Desaturate or Not - that is the question

C

ch1

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I find that when I shoot chromogenic B&W it has a what I consider to be a "reddish" tint. Not quite a sepia look but not, to me at least, a B&W tonality as you would get with Tri-X or HP-5 etc.

Below are two photos. Other than sizing for upload, the only PS-ing I've done is to desaturate the one on the right.

Which do you think is closer to "traditional" B&W?
 

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I'm not really sure what you're asking. the one on the left isn't sepia - it's just pink. Sepia is a brown-red toner.

What's happening is that the scanner is assuming the film will have a orange mask like color film does. It's making an adjustment that isn't needed.

Just desaturate and you're fine.

allan
 
Thanks, Joe - that's what I thought.

Kaiyen - I think I said it was "reddish" and NOT sepia - thanks for your comments anyway.
 
I just tell my scanner that it is a black and white negative. No color is included in the scan.
Otherwise, I would certainly desaturate.
 
Desaturate isn't necessarily the "best" way to go.

If you want to really play; adjust your tones with the Channel Mixer in PS :)

Cheers
Dave
 
dazedgonebye said:
I just tell my scanner that it is a black and white negative. No color is included in the scan.
Otherwise, I would certainly desaturate.
Click to expand...

Yes, I do tell the scanner it's a B&W neg. I'm guessing that even so the scanner is "sensing" that it's a C-41 film? And if I just look at the negs - you can see they have a kind of orangy-reddish appearance so maybe it's just giving a "true" image of what it's being fed?

Right now I'm scanning some HP-5+ and these negs "tell" you they are B&W!

But I do find that the ease of getting chromogenics developed (and cheap too) is very attractive. I don't mind doing the desaturating (and also do some other PS "tweaking") - just wanted some "confirm" that it is "necessary" to get a truer B&W look.

BTW: the scanner is a Nikon 5000D.
 
copake_ham said:
Yes, I do tell the scanner it's a B&W neg. I'm guessing that even so the scanner is "sensing" that it's a C-41 film? And if I just look at the negs - you can see they have a kind of orangy-reddish appearance so maybe it's just giving a "true" image of what it's being fed?

Right now I'm scanning some HP-5+ and these negs "tell" you they are B&W!

But I do find that the ease of getting chromogenics developed (and cheap too) is very attractive. I don't mind doing the desaturating (and also do some other PS "tweaking") - just wanted some "confirm" that it is "necessary" to get a truer B&W look.

BTW: the scanner is a Nikon 5000D.
Click to expand...

Different scanners...different software.
I like the convenience of the chromogenics as well. Overall though, I'm finding I like to scan color better. The chromogenics don't seem to have the qualities that make black and white film worthwhile over color/scanning/PS. Can't say why....
 
dazedgonebye said:
Different scanners...different software.
I like the convenience of the chromogenics as well. Overall though, I'm finding I like to scan color better. The chromogenics don't seem to have the qualities that make black and white film worthwhile over color/scanning/PS. Can't say why....
Click to expand...

Simple, you're in AZ and right now I am in NY (although I have a house in Tucson that I don't get to visit as much as I'd like).

So YOU do not have to go through cold, gray Winters like I do. :mad:

And YOU get to shoot color/chrome all year round! really :mad:

But one of these days I will finally get to become "retired" and then I can go to my house in Tucson and just shoot color too! :D

BTW: Not really mad - just envious. Where in AZ are you located?
 
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I live in Glendale and work in North Scottsdale. Been here for about 12 years...Virginia before that, Louisiana before that.
The sunshine actually gets to be a drag. All of my outdoors galleries have cloud covered landscapes because on the rare days when there are clouds in the sky, I shoot like a fool.
 
What you could do is look at each channel and determine which you like best and use that one (similar to using channel mixer, but more user friendly). My nikon cs v doesn't give this pink tint, it gives me this funny yellow one.
 
George,
Sorry about that. I completely misread your post. I thought you did say sepia (when you did not) and that you were dealing with a lab scan (which you were not). To top it off, I re-read my response and I sounded like a jerk.

sorry.
allan
 
Hi George. I kind of like the extra deep of the non-desaturated one. Maybe not the exact tone of the colour. So I took the liberty to change the first non-desaturated one in the colour balance dialog in PS.

(Let's hope my totally uncalibrated laptop screen makes something horrible here... ;) as it is not my picture to ruin.)

/matti
 

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George

I scan my C41 B&W film as a colour neg, then use, dare I say it, auto colour correction and auto contrast followed by USM and then convert to greyscale. Seems to work. I also shoot it at 200 not 400.

Nikon Bob
 
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copake_ham said:
I find that when I shoot chromogenic B&W it has a what I consider to be a "reddish" tint. Not quite a sepia look but not, to me at least, a B&W tonality as you would get with Tri-X or HP-5 etc.

Below are two photos. Other than sizing for upload, the only PS-ing I've done is to desaturate the one on the right.

Which do you think is closer to "traditional" B&W?
Click to expand...


If you were to enlarge the negs traditionally, or got prints from a lab, it would result in black and white photographs. If your choice is to scan the neg, then desaturate it.
 
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