The ultimate question on Soviet RF cameras:

Listen to Dee !.
Otherwise the only one is a Zorki 1, late model with the stronger body, simple, works, easy to clean AND looks like a Leica. Mine is super quiet and smooth as butter after a clean and oil change (I have others that are dogs in the shoe box sshh!) . I too have spent my time with a love / hate relationship with Kiev. So if you want something better than a Zorki/Fed 1 buy a Cannon or Leica.

Where's Ruben !!

(Oh I forgot he's gone digital and his G1 is the best ever digital, luv ya Ruben.)

ron
 
pmu said:
So, which one is the best* of them all?

* = Biggest, brightest and most accurate viewfinder, most reliable in operation, most accurate shutter speeds etc....those are the things that interest me the most :)
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Ask a load of FSU nuts and some disillusioned owners/former owners and you'll end up with a lot of opinions! Try asking what you want from one first.

Reliability can always be an issue, they're all old and most go unserviced. Quality control was dubious, more so the newer the model. If you're willing to tinker or pay out more than one is actually "worth" for a known serviced/guaranteed one or to pay for a CLA then they can give you good results.

Personal favourite "best" (the one I'd keep if allowed only one) is a Zorki 5 (later variant), I'm surprised no-one else has suggested it. Wide-base finder, bright VF/RF (knocks spots off the favoured FED 2) and has little to go wrong. With a collapsible Industar 50 on it it's only marginally bigger than a Zorki 1 but the VF/RF is infinitely better and it has a lever wind. They're also old enough to be made before the quality *really* went downhill. Just remember to leave a lens on it, so you can't wind or fire the shutter with no lens on -that's likely to kill it - and learn to load a bottom-loader!
 
I would second a good working Zorki 5 or 6 - ahead of the Fed 2 , but fewer of them .
Mine is excellent - but a Leica IIIc with service will outlast any of 'em - and accept most excellent ex USSR lenses .
 
I think you should always try to get a camera just CLA'ed. New shutter curtains are always good or if it is a Kiev then with new ribbons. I have:

Zorki 3 / 3M
Zorki 4
Fed Ig
Fed 2
Fed 3
Kiev 2A
Kiev 4AM

Of these the viewfinder on the Zorki's are best followed by the Fed 2,3 then the Kiev and then the Fed 1. Fed 2 very small and handy. Zorki's has a very nice feel of quality. Kiev is a bit speciel you have to get used to the way they handles. But Kiev 2A has same quality as the original Contax II (have one).

It can be a pain to get a matching lens where the rangefinder is spot on. But if you get a CLA'ed camera....then also try to get a matching lens. A J8 will be great and are not expensive. I think J8 and J3 are the best FSU lenses.

Price / quality I would probably get a CLA'ed Zorki 4 + J8 (rangefinder adjusted). An early one looks best with frames around the window's etc.
 
I really like my Kiev's. Not everyone likes the Contax design. IMHO, the "best" depends on the condition of particular example. Look for a bargain, and you'll get a body that is less than perfect in operation and appearance. Resolve to spend whatever it takes to get the cleanest, nicest working example, then it doesn't matter whether the body is FSU or Japanese or German.

If one is going to spend $200, one can buy FSU and have money for servicing, or buy a a Canon that may or may not need servicing in the future. IOW, you get what you pay for. I'd rather have and use my Kiev's than not, because of the pictures they take. I can't get those lenses easily on another body, so it's a moot point for me.
 
I don't have anything else to compare to so I won't try to make any assertions about "best". But I am in love with my 1957 Zorki 4. Quiet, smooth, great camera, that can take my Leitz and Voigtlander lenses without issue. It's pretty, has a nice leather case, and does everything I need it to. I admit the slow speeds are not right, but I expect to put that right shortly with a simple cleaning of the slow speed mechanism (which is right in the top of the camera). A Canon of the same age will need a service as well (e.g. my Canon 7...), and is a lot more complicated to take apart.

Cheers,
Karl
 
pmu said:
So, which one is the best* of them all?

* = Biggest, brightest and most accurate viewfinder, most reliable in operation, most accurate shutter speeds etc....those are the things that interest me the most :)
Click to expand...

Biggest VF is Zorki 3/3m or Zorki 4 or, possibly, Kiev 5.
Most accurate VF? All the ones I've had seemed about the same.
Most reliable? Almost any model that has been recently serviced by some body qualified.
Most important first decision? Who you buy from.
Find a good dealer with a return policy and then choose the model you want. Or take a chance with a camera simply based on price and seemingly good appearance and you are more likely to have to have it sorted out anyway. You may well get a good, usable camera--in fact, I did with my very first FSU purchase. Subsequently, I've bought with a bit more care and done pretty good. But I won't rely on chance now that I've owned a few.
Given your stated needs/wants, I'd suggest the Zorki 3m or 4. An early Z4 by preference; they should have an engraved shutter speed dial( the later ones have printed ones that wear off) and hopefully strap lugs. I personally have been happiest with the Zorki 3m. It has the things I want--good range of shutter speeds(B to 1/1000), strap lugs, a 1:1 VF, and I think it's the best looking FSU camera.
Read through the rest of the FSU section here and you will find a ton of info and opinion about the various cameras, then email either Fedka or Oleg with what you want and you'll be pretty well set.
Rob
 
Hmmm .
I guess it's make up your mind time LOL . Early Zorki 4 is a lot less money than a Zorki 3 though ! CLA is really the prime concern - and having a lens calibrated to your specific camera . ' cupog ' on e-bay sells cla / calibrated cameras too . I have two fine Kiev 4a from him .
 
Keep in mind that what you are trying to find here is not the cream of the crop, but the cream of the crap. If you enjoy tinkering with cameras as much as you enjoy shooting them, an FSU is a dream come true, as long as you have some other camera that can be relied upon to be reliable when you absolutely have to get the shot. These days, since the Holga/Lomo fanboys have discovered feds, zorkis, and kievs, the prices of these cameras has gone up a lot just in the last few years, and most of the good examples are already scooped up. On the other hand, there are loads of other rangefinder cameras, produced in both europe and japan, that can be had for a song and will provide great service. Heck, KEH has an engraved IIIc barnack leica for 165 bucks right now.
 
My, my, Merkin. How unkind.

My Zorki 1d (from Oleg) has worked faultlessly for 10+ years. Ditto my Kiev II.
My Canon 7 needed the whole shutter assembly replaced... it's all a crap shoot.
 
newspaperguy said:
My, my, Merkin. How unkind.

My Zorki 1d (from Oleg) has worked faultlessly for 10+ years. Ditto my Kiev II.
My Canon 7 needed the whole shutter assembly replaced... it's all a crap shoot.
Click to expand...

If every single FSU camera was incapable of reliable operation, almost no-one would use them. Obviously, they can work well and reliably, but that often requires work up front, either by a specialist or the individual, or an acceptance that it has a higher than average chance of breaking. Pretty much any camera model experiences breakages and maladjustment from time to time. The only nigh-invincible camera I have ever put film through is the Pentax K1000. The thing with the FSU cameras is that they are more likely, as a whole, to have problems than almost any other rangefinder camera. I really like the look of shots from them, but I certainly wouldn't trust one day in and day out. If you have not one, but two, that you can trust day in and day out, you are, imo, exceptionally lucky.
 
Merkin said:
If every single FSU camera was incapable of reliable operation, almost no-one would use them. Obviously, they can work well and reliably, but that often requires work up front, either by a specialist or the individual, or an acceptance that it has a higher than average chance of breaking. Pretty much any camera model experiences breakages and maladjustment from time to time. The only nigh-invincible camera I have ever put film through is the Pentax K1000. The thing with the FSU cameras is that they are more likely, as a whole, to have problems than almost any other rangefinder camera. I really like the look of shots from them, but I certainly wouldn't trust one day in and day out. If you have not one, but two, that you can trust day in and day out, you are, imo, exceptionally lucky.
Click to expand...
I have or have had about 30 FSUs. Most of them required work "up front" to varying degrees. That's ranged from a minor CLA (because I'm fussy, not always strictly needed) to shutter-curtain replacement - not unknown for other makes to need that after 60 years or more of use! I'd say without doubt that I could rely on any of them, day in, day out and I do so. I'm currently using a 1939 FED regularly: it has yet to fail - nor have any of the other FSUs I own.

I disagree that they are the "cream of the crap", there are far worse-made cameras out there, certainly of the era and certainly at their original cost. For what they were meant to be they stand up well to age and use. No, they aren't Leica-standard. No, they weren't always well made (quantity over quality). Yes, some tinkering is often required but that's largely because they were either never serviced before or had been butchered on a kitchen table.

Just to point out that most japanese cameras of the 70s and 80s require, at least, replacement light seals (FSUs were designed without seals or with simple, long-lasting string/wool type seals). The K1000 you mention is indeed a damned fine camera, but none has yet reached 70 years of age, so let's see if any do and still work. They also cost rather more than an FSU when new! My late-father's Kiev 4 still works perfectly and I know for a fact it's never been serviced (ok, I admit the meter has died) and it's as old as any K1000. Leicas soldier on too but they tend to get serviced, being comparativley valuable items and often treasured.

For a comparison, my Minolta X-700 has suffered a failed frame counter and has had the seals replaced, an XG-M that I used to have died (repaired under guarantee) and an XD-7 wore out the meter coupling "pot". My Yashica Minister III suffered a stuck shutter and is flimsy compared to the FSUs (it also had to have new seals in various places).
 
Wolves , as ever , has a point -

I just do not think that many actually recognise how ancient most ex-USSR cameras are ,
that any actually work , even if a little hoarsely , directly from source is amazing .

Ok , Leicas / Canons / Nikons from the 50s soldier on -but are ' worth ' servicing , when many less exotics are either paperweights or need intensive surgery .
How many Exaktas / Prakticas / Edixas of the period are still functioning without service ?

I agree that it's unfair to compare SLRs of the 60s and 70s which are just now sliding into their twilight years .
To use Pentaxes / Nikons / Canons / Minoltas et al , is simply missing the point about using a once hidden treasure from behind the Iron Curtain - and I do like my Minoltas .

Another joy of Soviet Survivors is that spare parts are seldom a problem - buy two , get one freed . [ sorry ] Contax II / III owners have a unique life saving opportunity -
Not that dee'spraxia can take advantage of that source .

Repairers often say that 1 1/2 Contax Cameras = one working camera , so each time two are revived , one bites the dust . That a scrap Kiev II / III of little value could act as donor is rejected in favour of authenticity - me ?
Three Contax Rescues with a little help from their Soviet Sisters are better than two .

Just get one which you like which has been carefully serviced by someone who knows what he / she is doing .

If you want absolute reliability - buy two the same ! I did LOL ..

I bought twin Fed 1g Black ' Leicas ' , possibly from parts cameras and had no trouble at all , I liked them so much that I had them Oleged - the ultimate treat for a Fed or Zorki .
Oleg actually said that they were in excellent condition . I would trust them without question ,
but I am aware of their history . I prefer them to their twin 1932/33 Leica II sisters - kind of at-tractor-tive ... I OWN my Feds , I am caretaker to my early Leicas .

But I am certified . LOL .
 
Big VF? Zorki 4 /4K
Accurate RF? Kiev 2 / 2a / 4 /4a (almost impossible to fool if knocked)
Available lenses? M39 (Leica/Canon) are easy to find, and if russian made also dirty cheap.
Handling? Best are Zorki 4/4k and Fed 4 (with film advance lever).

In fact it all depends on your preferences. Some people love the Barnack style cameras (say old Zorkis and Feds), some others (me) love the infamous Contax grip (RF blocking with your finger).
I prefer the Contax style however I love too the old Barnack style cameras.
Please note that most of the lenses available for this cameras are very good clones of Zeiss prewar designs. It means that they are (if properly adjusted) excellent lenses at excellent prices.
Good luck with your choice.

Ernesto
 
Ihave had 4 Zorki 4s/4k either I have been really lucky, but I have had very few problems with any of them. 2 were CLA when bought, the others not, I did a liile lubing on all the visible moving parts on the no-cla'ed cameras and with the exception of one's shutter hanging at 1/30th occasionally, I have had no problems. The Zorki 4 have the best viewfinder of any FSU camera for the 50mm lens, The Doug and Leningrad have better viewfinders overall, but are rare and expensive. Zorki 4's have the brightest, sharpest by far. Get good CLA"D Zorki 4 and you wont regret it. I have many Kievs too, the are very hit and miss , Some have been fine with no CLA, others need CLAs to work properly. I have put many rolls thru a 73' Kiev 4a without any prolblems and the meter works too. Canon rangefinders have their own set of problems. Many of the 50's models will need CLA's too to work properly . The canon 7, I have two. have problems with the rangefinder patch going out of alingment, But have the best viewfinder out there of vintage cameras for the 35mm lens next to the Lieca M2. I use the canon 7 mainly for the 35mm lens, The 50 mm framelines are not accurate enough for me and I use the Zorki 4 and Keiv for the 50mm lens, My favorite lens to shoot with. - M
 
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