West Yorkshire Cameras Closing

Zuiko-logist said:
I pass Mr Cad in Victoria, London on fairly regular basis. It looks like a giant mess of cameras and lenses 😊
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That pretty much sums it up if you've never been in there. There is some semblance of organisation, but without the assistance of one of the owners, you'd have to poke around for ages to find anything.
 
Zuiko-logist said:
I pass Mr Cad in Victoria, London on fairly regular basis. It looks like a giant mess of cameras and lenses 😊
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Mr Cad is wonderful but confusing, the owner Alex Falk was actually up in the rafters photographing the 1952 coronation. He is a great character.
See him here:

 
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WoodallP said:
Mr Cad is wonderful but confusing, the owner Alex Falk was actually up in the rafters photographing the 1952 coronation. He is a great character.
See him here:

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Thank you, that was lovely! My enjoyment was enhanced by Alex clutching, at two different points in the video, a Six-20 Folding Brownie, a camera I have an inordinate number of. I can see a diversion via Victoria next time I am in London...
 
WoodallP said:
Mr Cad is wonderful but confusing, the owner Alex Falk was actually up in the rafters photographing the 1952 coronation. He is a great character.
See him here:

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An interesting and nostalgic video. But not too realistic. If we apply the rule of professionals, how many pros are shooting film today? Not many. And for quality digital seems to have captured the market. I think it was the Rijksmuseum in Amsterdam that had a project to photograph some Van Goghs' Film? Not on your life. IIRC it was a Hasselblad tweaked for hi-res that passed across those paintings and assembled an effective collage to be assembled into the final super finely detailed copy.

I know that some pro's shoot film for the effect it gives but wonder how many shoot 100% film. In editing I'd guess that current software will do more than can be done in the darkroom and when color is accounted for digital is the leader in editing.

So, yes, film is an exercise, a discipline, a study in the effort to capture an image. I read that sending film off for processing is a hazard with some labs ruining submitted rolls. So, shoot mono and do it yourself. But film forces one into a smaller and smaller box, almost a monastic cell of discipline and privation. Along with this diminishing box of choices is a diminishing group of folks who want it. And they are the life blood of the small shop, the fellow with the chemicals and paper and film.

This all reminds me of Bob Dylan's line, "Tin Pan Alley's dead. I killed it." Analog is dying a slow death and Kodak killed it. And it seems that the corner shop is analog, too.
 
boojum said:
An interesting and nostalgic video. But not too realistic. If we apply the rule of professionals, how many pros are shooting film today? Not many. And for quality digital seems to have captured the market. I think it was the Rijksmuseum in Amsterdam that had a project to photograph some Van Goghs' Film? Not on your life. IIRC it was a Hasselblad tweaked for hi-res that passed across those paintings and assembled an effective collage to be assembled into the final super finely detailed copy.

I know that some pro's shoot film for the effect it gives but wonder how many shoot 100% film. In editing I'd guess that current software will do more than can be done in the darkroom and when color is accounted for digital is the leader in editing.

So, yes, film is an exercise, a discipline, a study in the effort to capture an image. I read that sending film off for processing is a hazard with some labs ruining submitted rolls. So, shoot mono and do it yourself. But film forces one into a smaller and smaller box, almost a monastic cell of discipline and privation. Along with this diminishing box of choices is a diminishing group of folks who want it. And they are the life blood of the small shop, the fellow with the chemicals and paper and film.

This all reminds me of Bob Dylan's line, "Tin Pan Alley's dead. I killed it." Analog is dying a slow death and Kodak killed it. And it seems that the corner shop is analog, too.
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“Art lives from constraints and dies from freedom.” -- Leonardo DaVinci
 
"How many pro image creators use a camera nowadays? Just use Midjourney AI. Much easier and faster."
"How many pro photographers these days use film? It's all digital now. Much easier and faster."
"How many pro illustrators these days use a pencil? It's all Wacom tablets now. Much easier and faster."
"How many artists use brushes and paint now? It's all screenprints now. Much easier and faster."
"How many writers use a typewriter now? It's all word processors now. Much easier and faster."
"How many weavers use a loom now? It's all automated mills now. Much easier and faster."
"How many pro calligraphers use a quill? It's all pens now. Much easier and faster."

I'm reminded of a Stewart Lee bit... "get back in the sea..."
 
Coldkennels said:
"How many pro image creators use a camera nowadays? Just use Midjourney AI. Much easier and faster."
"How many pro photographers these days use film? It's all digital now. Much easier and faster."
"How many pro illustrators these days use a pencil? It's all Wacom tablets now. Much easier and faster."
"How many artists use brushes and paint now? It's all screenprints now. Much easier and faster."
"How many writers use a typewriter now? It's all word processors now. Much easier and faster."
"How many weavers use a loom now? It's all automated mills now. Much easier and faster."
"How many pro calligraphers use a quill? It's all pens now. Much easier and faster."

I'm reminded of a Stewart Lee bit... "get back in the sea..."
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Yes, yes, wooden ships and iron men and you just can't beat the old days. Dreams of childhood.
 
...says the man who a) constantly says the best lens he's ever used is something Cooke made almost a century ago and b) is, by virtue of even using a camera, already an antiquated relic by virtue of the same argument he's putting forward.

"Art" doesn't care about what is easy, or what is popular, or what is "new". "Art" cares only about one thing: creation. And in a world where the image is becoming ever-more commodified, it should be no surprise that people are exploring or embracing ever-more arcane ways of creating images for themselves.

You have chosen how you want to be a relic. Other people can choose theirs. That's why these shops continue to exist. Hell, there's a store two minutes walk from my front door that's been selling art supplies since 1835 - oil paints, horsehair brushes, pastels, you name it.

But "pros" use formalin and sharks now... or rattle cans, stencils, and brick walls. When will these artists learn? You should go have a word with them, Boojum. Set 'em straight.
 
Coldkennels said:
...says the man who a) constantly says the best lens he's ever used is something Cooke made almost a century ago and b) is, by virtue of even using a camera, already an antiquated relic by virtue of the same argument he's putting forward.

"Art" doesn't care about what is easy, or what is popular, or what is "new". "Art" cares only about one thing: creation. And in a world where the image is becoming ever-more commodified, it should be no surprise that people are exploring or embracing ever-more arcane ways of creating images for themselves.

You have chosen how you want to be a relic. Other people can choose theirs. That's why these shops continue to exist. Hell, there's a store two minutes walk from my front door that's been selling art supplies since 1835 - oil paints, horsehair brushes, pastels, you name it.

But "pros" use formalin and sharks now... or rattle cans, stencils, and brick walls. When will these artists learn? You should go have a word with them, Boojum. Set 'em straight.
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Yes, but. The Skyllaney Bertele Sonnar may be my best lens as much as I like the Amotal. I also run a Sony A7M III with its lenses and an X2D with its XCD 55V and a Pixii A2575 soon to become a Pixii II full frame. That I like retro and recreated retro lenses is not a philosophical statement. I like very much how the Amotal works. I do not yearn for 1945 however. There is a difference. I have never been happier in my life so I do not moan about how things used to be better in the past. They were not better in the past. If they were we would abandon all that we now have gotten. Folks talk about the good old days but how many have a coal bin in there back yard today? Yes, lad, it is OK to talk the talk but can you walk the walk? Send me the pics of how you gave up on central heat and indoor plumbing and embraced rationing. You can post them online for all to see. ;o)
 
Central heat and plumbing are progress, but they are not fundamental to art-making. In art there are changes of style, but no progress. Look at the Lascaux cave paintings. Beautiful works of creative genius, today and the day they were made.
 
Retro-Grouch said:
Central heat and plumbing are progress, but they are not fundamental to art-making. In art there are changes of style, but no progress. Look at the Lascaux cave paintings. Beautiful works of creative genius, today and the day they were made.
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The preceding conversation was about a lot "in the past" and I did not draw the parameters. I only commented on them.

I'll tell you what Picasso said about Lascaux, he said he would give anything to be able to paint like that. He was in a PBS special and the subject was brought up. Then he proceeded to paint a bull on clear Lucite from one side with the camera on the other. Just a few strokes. It was nearly Lascaux. I understand that Picassos's father quit painting when Picasso was sixteen. He realized that his son had eclipsed him.

But was the subject about art? I perceived it as a screed about how much better things were a century ago. This belief is, of course, self-delusion as we are not rushing to embrace life as it was 100 years ago. It could be that when people talk about how much better it used to be they are commenting on their current lives, miserable and unhappy through their own means. It wasn't an anonymous stranger that made it so. This begs the question of how far would you walk with a stone in your shoe?

As for photographic gear, I will use whatever gives me an image that pleases me. I take pictures for my pleasure. If you like them, better. I have a 2001 Honda Insight, a hybrid auto. It gives me 60+ miles per US gallon. It is a mass of computers. That's what it takes to get the job done. Use the appropriate tool. It doesn't have to be a new tool. I still have my Picket slide rule. I never use it. My phone has a calculator. Again, appropriate tool use.

If things used to be better throw away you computer and send me a letter. ;o) Talk the talk vs walk the walk.
 
boojum said:
The preceding conversation was about a lot "in the past" and I did not draw the parameters. I only commented on them.

I'll tell you what Picasso said about Lascaux, he said he would give anything to be able to paint like that. He was in a PBS special and the subject was brought up. Then he proceeded to paint a bull on clear Lucite from one side with the camera on the other. Just a few strokes. It was nearly Lascaux. I understand that Picassos's father quit painting when Picasso was sixteen. He realized that his son had eclipsed him.

But was the subject about art? I perceived it as a screed about how much better things were a century ago. This belief is, of course, self-delusion as we are not rushing to embrace life as it was 100 years ago. It could be that when people talk about how much better it used to be they are commenting on their current lives, miserable and unhappy through their own means. It wasn't an anonymous stranger that made it so. This begs the question of how far would you walk with a stone in your shoe?

As for photographic gear, I will use whatever gives me an image that pleases me. I take pictures for my pleasure. If you like them, better. I have a 2001 Honda Insight, a hybrid auto. It gives me 60+ miles per US gallon. It is a mass of computers. That's what it takes to get the job done. Use the appropriate tool. It doesn't have to be a new tool. I still have my Picket slide rule. I never use it. My phone has a calculator. Again, appropriate tool use.

If things used to be better throw away you computer and send me a letter. ;o) Talk the talk vs walk the walk.
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I choose to embrace technological change (within my personal sphere) when needed and appropriate. Sometimes that decision is removed from my power by broader social forces, but whenever possible, I want to make the choice. And even then, there are no absolutes; I'm often ambivalent about the technologies I embrace. With that in mind, no, I will not be sending you a letter. But let's also not pretend that the computer is an unalloyed blessing; we all know that it can be The Tool of Satan ;) . No need to be absolutist about our choices, and let's remember that others' choices may be far different and still valid.
My current long-term favorite camera is my little Rolleiflex, made the same year as me, 1952, and I shoot Ektachrome E-100 in it. Many here would be justifiably horrified if their creative options were restricted to that choice. I find it liberating. Choice is a good thing.
 
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Retro-Grouch said:
I choose to embrace technological change (within my personal sphere) when needed and appropriate. Sometimes that decision is removed from my power by broader social forces, but whenever possible, I want to make the choice. And even then, there are no absolutes; I'm often ambivalent about the technologies I embrace. With that in mind, no, I will not be sending you a letter. But let's also not pretend that the computer is an unalloyed blessing; we all know that it can be The Tool of Satan ;) . No need to be absolutist about our choices, and let's remember that others' choices may be far different and still valid.
My current long-term favorite camera is my little Rolleiflex, made the same year as me, 1972, and I shoot Ektachrome E-100 in it. Many here would be justifiably horrified if their creative options were restricted to that choice. I find it liberating. Choice is a good thing.
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I wish I’d only been made in 1972, or even a bit later;)
 
Zuiko-logist said:
This thread has moved a long way from West Yorkshire Cameras closing. It interesting discussion.
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As the person who started it I agree! But we had fun with the discussion. The world is changing and it seems it has consequences, both local and global; but I still miss talking to people about the lump of old technology in front of me, with someone who knows what they are talking about, and who will be honest because they know you will be back with a stick if they are not :)

I think that some of us (like me) are also part of the problem as we restore cameras and sell them without taking into account our time. We do it for fun and learning. I have a day job in a global company; if I factored in my hourly rate on an Isolette restoration with new (made by me) bellows it would be expensive but I never think of the time or the raw materials.

There are just a lot of variables but WYC were honest and a great shop; lets just mourn another one gone.
 
WoodallP said:
As the person who started it I agree! But we had fun with the discussion. The world is changing and it seems it has consequences, both local and global; but I still miss talking to people about the lump of old technology in front of me, with someone who knows what they are talking about, and who will be honest because they know you will be back with a stick if they are not :)

I think that some of us (like me) are also part of the problem as we restore cameras and sell them without taking into account our time. We do it for fun and learning. I have a day job in a global company; if I factored in my hourly rate on an Isolette restoration with new (made by me) bellows it would be expensive but I never think of the time or the raw materials.

There are just a lot of variables but WYC were honest and a great shop; lets just mourn another one gone.
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