Velvia, Provia (100F & 400X), Astia & filters

[Matus]

No, I am NOT going to ask which film is better, relax. I am over that 😛

I am actually curios about how do these films respond to filters like warming (81A, 81B, 81C, or similar), to skylight filters or polarizers.

I am selecting 1 or 2 color films to take to my vacation in Spain (Granada, Gibraltar, beaches, coast). I will most probably take a few rolls of the Provia 400X for interiors and places where tripod may not be possible, but I plan to take one slow color positive film too. BTW, the cameras used will be Mamiya 6 and Contax T3 (if I manage to find and also the filter adapter)

I have used Provia 100F quite a bit in the last 2 years. However of then the blue/magenta tint to shadows was not always easy to deal with in Photoshop. At the same time I often prefer warm feeling to my photos.

My experience was the the slides were often looking more cool that what I have expected - probably I should have used an UV or skyight filter.

So - I was wondering - would you just take a Velvia (100, not 100F) to get warmer results or would you use Provia 100F or Astia with some filtering? I do not expect the same result of course. I am just wondering what the results could be ...

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1) So - what is your experience with these films - what kind of filters do you use under similar conditions?

2) I plan to add a UV filter (Hama UV(0) MRC) to my lenses to keep them safer in the bag - should I expect some visible effect from them?

********

Bottomline:
- I know I could go with color negative films too, but I just have some troubles getting reasonable scans and would also like to enjoy the slides on the light table. So - no color negs please.

 

[FPjohn]

Hello:

I have UVa filters as "thumb print" filters on all lenses. I assume effects are as expected*, slight but present, on image quality.

yours
FPJ

* http://www.schneideroptics.com/ecommerce/CatalogSubCategoryDisplay.aspx?CID=1232

http://www.schneideroptics.com/info/handbook/pdf/B+WHandbook8_9.pdf

 

[MT4]

Matus,
Aperture 64 expressed perfectly the issue. The very same is applied for me (Mamiya 7ii).
Have a wonderful vacation, Michael

 

[SteveM]

Of the films you mention I've mostly used Velvia (with my Bronica RF645) and find that it is so saturated that I don't really need to use a polarizing filter to get those deep blue skies. With a rangefinder, this saves a lot of fiddling around (separate filter over the viewfinder that has to be rotated to get the right orientation etc.). Same for warming filters; with the daylight shooting that I do most of the time, more warming is unnecessary with this film.

In harsh bright light I have found Velvia doesn't have good latitude, and results in slides that have deep shadow and washed out highlights - maybe it's just my exposures. Because of this I've started to use Provia and have bought some Astia, which I hope will overcome this aspect of Velvia but could require use of warming & polarizing filters. My limited experience with Provia has been favourable, and it is still quite saturated. I always use UV filters and haven't seen any negative effect of this - although I haven't done any on/off comparisons.

Steve

 

[Jamie123]

I'd stay away from Velvia unless you're really into the heavy saturation. I'd second the above suggestion to try some Kodak E100G. If you're going with Fuji I'd say your best bet is Astia.

 

[Dave Jenkins]

My standard film is Astia, which I find to be warmer than Provia. Even so, I usually use it with an 81a or 81b filter.

 

[Matus]

Thanks for your replies. Interesting opinion on the Fuji blue cast (compared to Kodak). Still - I have tendency to stay with Fuji - somehow I prefer to support them more than Kodak. Secondly - Kodak films are more expensive than Fuji films and also seem to have more grain.

I have shot both E100G and E100VS in 4x5 (I got several boxes that vere close to expiry) and indeed I could not really complain about the results (E100VS seems less saturated than Velvia). On the other hand I have shot rather few Astia and Velvia films yet - I had a tendency to keep away from Velvia because of very high contrast and away from Astia because of too "weak" colors - indeed, both reason would need more justification to be proved.

Actually - the above sounds like I am looking for a Provia replacement. Hm.

Also - I am not the a big fan of the approach "boost the colors with Photoshop as you please" as doing this too much destroys the tonality of the image.

Seems like one possible approach would be to get a few rolls of Astia, Velvia, E100G and E100VS and see what comes out.

Please - feel free to express you opinions also about the Kodak slide films.

 

[Jamie123]

Thanks for your replies. Interesting opinion on the Fuji blue cast (compared to Kodak). Still - I have tendency to stay with Fuji - somehow I prefer to support them more than Kodak. Secondly - Kodak films are more expensive than Fuji films and also seem to have more grain.

I have shot both E100G and E100VS in 4x5 (I got several boxes that vere close to expiry) and indeed I could not really complain about the results (E100VS seems less saturated than Velvia). On the other hand I have shot rather few Astia and Velvia films yet - I had a tendency to keep away from Velvia because of very high contrast and away from Astia because of too "weak" colors - indeed, both reason would need more justification to be proved.

Actually - the above sounds like I am looking for a Provia replacement. Hm.

Also - I am not the a big fan of the approach "boost the colors with Photoshop as you please" as doing this too much destroys the tonality of the image.

Seems like one possible approach would be to get a few rolls of Astia, Velvia, E100G and E100VS and see what comes out.

Please - feel free to express you opinions also about the Kodak slide films.

I just ordered some Sensia 100 yesterday. Don't have any experience with it but it was really cheap compared to Provia and Astia so I thought I'd give it a try.

What format are you shooting anyways? 35mm or 120? If it's 35mm, I see that Macodirect.de has some Kodachrome in stock. It's insanely expensive but it might be fun to try a couple of rolls before they stop processing it at the end of the year.

What are you going to photograph in Spain? Landscapes only? People? If it's the latter I'd definitely advise against Velvia. It's really not flattering for skin tones. Besides, anyone with a hint of a sunburn will look like a cooked lobster.

 

[Eddie90723]

I remember reading on a Polaroid forum somewhere that Japanese films in general will be cooler than American or European films because the redness / warmth to them implies that the person is drunk or ill. I never thought about it like that but when i ordered Japanese instant film I did notice it was a lot better for blues and greens than it's American counter parts. Don't know if that helps any for this thread but it's a fun anecdote i say.

 

[Matus]

I just ordered some Sensia 100 yesterday. Don't have any experience with it but it was really cheap compared to Provia and Astia so I thought I'd give it a try.

What format are you shooting anyways? 35mm or 120? If it's 35mm, I see that Macodirect.de has some Kodachrome in stock. It's insanely expensive but it might be fun to try a couple of rolls before they stop processing it at the end of the year.

What are you going to photograph in Spain? Landscapes only? People? If it's the latter I'd definitely advise against Velvia. It's really not flattering for skin tones. Besides, anyone with a hint of a sunburn will look like a cooked lobster.

I never really considered Sensia to be hones (and have no good excuse for that). Kodachrome? - I have never shot it and the photos I have seen on flickr had mostly very particular color and I can not say that I would have liked it too much (might have been crappy scanning of course) I guess it does not help much to try film that I can not shoot later anymore.

I will be shooting some seascapes, cityscapes some people too (but keep in mind I take 2 cameras and my wife has a small P&P digi to handle family shots). Not to forget that I plan to shoot quite some B&W (Ilford Delta 100 & 400) too.

- Eddie -
Interesting point, would be interesting to know whether it really is the reason for cooler tone of Japanese films. On the other hand, Velvia is hard to describe as cooler in color tone.

 

[Jamie123]

I never really considered Sensia to be hones (and have no good excuse for that). Kodachrome? - I have never shot it and the photos I have seen on flickr had mostly very particular color and I can not say that I would have liked it too much (might have been crappy scanning of course) I guess it does not help much to try film that I can not shoot later anymore.

I will be shooting some seascapes, cityscapes some people too (but keep in mind I take 2 cameras and my wife has a small P&P digi to handle family shots). Not to forget that I plan to shoot quite some B&W (Ilford Delta 100 & 400) too.

Upon writing my previous comment I did some googleing and apparently Sensia 100 is the consumer version of Astia. Works for me as I was going to buy Astia anyways.
I also never really considered shooting Kodachrome because I don't like the saturated colors which is also why I really dislike Velvia.

Personally, I find that, while slide film is great to look at on a light table, neg film gives a much better scan. That being said, if it really must be slide film I think you don't really have that many options that haven't been mentioned already. One option that hasn't been mentioned so far is variation in exposure and processing. You could try pushing Astia a stop to get a bit more contrast and saturation out of it. Or you could pull Velvia 2 stops to really bring down that saturation to an acceptable level.

 

[Matus]

So - is it really the case? Are fuji films really blue?

I thought it had something to do with the development ...

- Aperture64 -
You propose E100G instead of Fuji Provia. Do you find the saturation of the E100G stronger than the Fuji Astia?

How do you feel about E100VS versus Velvia 50 (100)?

 

[Tim Gray]

Are the films really biased towards those colors? Or are the scans of those films biased towards those colors? I'd check the first by looking at the slides with my own eyes. If you are basing those opinions off of the scans, it could be the different color dyes Kodak and Fuji used for their color layers and how those dyes interact with the RGB filters of scanners.

 

[Matus]

One more reason came to my mind concerning the scanning. It seems to be so that most scanner calibration IT8 targets used are made with Kodak films - at least they seem to be the "default" option. Now if you calibrated you scanner with a Kodak IT8 target and scan Fuji silde film - it will most probably alter the result .. or?

 

[Jamie123]

One more reason came to my mind concerning the scanning. It seems to be so that most scanner calibration IT8 targets used are made with Kodak films - at least they seem to be the "default" option. Now if you calibrated you scanner with a Kodak IT8 target and scan Fuji silde film - it will most probably alter the result .. or?

Probably, but not many people calibrate their scanners with IT8 targets.

 

[Matus]

aperture64,

IT8 are special slides printed with a color mesh. The scanner scans it and compares with a special calibration data file which tells the scanner what colors did the scanner "see". This way you calibrate the scanner. If you have never done anything like that, your scanner is not calibrated. However - relative differences in scans from different films are mostly valid. So if you are getting warmer scans from Kodak films they would most probably remain warmer after calibration too even though the colors would change.

Actually - I will take several slide films (E100G, Astia, Provia for 35mm and even more for 6x6) along and will just shoot them and see what comes out of it.