What's Wrong With the Fuji 690 Series?

[Spanik]

Got 2x G690BL, 2x GM670, 50/5.6, 65/8.0, 100/3.5, 100AE and 180 (miss the 150). Very nice cameras but I use them less than I'd like. I do prefer them above the Mamiya Press which are unwieldy beasts but the changable backs are great as you can easily have different types of film in use at the same time. Love to find a GM680, that is a format I haven't used before.

Why I do like them a lot:
- extremely silent, the shutter is so quiet I often doubt it worked. Transport is not that quiet, more a coffee grinder.
- the slides that come out are simply stunning.
- coupled transport and shutter arming (the curse of the Mamiya Press)
- rugged! Have one that got beaten up in transport, serious dent at the bottom of the door. Works perfectly...

Why I use them not much:
- weight of a body with 2-3 lenses
- rangefinders, I'm not a fan of rangefinders, it slows me to the point I miss too much shots.
- I don't have a diopter for them so I cannot get a good view of the rangefinder
- slow lenses, sometimes even f/2.8 is at the slow side for me, even with iso400 film.
- no way to project 6x9 slides. I can't even have them scanned at my lab. And I certainly can't put up a 6x9 enlarger.
- close focussing is impossible

So I mostly use 6x4.5 gear. Much easier in use, can be projected, double number exposures on a film. Thing is if you take that monster out, then you can just as well take a Fuji 617 out. It's larger but barely heavier.

 

[Calzone]

Got 2x G690BL, 2x GM670, 50/5.6, 65/8.0, 100/3.5, 100AE and 180 (miss the 150).

I don't have a diopter for them so I cannot get a good view of the rangefinder

Spanik,

On your GM670 you can use Nikon diopters made for the Nikon F2. If you had a GL690 the F2 diopters also work and match the thread on the eyepiece. These do not fit your G690BL unfortunately.

Cal

 

[JChrome]

Got 2x G690BL, 2x GM670, 50/5.6, 65/8.0, 100/3.5, 100AE and 180 (miss the 150). Very nice cameras but I use them less than I'd like.

I'm currently in possession of two 150mm's.

I am thinking of re-coating a GL body with a new dark blue paint job and doing the same to the 150mm. If that project falls through (likely), then I'll sell one of the 150's.

 

[sevo]

Spanik,

On your GM670 you can use Nikon diopters made for the Nikon F2

All small round Nikon dioptres - Nikon had one size from F to F3 (non HP), Nikkormats, FEx/FMx/FA. It was not until the F3 HP (and AF cameras) that they switched to a bigger size. Beware, at all times they had some cameras or finders that took rectangular dioptres...

 

[Calzone]

All small round Nikon dioptres - Nikon had one size from F to F3 (non HP), Nikkormats, FEx/FMx/FA. It was not until the F3 HP (and AF cameras) that they switched to a bigger size. Beware, at all times they had some cameras or finders that took rectangular dioptres...

Sevo,

It is the small round diopters that from my experience were used on the F2 and F3 non-HP. Thanks for the additions that I was not aware of and the added clarity.

I use plain glass versions to protect my eyeglasses.

Cal

 

[JChrome]

Sevo,

It is the small round diopters that from my experience were used on the F2 and F3 non-HP. Thanks for the additions that I was not aware of and the added clarity.

I use plain glass versions to protect my eyeglasses.

Cal

Awesome tip!

That's another series of camera that are an amazing bargain and wonderful... Nikon F2's and F3's.

 

[kuzano]

Vast inventory coming out of Japan BECAUSE:

Vast inventory coming out of Japan BECAUSE:

1) People's priority is not about printing which is where the main advantage of a 6x9 negative comes from, but rather digitally sharing.
2) The production numbers of the series was very high.
3) The camera is heavy and inconvenient to shoot with.
4) Stiff competition from the Mamiya Rangefinders (even at 4x the price). People also love the jewel-like-quality of the Hasselblad 500 series.
5) Medium format is better suited for SLRs for critical focusing in a studio situation.
6) No meter. Lack of any automation.
7) Medium format is unpopular.
8) The 'ping' noise of the GW series (which is not* due to the shutter counter btw... this myth needs to die).

So, if you've shot with a 690 and didn't like it, can you give me a reason why you wouldn't want to shoot it? I'm happy with it as my every day camera, but I may just be a nut 😎

I love em....

But your list does not include the PRIMARY reason which I was told for the low prices.... TOO Many examples in the market, and all good condition because used and maintained highly.

Here's the story I was told. In fact this story also explains the one variant that was never imported to the US.

If you look close at the frame number selection, you will see the ability to shoot a 4 count roll. Now I've never seen a 4 count roll in the US, but they were (and maybe are) available for photographers who shot tourist images in Japan and perhaps other asian countries.

So, there appears to be a vast inventory of good used 690 "BTL"* bodies that never shot over 4 count rolls, which means the shutter count is way overstated on these bodies, since they operated by roll count x 10. The market may now be flooded with these bodies that have only really shot about half the frames indicated.

I watch these camera's all the time on eBay, and the most of them are coming into the US from Japan. That makes them a great buy, but the shipping is stiff at $55 to $65 routinely. Very little "free ship" on these.

Great Camera's Great Price. Even the GSW 65mm can be found for good prices in the first series, and the II series. Some tatty cosmetically III series can be found at $400 to $550, but generally more.

Yes, they are big... which is a plus for me... no little piddly no weight digital shaking in my hands. These babies are inertially stable, and the glass is fantastic.

None of the interchangeable lenses had the EBC coating except for the AE100 metered lens.

My favorite kit is the GL two shutter button 690 with the 100 mm lens and the 65mm lens.

OH yes, the variant never shipped to the US was the 680 model with a 6X8 frame... and I'm not talking about the GF680... I'm talking about a 6X8 Big Texas Leica.

I think the tale about the 4 frame count tourist market pretty well explains the low price because of the excessive inventory. Wonder if it's true.???

 

[kuzano]

I use my GL690 to shoot 6X17 Panorama

I use my GL690 to shoot 6X17 Panorama

I was itching for a Fuji or other 6X17 camera.

Then it struck me that I can do 6X17 with $500 of equipment.

I shoot 2 or 3 frames with overlap on the big Fuji. I do this on a tripod which I installed two leveling bubbles on... one at the rotational plane of the panning head and one on the top of the camera (hot shoe bubble?)

I don't mess with all that Nodal Point crap and don't feel the need for any special tripod heads because the subjects I shoot are beyond parallax problems... scenics and landscapes. I'm carrying less than $700 worth of Pano gear this way.

Get high res scans of the images, stitch with pano software. Lots of that around.

If I am careful I can simulate 6X17 and 6X24 with a good tripod and $500 worth of GL690.... I only use the 100mm lens because using the 65mm lens created problems in the stitching software with perspective.

Voila'

 

[kuzano]

My last point has to do with lens selection. I have seen users take one or the other of the focus helicals for the Fuji, and mount both large format or other "press camera" lenses.

One of the most interesting was a Mamiya Press 75mm from the Universal camera's mounted on the front of a Fujica focus mount/helical. That's one of the lenses I really like from Mamiya, I think a Planar formula, and very sharp. Makes a nice alternative lens for the Fujica 65MM.

 

[Calzone]

I would agree that prices are crazy low due to an abundant supply.

I would mention that the old Fuji's are very durable cameras that are both simple and overbuilt. I think like Nikon F3's the durability has caused a flooded market that killed pricing.

I once owned a Mamiya 6 and the 50/4.0, but I sold it and decided to keep the Fuji's for the long-long term. I kept the more durable camera and decided to go with the bigger negatives.

For the square I still have a Whiteface 3.5F.

At this point, due to unpopularity, I think owning and shooting an old Texas Leica presents itself as a cult status. Also I love great cameras that cost "no money."

Cal

 

[Calzone]

My last point has to do with lens selection. I have seen users take one or the other of the focus helicals for the Fuji, and mount both large format or other "press camera" lenses.

One of the most interesting was a Mamiya Press 75mm from the Universal camera's mounted on the front of a Fujica focus mount/helical. That's one of the lenses I really like from Mamiya, I think a Planar formula, and very sharp. Makes a nice alternative lens for the Fujica 65MM.

Kurzano,

Wow. Thanks for posting this. The idea kinda is making me crazy. Do you have any more info or links to supply?

Thanks in advance.

Cal

 

[JChrome]

Kurzano,

Wow. Thanks for posting this. The idea kinda is making me crazy. Do you have any more info or links to supply?

Thanks in advance.

Cal

+1 This idea makes me crazy as well but funnily enough I was thinking about it the other day.

Where can I get the adapter/helical!? This would open us up to a whole world of other lenses! The 50 6.3 is loads cheaper than the 50 5.6 Fuji. Also a 250mm would be divine...

 

[Calzone]

+1 This idea makes me crazy as well but funnily enough I was thinking about it the other day.

Where can I get the adapter/helical!? This would open us up to a whole world of other lenses! The 50 6.3 is loads cheaper than the 50 5.6 Fuji. Also a 250mm would be divine...

Jeremy,

For a ultra wide you should consider a Plaubel 69W Proshift with a Schnieder 47/5.6 Super Augulon. The bonus is this camera has shifts for perspective control. Since you are shooting color you would want to get one with the center filter.

The Plaubel incorporates a Mamiya Press back and if you have access to a 3-D printer you could kinda clone the lensmount and shift housing of the Plaubel.

You could buy a Plaubel 69W entire camera for the going prices of a Fuji Ultra-wide lens and have the bonus of perspective control like a large format camera, except on 6x9.

Cal

 

[JChrome]

I love em....

But your list does not include the PRIMARY reason which I was told for the low prices.... TOO Many examples in the market, and all good condition because used and maintained highly.

Here's the story I was told. In fact this story also explains the one variant that was never imported to the US.

If you look close at the frame number selection, you will see the ability to shoot a 4 count roll. Now I've never seen a 4 count roll in the US, but they were (and maybe are) available for photographers who shot tourist images in Japan and perhaps other asian countries.

So, there appears to be a vast inventory of good used 690 "BTL"* bodies that never shot over 4 count rolls, which means the shutter count is way overstated on these bodies, since they operated by roll count x 10. The market may now be flooded with these bodies that have only really shot about half the frames indicated.

I think the tale about the 4 frame count tourist market pretty well explains the low price because of the excessive inventory. Wonder if it's true.???

I agree about the abundant supply. I did mention that the production numbers were a large reason for the current pricing. Interesting idea about the quality though. Because so many were produced and they all are built like tanks, the number available that are working and in good condition is still very high and this would also drive the price down.

So with the 4 frame roll count - you are basically saying that the counter would count a roll as a roll regardless of the number of frames selected.

But I disagree with this - when I took apart the GW690 mkIII, I messed around with removing the counter on the bottom. Essentially the counter is actuated every time the shutter is depressed. There is no linkage between the counter and anything else.

Of course, they could have changed the design from the original GW690 and the Mark III but I doubt it.

 

[JChrome]

Jeremy,

For a ultra wide you should consider a Plaubel 69W Proshift with a Schnieder 47/5.6 Super Augulon. The bonus is this camera has shifts for perspective control. Since you are shooting color you would want to get one with the center filter.

The Plaubel incorporates a Mamiya Press back and if you have access to a 3-D printer you could kinda clone the lensmount and shift housing of the Plaubel.

You could buy a Plaubel 69W entire camera for the going prices of a Fuji Ultra-wide lens and have the bonus of perspective control like a large format camera, except on 6x9.

Cal

Cal, I would love to have a Plaubel. I adore the movements on my 4x5 and it would be great to have a 6x9 that could do the same.

That's a fair point about the ProShift costing as much as a 50mm Fuji. But I'll keep looking for deals on one of those. I saw a 65mm 5.6 sold for $250 a week ago... I should have pulled the trigger... dag nabbit!

 

[sevo]

I agree about the abundant supply. I did mention that the production numbers were a large reason for the current pricing. Interesting idea about the quality though. Because so many were produced and they all are built like tanks, the number available that are working and in good condition is still very high and this would also drive the price down.

I doubt that there were quite that many built - after all, Japanese bus tours are are relatively limited market segment, at least on a global scale. But there are more being offered now than of other workhorse medium format cameras which must (if only by their greater international distribution) have outnumbered it by magnitudes.

I think the secret of the high number of survivors lies in them mostly being sold to a Japanese corporate market (group tour bus operators), with long term services contracts (that even mandated a shutter replacement at regular intervals). Both the high attention Japanese employees (used to) give to their employer's tools and the service contract will have worked well towards the longevity of the cameras.

 

[chaospress]

It's a cool camera, gives great results, and in fact one print from it has been in my living room for the past 3 years. Problem is it's one of the most awkward cameras to carry and shoot with I've ever used. The viewfinder is adequate but unimpressive for someone who's used a Leica. But for around $300 if someone wants to produce fine quality prints it might a great option. Small digital cameras can equal it in IQ, though the results will be a bit different. I still have my GW690ii and should probably sell it.

 

[JChrome]

Small digital cameras can equal it in IQ, though the results will be a bit different.

Isn't this a contradiction? In other words, "The IQ can be equalled by small digital camers but the IQ will be different".

Also, it's a bold statement to say that a small digital camera could equal a 6x9 film camera in image quality. I really would disagree.

The two biggest difference in my mind is the tonality provided by the larger format and the character of those lenses.

A good drum scan of one of those 6x9 negatives could give you a gigapixel image (overkill of course but you could do it). This is not apples to apples with a digital sensor... but it blows the doors off of any small digital camera.

 

[chaospress]

Not a contradiction really, they have different image rendering. Have you shot with a Leica M9 or M240? Digital is getting better all the time.

I'm not challenging your reasoning for shooting a 6x9 Fuji. It can produce some great images. If you like it go for it, I'm glad some people are still shooting these cameras. I still shoot some film as well, but just for me personally, it's finally gotten to the point that compared to what I can get out of a digital Leica M, the convenience and ability to shoot more with one of these cameras is a good choice for me.

I hope you're not worrying about what other people do, if you like it stick with it and happy shooting!

 

[Scapevision]

Not a contradiction really, they have different image rendering. Have you shot with a Leica M9 or M240? Digital is getting better all the time.

I'm not challenging your reasoning for shooting a 6x9 Fuji. It can produce some great images. If you like it go for it, I'm glad some people are still shooting these cameras. I still shoot some film as well, but just for me personally, it's finally gotten to the point that compared to what I can get out of a digital Leica M, the convenience and ability to shoot more with one of these cameras is a good choice for me.

I hope you're not worrying about what other people do, if you like it stick with it and happy shooting!

Absolutely nothing I've seen out of those M's comes even close. I don't know where you got it 🙂 are you like talking sharpness or something?