ampguy
Veteran
well
well
What if I told you that just prior to my photographing, she told him "I went to the doctor today, and he told me the results" ...
Now that didn't happen, but my point of this thread was that many newbie street photographers think that they have to take photos first, then run away or fight, or complain they had the right to, etc. and if they had asked first, then the "moment would be lost"
Well that is not necessarily the case, as I have proven here. People in street photos deserve respect and dignity, no matter who they are. Furthermore, they don't need to be Tom Cruise or Meryl Streep to just go back to what they were doing if asked politely, after first accepting to be photographed by a stranger.
well
What if I told you that just prior to my photographing, she told him "I went to the doctor today, and he told me the results" ...
Now that didn't happen, but my point of this thread was that many newbie street photographers think that they have to take photos first, then run away or fight, or complain they had the right to, etc. and if they had asked first, then the "moment would be lost"
Well that is not necessarily the case, as I have proven here. People in street photos deserve respect and dignity, no matter who they are. Furthermore, they don't need to be Tom Cruise or Meryl Streep to just go back to what they were doing if asked politely, after first accepting to be photographed by a stranger.
Pherdinand
the snow must go on
Yes, but THERE WAS NO MOMENT.
I thought you were joking when you mentioned the decisive moment...
I thought you were joking when you mentioned the decisive moment...
tomalophicon
Well-known
SolaresLarrave
My M5s need red dots!
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ampguy
Veteran
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Harry S.
Well-known
Im sorry ampguy, street wise its a bit of a non-photo for me too. Kudos on having the nerve to approach the people and take the photo, but the whole "No, stop smiling" and their expressions here is quite awkward.
In my opinion if you ask someone if you can take their photo, you take what they give you. Telling them to stop smiling is much ruder than sneaking the photo, and ethically I consider it the worst thing to do on the street. Would you do it if you hadn't got the idea from Mr. Gilden?
Thanks for having the chutzpah to intice this discussion.
In my opinion if you ask someone if you can take their photo, you take what they give you. Telling them to stop smiling is much ruder than sneaking the photo, and ethically I consider it the worst thing to do on the street. Would you do it if you hadn't got the idea from Mr. Gilden?
Thanks for having the chutzpah to intice this discussion.
ampguy
Veteran
hadn't noticed Gilden until now
hadn't noticed Gilden until now
I've heard his name and seen some of his stuff online, but didn't know he had used that phrase "don't smile or stop smiling" until I watched a youtube mini-documentary.
I don't shoot in that style at all. You must have missed the part about me asking if I could take their photo before I took it. From the youtube video, Gilden just goes down the street mouthing off and clicking in peoples faces with his flash. Other than the "stop smiling" words, used in different contexts here, I fail to see any similarities in our styles.
hadn't noticed Gilden until now
I've heard his name and seen some of his stuff online, but didn't know he had used that phrase "don't smile or stop smiling" until I watched a youtube mini-documentary.
I don't shoot in that style at all. You must have missed the part about me asking if I could take their photo before I took it. From the youtube video, Gilden just goes down the street mouthing off and clicking in peoples faces with his flash. Other than the "stop smiling" words, used in different contexts here, I fail to see any similarities in our styles.
Harry S.
Well-known
Re-read my post. I was comparing you to Gilden in the phrasing not the style. Whether you asked or not, if someone told me to stop smiling after I let them take my photo, id feel and look weird too.
ampguy
Veteran
ok
ok
I don't know how they feel, but I don't think they look weird, they look the way they did when I first saw them and decided I wanted a photo of them. They look pensive to me, as they did prior to my taking the photograph.
ok
I don't know how they feel, but I don't think they look weird, they look the way they did when I first saw them and decided I wanted a photo of them. They look pensive to me, as they did prior to my taking the photograph.
Keith
The best camera is one that still works!
This thread is surreal! 
rxmd
May contain traces of nut
Which brings us to a more philosophical question:
If there's a decisive moment and you don't see it, did it really happen?
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tomalophicon
Well-known
Or... How many Decisive Moments does it take to change a lightbulb?
Keith
The best camera is one that still works!
Actually I think there is a decisive moment in allmost any pic with people in it ... a sideways glance at the camera or another person, or an unexpected body movement.
None of which are happening in the first pic though ... it's really static and has that set in stone look to me.
None of which are happening in the first pic though ... it's really static and has that set in stone look to me.
Jamie123
Veteran
The decisive moment in this picture is the one at which the photographer should've decided not to waste a frame.
yanidel
Well-known
First, thanks for starting this interesting thread. indeed abit surrealist but some good points.
First and honestly, be it staged or not, the shot does not work in my opinion. There is no message, meaning or aesthetics in it except two people are having lunch. You refer to the "decisive moment", what was the decisive moment on that shot ? Why this second and not the next one ?
To the point of asking people in street photography .... better avoid it. Even if they are the best actors, in most cases you will have lost the authenticity of your scene and most above all, the moment that attracted your eyes in the first place.
Now just visualize some of the greatest street pictures of all times ... and imagine HCB Winogrand, Frank or Elliott nosy voice suddenly saying "Excuse me Madam, do you you mind if I take your picture ?". Do you think these pictures would have looked the same ?
First and honestly, be it staged or not, the shot does not work in my opinion. There is no message, meaning or aesthetics in it except two people are having lunch. You refer to the "decisive moment", what was the decisive moment on that shot ? Why this second and not the next one ?
To the point of asking people in street photography .... better avoid it. Even if they are the best actors, in most cases you will have lost the authenticity of your scene and most above all, the moment that attracted your eyes in the first place.
Now just visualize some of the greatest street pictures of all times ... and imagine HCB Winogrand, Frank or Elliott nosy voice suddenly saying "Excuse me Madam, do you you mind if I take your picture ?". Do you think these pictures would have looked the same ?
Sparrow
Veteran
alistair.o
Well-known
Bah! Now I have to get back in the shower!
Krosya
Konicaze
Of course there was no moment - if there was, it would have a cat in a photo. Just look at the thread with all the cat photos - so many " moments"
OurManInTangier
An Undesirable
I'm afraid I see nothing interesting in this shot either. That's not necessarily a reason NOT to take the shot, sometimes things happen unexpectedly and you end up with a good picture without quiet knowing how it happened. To me the issue is about editing and why you think this is good enough to have made it through that process...a process that is very subjective so whilst it may not work for me it may work for others.
I understand your point about respect and dignity within the sphere of street shooting but I don't believe, personally, that set-ups work very often. By photographing without waiting for permission I find that I get more interesting images that reflect the reason for tripping the shutter at that particular moment; the respect and dignity comes from how you act, move and most importantly from you initial intent, are you mocking a situation/individual or not. Even this is down to the individual. Look at the reaction to Martin Parr's work by some of his fellow Magnum photographers. He often says he pokes fun at society through individual situations rather than the individuals in his pictures whilst others simply find them to be mockery.
With regard to the question of how do photographers work so openly on the streets, in my own opinion and experience it is through having a clear idea of who you are, what your boundaries are and a great deal of practice so you no longer question your instinct and thus have a greater chance of getting the shot at the right moment; of course if you're making money from your images that in itself is a great motivator
I understand your point about respect and dignity within the sphere of street shooting but I don't believe, personally, that set-ups work very often. By photographing without waiting for permission I find that I get more interesting images that reflect the reason for tripping the shutter at that particular moment; the respect and dignity comes from how you act, move and most importantly from you initial intent, are you mocking a situation/individual or not. Even this is down to the individual. Look at the reaction to Martin Parr's work by some of his fellow Magnum photographers. He often says he pokes fun at society through individual situations rather than the individuals in his pictures whilst others simply find them to be mockery.
With regard to the question of how do photographers work so openly on the streets, in my own opinion and experience it is through having a clear idea of who you are, what your boundaries are and a great deal of practice so you no longer question your instinct and thus have a greater chance of getting the shot at the right moment; of course if you're making money from your images that in itself is a great motivator
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sanmich
Veteran
+1 (and the 10 char...)