kevin m
Veteran
So a refurbished Mac Pro and a 22" NEC monitor with calibrator can be had for less than an iMac. Man, am I glad I started this thread... 
wgerrard
Veteran
What you are paying for in a Mac is not the hardware. It's the design and the software and the consistency. If that works for you, it is well worth the money.
samuelphoto
Established
I'm shopping for a new computer and I'm looking at the new iMacs. It seems they can be configured with more than enough power for my needs, the most demanding of which would be Photoshop and my first foray into video editing with Final Cut Express. I'm leaning towards the 27" with the Quad-Core i5 processor, but since once you buy an iMac you're pretty much stuck with the hardware it comes with (outside of RAM) I'm wondering if the i7 processor and/or the SSD would be a worthwhile upgrade, or just overkill for my needs?
Thanks in advance and feel free to share any other tips.
I recently purchased an iMac with a 3.06 GHz Core i3 and 8GB of RAM and it screams. I can't believe how fast it loads and processes a 200MB medium format scan. Best purchase I ever made in terms of gear, and that includes cameras. AND, unlike PC's it NEVER hangs up; totally problem free. I couldn't be happier.
kevin m
Veteran
x2. I've had this iMac plugged into the internet since the day I bought it 5 years ago. Not a hiccup. No viruses, nothing. I'm not going back to a PC.
Tony-S
Member
Actually, they cost just about the same.
kuzano
Veteran
Amortize..Amortize..Amortize........
Amortize..Amortize..Amortize........
Rationalize. Do it the way business owners do. May not help on taxes, but justifies the upgrades..... Do these calculations:
Calculate two configurations
1) Max out the RAM on both computers
2) Max out the Storage... with backup capability on both computers
3) Configure machine one with the i5
4) Configure machine two with the i7
amortize #1 over three years (divide price by 36 months)
amortize #2 over four years (divide price by 48 months)
conjecture:
Machine two will give a year longer in real effective usage due to upgrade CPU
second conjecture:
No intelligent accountant will allow over a three year writeoff on a business expenditure for IT hardware, so doing four years is a push.
I'm pretty sure you will find the second machine will pencil out much better than the first machine on a monthly basis.
Granted we may not be able to afford adopting good business practices for personal purchases of this nature, but in todays world we need all the rationalization we can summon up to buy the toys we want.
Amortize..Amortize..Amortize........
Rationalize. Do it the way business owners do. May not help on taxes, but justifies the upgrades..... Do these calculations:
Calculate two configurations
1) Max out the RAM on both computers
2) Max out the Storage... with backup capability on both computers
3) Configure machine one with the i5
4) Configure machine two with the i7
amortize #1 over three years (divide price by 36 months)
amortize #2 over four years (divide price by 48 months)
conjecture:
Machine two will give a year longer in real effective usage due to upgrade CPU
second conjecture:
No intelligent accountant will allow over a three year writeoff on a business expenditure for IT hardware, so doing four years is a push.
I'm pretty sure you will find the second machine will pencil out much better than the first machine on a monthly basis.
Granted we may not be able to afford adopting good business practices for personal purchases of this nature, but in todays world we need all the rationalization we can summon up to buy the toys we want.
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Ruvy
Established
Don't buy iMac! I have one, use it for work and PS, I love it but its the system I love not the hardware. I'll not buy another one ever! In stead, I'll go back to a configuration of a box i.e. computer (like mini mac box or big power mac) and a separate monitor. Yes, I know it doesn't look as sexy but than when monitor goes bad, you want a bigger one or when hard drives fails it is a lot easier to deal with.
Apple has a great reputation but its hardware is not as good as many think. In three years of owning the imac I lost two internal and one external hard drive, one monitor started to yellow from the top (and needed lengthy overseas fight with Apple until they replaced it) now a year old monitor started to yellow out from the left side and calibration is good just for 2/3rds of it. A guy to whom we bought a macbook pro lost his hard drive (like me in the first year so it was covered by warranty) so its not just me.
Apple has a great reputation but its hardware is not as good as many think. In three years of owning the imac I lost two internal and one external hard drive, one monitor started to yellow from the top (and needed lengthy overseas fight with Apple until they replaced it) now a year old monitor started to yellow out from the left side and calibration is good just for 2/3rds of it. A guy to whom we bought a macbook pro lost his hard drive (like me in the first year so it was covered by warranty) so its not just me.
gavinlg
Veteran
My imac has been rock solid for like 4-5 years now and is still speedy and reliable. I'll be buying another one for sure. I'd recommend.
thegman
Veteran
Hi Rogier, There was no G5 Mac Mini (that would have been cool), there was a G4 one though.
I'm talking about a Core Duo Mac Mini, 1.86GHz (I think). I find it horrendously slow, mostly due to it's video, but also due to it's only 2GB RAM, which causes it to swap frequently on a slow hard disk.
Obviously it's objective whether a computer is slow or not, and what we're comparing to, but for me, that Mac Mini is torturous. However, spend £750 on a refurb iMac from Apple, and it's a different world.
The fact is the Mac Mini was made to be just enough Mac for a low cost to get people onto their first Mac. I'm using it as a professional software developer, and that's not it's intended purpose at all.
I don't criticise the Mac Mini too much, it's a cheapish way to get a tiny, quiet little Mac which will serve the needs 90% of users. I think however, developers and photo enthusiasts are in the 10%.
Frank Petronio
Well-known
I've had plenty of Apple warranty repairs, as well as outright failures to power supplies, video and logic boards, etc. All that stuff is made in the same factories as other major computer brands. I think Apple has always been in the top three quality-wise, in spite of the overall decline in the quality of components industry-wide.
What I like about Apple hardware is that it is well designed and ergonomic, more often than any other manufacturer. There are less seams, less gaps, less cheap plastic cracking and falling off. Noise and radiation are usually less. The laptop hinges and latches are better. The power cable is better... lots of little touches like that.
In the end, it just plain looks better. We're visual artists who spend a lot of our lives using these boxes, that should count for something.
What I like about Apple hardware is that it is well designed and ergonomic, more often than any other manufacturer. There are less seams, less gaps, less cheap plastic cracking and falling off. Noise and radiation are usually less. The laptop hinges and latches are better. The power cable is better... lots of little touches like that.
In the end, it just plain looks better. We're visual artists who spend a lot of our lives using these boxes, that should count for something.
kevin m
Veteran
I thank you for all the tips and advice.
I just placed an order with B&H for a 2.66GHz Quad-Core Mac Pro, and a 22" NEC monitor with built-in calibrator for $500 less than the 27" iMac I was considering. I'm kinda stoked...!
I just placed an order with B&H for a 2.66GHz Quad-Core Mac Pro, and a 22" NEC monitor with built-in calibrator for $500 less than the 27" iMac I was considering. I'm kinda stoked...!
wgerrard
Veteran
I thank you for all the tips and advice.
I just placed an order with B&H for a 2.66GHz Quad-Core Mac Pro, and a 22" NEC monitor with built-in calibrator for $500 less than the 27" iMac I was considering. I'm kinda stoked...!
I'd be stoked, too! Enjoy.
Now if you haven't already, think about backup. Stuff happens. I use a Time Machine that backs up everything. (Yes, it runs every hour. I'm too lazy to mess with it.) I also have a RAID 1 box from OWC that I use specifically to back up image files and a few other directories. Carbon Copy Cloner does a daily incremental backup at 4:00 a.m. (I leave the OWC drives unmounted. They don't make much noise, but I find it annoying.) At 3:59am, the iMac wakes itself up. I've set a crontab (a Unixy thing) entry to mount the drive at 4:00am. Carbon Copy Cloner launches at 4:01am. When it's done, it spawns a shell script that unmounts the drive, sends me an email with the details of the backup, and puts the iMac back to sleep.
I also use an online backup service for third-level stab at image files. Several are on the market, but I use a Mac-only outfit called Backblaze. Since you'll be uploading over your ISP, the first upload typically takes a very long time. Mine -- of 45 gigs -- took about 3 weeks. Costs $5 per month.
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Paddy C
Unused film collector
I thank you for all the tips and advice.
I just placed an order with B&H for a 2.66GHz Quad-Core Mac Pro, and a 22" NEC monitor with built-in calibrator for $500 less than the 27" iMac I was considering. I'm kinda stoked...!
Wise choice. Very wise. I was wondering how you got it for less than the iMac until I realized you didn't buy the current model. Great savings.
I'm off to buy a Mac Pro tomorrow. My old G4 MDD tower is going batty in its old age and it's time to move on.
For heavy users, I still believe firmly that the Mac Pro is a better buy over the long haul than an iMac (if you can afford it).
mugent
Well-known
I thank you for all the tips and advice.
I just placed an order with B&H for a 2.66GHz Quad-Core Mac Pro, and a 22" NEC monitor with built-in calibrator for $500 less than the 27" iMac I was considering. I'm kinda stoked...!
Sounds lovely, I use a 3ghz iMac and couldn't be happier with it, I've always been a Mac guy, but every time I use I remember why I am.
You'll be very happy with that Mac, I guarantee it.
I always think, get what you want, if you cheap out, you'll just end up replacing it and end up spending more.
kevin m
Veteran
I'm really glad someone mentioned B&H in this thread. It slipped my mind that they sell computers, too, and they discount the non-current models so that a new computer from them is substantially cheaper than the same computer refurbished from Apple.
I came to the same conclusion. An off-the-shelf iMac is a great buy, but when you start to configure them to you're liking, they get pricey fast. If you want two drives, it's a $750 option. That's what ultimately led me to the Mac Pro.
kevin m
Veteran
Correct. Which is why I said "two drives."
If Apple offered two hard drives in the iMac, I would have happily done that. But the fact that one is forced to buy the 27" screen (which I really didn't want, lovely as it is) just to have the option of a second drive and THEN pay so handsomely for that is what led me to explore other options.
B&H has 2.66GHz 2009 models for $1,899. I have to admit the below-$2k pricetag caught my attention.
Tony-S
Member
This is why there are so many hackintoshes now. I'm on my second; first was a q6600 mid-tower that was about $800 in parts. When I upgraded a few months ago to an i7 I spent another $400 (cpu/mobo plus optional upgrade of my graphics card to a 9800gtx+/512). Aperture is very happy with this computer. Building a hackintosh has never been easier (but with the inherent risk of overnight obsolescence).
robklurfield
eclipse
even when companies source parts from same suppliers, it doesn't mean the parts are of the same grade. a big company like Apple or Dell can get what they want from suppliers and most suppliers offer among their other options, parts built to a certain price point. so, the fact that Apple and others use the same suppliers doesn't mean the quality of something like a power supply isn't necessarily the same.
I've got agree with Frank about the ergonomics and design. They do just look and feel better. And while one could argue, as many folks have here, that Apple charges too much, that hasn't stopped enough of us from buying their products to hurt their business, which seems to be doing better than ever (yes, yes; I know that's coming in large part from iPhones, iPods, etc., but their computer market share has never been better).
I'm typing on a PC (free from my employer and a pile of garbage, buzzing loudly as I type this), but I'm itching to replace my six-year old PowerBook G4 as soon as I can afford another Mac. I'm tempted to get a 27" iMac next time around. My kids are each on their third or fourth Macs. My wife is on her first and I'm on my second (I think I bought my first one around 1988).
I've got agree with Frank about the ergonomics and design. They do just look and feel better. And while one could argue, as many folks have here, that Apple charges too much, that hasn't stopped enough of us from buying their products to hurt their business, which seems to be doing better than ever (yes, yes; I know that's coming in large part from iPhones, iPods, etc., but their computer market share has never been better).
I'm typing on a PC (free from my employer and a pile of garbage, buzzing loudly as I type this), but I'm itching to replace my six-year old PowerBook G4 as soon as I can afford another Mac. I'm tempted to get a 27" iMac next time around. My kids are each on their third or fourth Macs. My wife is on her first and I'm on my second (I think I bought my first one around 1988).
ElectroWNED
Well-known
I post-process just fine on my netbook w/ the touchpad (ie no mouse) that has a 10" screen, 1gb ram, and 1.6 ghz.
Any iMac will be good
Any iMac will be good
robklurfield
eclipse
10" screen? wow. your eyesight must be about 50X better than mine. I'd go blind trying to edit on a screen that small. more power to you. however, don't get older. my 19" desktop screen barely cuts it for me anymore and my 15" PowerBook is a real challenge. Enjoy that good vision!
I post-process just fine on my netbook w/ the touchpad (ie no mouse) that has a 10" screen, 1gb ram, and 1.6 ghz.
Any iMac will be good