mooge
Well-known
I'm outta cash, but good with screwdrivers...
I figure that the Leica way is something I should try before I die, so I figured I could start soon. like not now. because there's no way I can afford a Leica at the moment. but- I might as well start looking around now, eh?
so- what would a user condition M2 or M3 go for if the speeds were off (or otherwise in dire need of CLA- but nothing broken)? where do these pop up? I want to get some idea of how much i'd have to save up. but then lenses... arrgh...
cheers.
I figure that the Leica way is something I should try before I die, so I figured I could start soon. like not now. because there's no way I can afford a Leica at the moment. but- I might as well start looking around now, eh?
so- what would a user condition M2 or M3 go for if the speeds were off (or otherwise in dire need of CLA- but nothing broken)? where do these pop up? I want to get some idea of how much i'd have to save up. but then lenses... arrgh...
cheers.
maddoc
... likes film again.
I got mine for $900 last week (together with a DR Summicron, googles, UV filter and hood) of from eBay in very good condition (RF was of at infinity, self-adjusted, works very well now). Have seen a couple of M2 in "user" condition (some vulcanite missing, need for shutter speed adjustments and / or rangefinder adjustmens) for ~ $400 lately. M3 were a little bit more expensive, though.
snip
Established
You list your age as 16, how come you are anticipating to have such a short lifespan?
I would suggest you save up, being under 18 you should be able to get a very attractive regular savings rate.
//Jan
Al Kaplan
Veteran
No Leicas have spot-on speeds, and stay away from trying to use one that's half a century old and looks brand new. It'll need a full CLA for sure, what with the lubricants being all gunked up. For the most part an older M that's seen moderate and REGULAR use should be useable as is.
Become friendly with every antique dealer and pawn shop owner around. They're more interested in turning over merchandise as fast as possible and freeing up cash for the next buy than squeezing the last dime out of every sale.
Keep checking prices on Ebay, and not just for Leicas but other quality cameras too. If you should find a clean Rolleiflex at a yard sale for $25 (it happens) even though you don't want a Rolleiflex you buy it. First, though, offer $15. You might just be lucky. Then YOU list it on Ebay.
Going the yard sale/pawn shop/antique shop route might get you into LeicaLand for under $1,000 including a lens or two. Or that route might prove a dead end. I'm sure that you can locate a body, functional but worn looking, for way less than $1,000, and an older lens for a couple hundred.
Also consider the Bessa line of cameras and lenses. When you feel richer the lenses are interchangeable with Leicas.
Become friendly with every antique dealer and pawn shop owner around. They're more interested in turning over merchandise as fast as possible and freeing up cash for the next buy than squeezing the last dime out of every sale.
Keep checking prices on Ebay, and not just for Leicas but other quality cameras too. If you should find a clean Rolleiflex at a yard sale for $25 (it happens) even though you don't want a Rolleiflex you buy it. First, though, offer $15. You might just be lucky. Then YOU list it on Ebay.
Going the yard sale/pawn shop/antique shop route might get you into LeicaLand for under $1,000 including a lens or two. Or that route might prove a dead end. I'm sure that you can locate a body, functional but worn looking, for way less than $1,000, and an older lens for a couple hundred.
Also consider the Bessa line of cameras and lenses. When you feel richer the lenses are interchangeable with Leicas.
mooge
Well-known
but the big question remains- how much should I expect to pay? because when it comes to collectibles, i'm bound to get ripped off.
rxmd
May contain traces of nut
Some 300 to 400 USD minimum for a M2 in user condition.
If it's truly broken, you might pay less, but then you probably wouldn't be able to fix it, unless you already have some experience in complex camera repairs in general and Leicas in particular (in which case you'd probably have an idea about prices, too
) - most first-timers wreck the first camera they try to repair, I wouldn't start that with a Leica.
Do you have a lens? Remember that LTM-M adapters for M39 lenses cost money, too.
If it's truly broken, you might pay less, but then you probably wouldn't be able to fix it, unless you already have some experience in complex camera repairs in general and Leicas in particular (in which case you'd probably have an idea about prices, too
) - most first-timers wreck the first camera they try to repair, I wouldn't start that with a Leica. Do you have a lens? Remember that LTM-M adapters for M39 lenses cost money, too.
Tom A
RFF Sponsor
Inherently, a M2 or M3 has a certain value, even if it is water logged or "crash" damaged. Things like controls (Shutter speed dial, advance arm, covering etc become parts). If the rangefinder assembly is in good shape that adds $100's to the value ( particularly on M3's).
If the camera is functioning, but speeds are off and shutter curtains are getting wrinkled or pin holed - the "discount" realistically is what a CLA would cost ($200-250 for a full clean/adjust and curtain replacement). So we are looking at a scruffy, DS M3 - which would sell for maybe $700 - discount CLA and the hassle of getting it done - subtract $300. Now the M3 is worth about $400.
Being handy with a screw driver is not enough as you also need some stuff like a shutter speed tester, some special clamps to remove retaining rings without damaging finish, specialized lubricants and in the case of the rangefinder - a collimating system. I know all of this from experience! I have taken multiple M's and screw mount Leicas apart - and some got put together succesfully - some not!
You also need a manual for this - trying to do it by guesswork is rather futile (I know this too) and having it corrected by a tech. will cost more at this point.
Best deal is to scour flea markets, pawn shops and "spread the word" among places that fixes cameras. I suspect that you still are going to have to fork out $2-300 for a project though.
If the camera is functioning, but speeds are off and shutter curtains are getting wrinkled or pin holed - the "discount" realistically is what a CLA would cost ($200-250 for a full clean/adjust and curtain replacement). So we are looking at a scruffy, DS M3 - which would sell for maybe $700 - discount CLA and the hassle of getting it done - subtract $300. Now the M3 is worth about $400.
Being handy with a screw driver is not enough as you also need some stuff like a shutter speed tester, some special clamps to remove retaining rings without damaging finish, specialized lubricants and in the case of the rangefinder - a collimating system. I know all of this from experience! I have taken multiple M's and screw mount Leicas apart - and some got put together succesfully - some not!
You also need a manual for this - trying to do it by guesswork is rather futile (I know this too) and having it corrected by a tech. will cost more at this point.
Best deal is to scour flea markets, pawn shops and "spread the word" among places that fixes cameras. I suspect that you still are going to have to fork out $2-300 for a project though.
mooge
Well-known
well, camera repair isn't new to me. so it's more than being handy with screwdrivers: i've opened up a few, fixed a Kiev and a ME super, and i'm in the process of CLAing a Canon FTb and a Minolta Hi-matic 7s. I've got manuals (online... anyone want the links?), I have a some test tools that should work in theory (anyone got a good photoresistor?).
well, $200-300 beats $800 for a fully working one- that's alot of film I could buy. and I can't really justify spending $1000 on another camera before I leave for university, can I?
thanks (kiitos!)
well, $200-300 beats $800 for a fully working one- that's alot of film I could buy. and I can't really justify spending $1000 on another camera before I leave for university, can I?
thanks (kiitos!)
rxmd
May contain traces of nut
Ei kestä. If you're serious about fixing your own M, there are some detailed repair manuals floating around the Net that were made public by the US Army.
Philipp
Philipp
SimonSawSunlight
Simon Fabel
hmmm I paid 480€ (about 640$ at that time) for my user M4 in good and fully working condition, with pretty precise speeds, smooth operation and spot-on rangefinder (I managed to decalibrate it myself some days later so I had to fix it on my own in the end. that worked pretty well though.)
some people ask horrendous prices for any camera, leica or not. others just throw away there stuff for nothing and a kiss on the hand. try to spy a little here and there, not just on evilBay.
some people ask horrendous prices for any camera, leica or not. others just throw away there stuff for nothing and a kiss on the hand. try to spy a little here and there, not just on evilBay.
mooge
Well-known
lost me there... one day I will learn the language....
yup, that's exactly what I found. (the US army manuals)
spying around is my only option, I did a little penny count an hour back and realized i'm pretty much broke- $125 for that bass, $80 for that slide film, and $140 to save for the development (summer vacation= spam-a-thon)
good to know anyhow. thanks.
snip
Established
You'r a spammer? Or you'r going to eat spam?
Anyhow, you can make an amazingly good amount by spending an hour or two a day doing surveys, A friend of mine did it for two months, two hours a day and had money to buy a very nice amplifier he wanted, make sure you use a disposable E-mail as your contact to the survey firms though.
//Jan