helical

Hello all, I'm new to the forum, having just purchased an unused (supposedly, anyway :)) Nikon S3 2000 reissue. It appears I'm having an issue some others mentioned, which is a squeaky helical. I have read some other posts on the topic, but wasn't sure if it was better to bring up old threads...

www.rangefinderforum.com

Yes - I saw this thread and it seemed like @Sonnar Brian had lubricated his from inside the body, but without disassembly (which was what I had in mind originally).

I have an S3 2000. Same squeaky focus issue. Took some watch oil and lubed the helical through the back, leaving the shutter open on the T setting. Watch oil comes out a tiny bit at a time, so it took several applications, and working the mechanism, to get the squeak to stop. Now it’s completely smooth full range of focus. No disassembly required. I used Liberty 100% Synthetic Oil, which I got through EBAY.

This was what I had in mind - I tried putting my camera on T and I was unsure exactly which bit I would be aiming to lube. I'm guessing the outside of the ring?
Regardless - as stated above, I'm thinking of using it as is for a while and seeing how things go before doing anything drastic.