nonot
Well-known
I'm looking at purchasing a medium format rangefinder and could use a little advice from those who have some experience with them.
The ones I'm mainly considering are cameras I can buy locally, specifically there is a Mamiya 6, a Bronica 645 and a Fuji 6x9 (though I'm not sure of the exact model).
As someone who generally never shoots with a flash, and certainly doesn't shoot in-studio I'm really just looking for a camera that's quick (relatively speaking) and has a decent array of lenses in case I want to search them out.
Am I overlooking an obvious choice? Should I even bother dropping the cash on any of these? What are your experiences shooting these beasts on the street?
Thanks!
The ones I'm mainly considering are cameras I can buy locally, specifically there is a Mamiya 6, a Bronica 645 and a Fuji 6x9 (though I'm not sure of the exact model).
As someone who generally never shoots with a flash, and certainly doesn't shoot in-studio I'm really just looking for a camera that's quick (relatively speaking) and has a decent array of lenses in case I want to search them out.
Am I overlooking an obvious choice? Should I even bother dropping the cash on any of these? What are your experiences shooting these beasts on the street?
Thanks!
JRG
Well-known
http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=44615
http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=675
http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=53745&page=2
http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=13885
... among, literally, dozens of similar threads to be found in the archives here.
http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=675
http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=53745&page=2
http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=13885
... among, literally, dozens of similar threads to be found in the archives here.
kuzano
Veteran
The Fuji tops my list....
The Fuji tops my list....
However, there may be a couple of considerations for you to ponder before proceeding.
Processing your own film? Availability of processing in your locale if not doing your own? Sending film for processing?
I am not trying to talk you out of it, but one of the primary reasons there are such good deals on MF cameras, is the increasing difficulty of getting this larger film processed.
I use, and am happy with, sending my film in through Walmart, who sends it to Fuji, who then sends it to Dwaynes. So, why not just send it to Dwaynes..... because doing it through Walmart is DIRT CHEAP! They do both E6 and C41 processing and I understand that Fuji does one and sends the other to Dwaynes.
I can get the film developed and get the negatives plus 8 5X7 prints for under $3. Transparencies generally run between $5-7.
Now, given that you are still interested (Medium Format by the way is wonderful and rewarding results abound), I favor the Fuji 6X9. There are a variety of models generally found by diligent searching (or waiting out eBay).
sites for the big Fuji's:
http://fujirangefinder.com/
http://www.dantestella.com/technical/gw.html
http://www.lallement.com/pictures/links.htm
I won't go into details, given the links here, Except to mention that none of the big Fuji's have meters.... hand metering only. The plus side of that is the cameras are totally mechanical, with no battery dependency whatsoever.
They are green mechanisms in that sense.
The Fuji tops my list....
However, there may be a couple of considerations for you to ponder before proceeding.
Processing your own film? Availability of processing in your locale if not doing your own? Sending film for processing?
I am not trying to talk you out of it, but one of the primary reasons there are such good deals on MF cameras, is the increasing difficulty of getting this larger film processed.
I use, and am happy with, sending my film in through Walmart, who sends it to Fuji, who then sends it to Dwaynes. So, why not just send it to Dwaynes..... because doing it through Walmart is DIRT CHEAP! They do both E6 and C41 processing and I understand that Fuji does one and sends the other to Dwaynes.
I can get the film developed and get the negatives plus 8 5X7 prints for under $3. Transparencies generally run between $5-7.
Now, given that you are still interested (Medium Format by the way is wonderful and rewarding results abound), I favor the Fuji 6X9. There are a variety of models generally found by diligent searching (or waiting out eBay).
sites for the big Fuji's:
http://fujirangefinder.com/
http://www.dantestella.com/technical/gw.html
http://www.lallement.com/pictures/links.htm
I won't go into details, given the links here, Except to mention that none of the big Fuji's have meters.... hand metering only. The plus side of that is the cameras are totally mechanical, with no battery dependency whatsoever.
They are green mechanisms in that sense.
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S
Steve Walton
Guest
All of the cameras you list have been discontinued so repairs and servicing may be difficult, especially with the Bronica.
Of the three you list I would choose the Fuji 6x9, preferably the later GW or GSW versions, depending on your own needs.
I used a Mamiya 7(11) for several years but sold it shortly after I obtained a Fuji GSW 690111. The Fuji produces superior transparencies to the M7(11) in my opinion and is a more robust camera. That is not to say that the M7(11) is a bad camera, it is very good in many ways but I prefer the quality of the Fuji images for landscape photography. With such a large frame size, the fixed 65mm lens is not so much of a limitation as you might think. With careful framing, the format lends itself well to cropping to a 'panoramic' format with superior image quality to that of the Hasselblad Xpan: roughly 30x90mm against 24x65mm
All medium format rangefinder cameras have their limiting factors, but if you want to see the real benefits of mf, I suggest you disregard 6x4.5 and look at formats from 6x6 upwards. Your decision should be based on your needs and preferred format.
Good luck with whatever you choose!
Of the three you list I would choose the Fuji 6x9, preferably the later GW or GSW versions, depending on your own needs.
I used a Mamiya 7(11) for several years but sold it shortly after I obtained a Fuji GSW 690111. The Fuji produces superior transparencies to the M7(11) in my opinion and is a more robust camera. That is not to say that the M7(11) is a bad camera, it is very good in many ways but I prefer the quality of the Fuji images for landscape photography. With such a large frame size, the fixed 65mm lens is not so much of a limitation as you might think. With careful framing, the format lends itself well to cropping to a 'panoramic' format with superior image quality to that of the Hasselblad Xpan: roughly 30x90mm against 24x65mm
All medium format rangefinder cameras have their limiting factors, but if you want to see the real benefits of mf, I suggest you disregard 6x4.5 and look at formats from 6x6 upwards. Your decision should be based on your needs and preferred format.
Good luck with whatever you choose!
hiromu
Established
Any reason not considering Mamiya 7II? I have owned in the past many of Fuji GW/GSW series and Mamya 7II, but the Mamiya was my favorite. Lenses are super sharp and operates very well. Also, it's smaller than Fuji GW670III.
sahe69
Well-known
I'd recommend first to make up your mind about the format, which will then narrow down the options also. Personally I'd go for the Mamiya 6 or 7(II). Well, actually I did that already 
35mmdelux
Veni, vidi, vici
I shoot MF with Mamiya 6. Compact and light to take anywhere. Sharp lenses.
dazedgonebye
Veteran
Availability of the 43mm lens on the Mamiya 7 pushed me in that direction. No other way (I think) of getting that wide.
sahe69
Well-known
There's always the SWC, but the approach is entirely different.
venchka
Veteran
The Fuji rangefinders don't have interchangeable lenses, do they? Some of the Bronica lenses are scarce and expensive.
There's a lot to be said for the Hasselblad SWC. Or the Mamiya 7 & 50mm and 43mm lenses. I like big negatives and I really like wide lenses.
Good luck.
There's a lot to be said for the Hasselblad SWC. Or the Mamiya 7 & 50mm and 43mm lenses. I like big negatives and I really like wide lenses.
Good luck.
dazedgonebye
Veteran
I stuck to rangefinders...
SeaninBrisbane
Member
Another vote for Mamiya 6 - if you like the square neg, which I do. The lens collapses into the body, making it ideal to carry around all day. Lenses seem to be cheaper than the Mamiya 7 too.
Trius
Waiting on Maitani
But why did the Medalist have to be so frikkin' ugly???
nonot
Well-known
Thanks everyone,
The main reason that I didn't list the Mamiya 7 is that I was listing cameras currently available to me locally. I'd very much consider it, but I'm not into buying cameras off of ebay.
Processing film of almost any type here in Toronto is pretty easy, we're fortunate to have labs that process it still, though I'm sure that could change down the road... fortunately I'm comfortable processing my own b&w stuff should they all give up on 120.
The Fuji that's for sale is a zoom lens, but it is fixed... so I think I'll search out the one with interchangeable lenses, or just wait for a M7 to pop up.
The main reason that I didn't list the Mamiya 7 is that I was listing cameras currently available to me locally. I'd very much consider it, but I'm not into buying cameras off of ebay.
Processing film of almost any type here in Toronto is pretty easy, we're fortunate to have labs that process it still, though I'm sure that could change down the road... fortunately I'm comfortable processing my own b&w stuff should they all give up on 120.
The Fuji that's for sale is a zoom lens, but it is fixed... so I think I'll search out the one with interchangeable lenses, or just wait for a M7 to pop up.
venchka
Veteran
The Fuji zoom lens camera is great. Does it also have autofocus? Fuji didn't make cameras with interchangeable lenses.
This camera was listed recently at LFPF:
As for shopping: This forum, APUG, Large Format Photography Forum all have great MF cameras for sale all the time.
This camera was listed recently at LFPF:
As for shopping: This forum, APUG, Large Format Photography Forum all have great MF cameras for sale all the time.
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ed1k
Well-known
Fuji with zoom lens sounds like auto-everything Fuji medium format point'n'shoot... I would vote for Fuji 690 manual focus with wide or normal lens. Those Fujinons are really good or they are broken. Fuji rangefinder with interchangeable lenses are very rare in America. Also Fuji has excellent all new 6x7 folder, but again with fixed normal lens.
venchka
Veteran
You didn't read what Sandy King had to say about the GA645Zi did you?
ed1k
Well-known
No, I didn't. GA645Zi is excellent camera and has very good lens. I cannot use auto focus; but it should not be an issue for anybody who can auto focus. I don't like zoom and prefer to walk; but again zoom should be just fine for everybody.
I think nonot is looking for Mamiya-6 or 7 if interchangeable lenses is a requirement. However, MF rangefinders do not offer as many lenses as leicas, sometimes lenses are so expensive that I'd rather buy two MF body with fixed lens. Wide and normal that's all I need.
Not a huge market for MF RF here in Toronto. This guy in Burlington sells Bessa III 667 folder (I have no relation and never dealt with him)
http://www.bigcameraworkshops.com/default2.asp
or you have to wait till something good second hand comes.
Eduard
I think nonot is looking for Mamiya-6 or 7 if interchangeable lenses is a requirement. However, MF rangefinders do not offer as many lenses as leicas, sometimes lenses are so expensive that I'd rather buy two MF body with fixed lens. Wide and normal that's all I need.
Not a huge market for MF RF here in Toronto. This guy in Burlington sells Bessa III 667 folder (I have no relation and never dealt with him)
http://www.bigcameraworkshops.com/default2.asp
or you have to wait till something good second hand comes.
Eduard
R
rpsawin
Guest
Second that....Mamiya 7II is a well built camera with top notch lenses. I use mine for Landscape & Seascape work and really enjoy working with it. The one drawback is the system is pricey.
Best regards,
Bob
kuzano
Veteran
Actually 47mm on 6X9 would be wider than 43 on 6x7 or 6x6
Actually 47mm on 6X9 would be wider than 43 on 6x7 or 6x6
The camera to do that would be the Graflex XLSW, which is usually not a rangefinder, but has an assortment of backs shooting various film formats up to 6X9. That camera is usually equipped with a very capable 47mm Schneider lens. It's shot either ground glass OR, because of the super wide format, can be shot zone focus quite nicely (large DOF).
Also, I think that if you shoot the GSW fuji's, (65mm) or the G690bl with interchangable lenses and have both the 65mm and the 100mm lenses, the 65 on 6X9 would be quite close to the coverage of the mamiya 6X6 with the 43mm lens.
I also have the Mamiya Universal Press rangefinder with the excellent Mamiya 50mm lens on 6X9. I use the 50, 75, 100 and 150 lenses. While its a larger camera, (it's a tank) it's reliable, the lenses are superb, and it's totally mechanical... no batteries.
Of course, I use it tripod mounted, or at the very least a monopod. I am long past the point of hand holding medium format. The cost of film and processing favors reducing the loss of images that hand holding usually produces. Increased sharpness and focus are both products of a stable base under the camera.
Actually 47mm on 6X9 would be wider than 43 on 6x7 or 6x6
The camera to do that would be the Graflex XLSW, which is usually not a rangefinder, but has an assortment of backs shooting various film formats up to 6X9. That camera is usually equipped with a very capable 47mm Schneider lens. It's shot either ground glass OR, because of the super wide format, can be shot zone focus quite nicely (large DOF).
Also, I think that if you shoot the GSW fuji's, (65mm) or the G690bl with interchangable lenses and have both the 65mm and the 100mm lenses, the 65 on 6X9 would be quite close to the coverage of the mamiya 6X6 with the 43mm lens.
I also have the Mamiya Universal Press rangefinder with the excellent Mamiya 50mm lens on 6X9. I use the 50, 75, 100 and 150 lenses. While its a larger camera, (it's a tank) it's reliable, the lenses are superb, and it's totally mechanical... no batteries.
Of course, I use it tripod mounted, or at the very least a monopod. I am long past the point of hand holding medium format. The cost of film and processing favors reducing the loss of images that hand holding usually produces. Increased sharpness and focus are both products of a stable base under the camera.
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