paulfish4570
Veteran
if - IF - i go interchangeable lens digital "rangefinder," full frame sony or APS-c fuji? i have been using an X100 for years, and still much enjoy it.
oh, yeah: and why?
oh, yeah: and why?
Fuji X-pro or Sony A7c: which one?
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Ko.Fe.
Lenses 35/21 Gears 46/20
The only one RF style FF Sony I'm aware of is A7c. With Samyang tiny 24 and 35 mm it is in RF style and size. If I would have extra free thousand USD, I would switch to it from my Canon RP. But I don't have these money.
Used M240 price on lucky day and not greedy place isn't far from it. And you could have true RF lenses next to nothing if you are on tight budget after getting M240.
Used M240 price on lucky day and not greedy place isn't far from it. And you could have true RF lenses next to nothing if you are on tight budget after getting M240.
michael_isaev
Newbie
I would say Fuji.
I tried Sony nex-6 and didn’t like it’s menu and ergonomics, it was hard no for me. It didn’t feel like a proper camera after using digital nikon and film nikon and leica. I picked x-t2 and I am very happy with its results. Considering that you’re using x100, I would put ergonomics as number one reason.
Reason number two is IQ. In camera jpeg is usually fantastic. Plus it would likely fit in whatever workflow you’re currently using with x100.
Reason number three is lenses. Fuji has several very good lines of lenses. I have 16/1.4, 23/1.4, 35/1.4, all of them are not only great optically, but also have nice rendering. 35/1.4 is really growing on me as having some sonnar traits. 23/1.4 is probably my favorite lens (I’m a 35mm guy). 16/1.4 has unbelievable IQ. But in addition to that, fuji has a couple of pancakes (18/2 is my usual default lens or part of 2-lens kit with 35/1.4). There is a so-called fuji-cron line with compact and technically very good lenses. I don’t personally like their rendering compared to f/1.4 line, but a lot of people like those lenses a lot.
There are couple sony lenses I would love to have, like zeiss sonnar 35/2.8, but fuji looks like a much better system for what I want.
I tried Sony nex-6 and didn’t like it’s menu and ergonomics, it was hard no for me. It didn’t feel like a proper camera after using digital nikon and film nikon and leica. I picked x-t2 and I am very happy with its results. Considering that you’re using x100, I would put ergonomics as number one reason.
Reason number two is IQ. In camera jpeg is usually fantastic. Plus it would likely fit in whatever workflow you’re currently using with x100.
Reason number three is lenses. Fuji has several very good lines of lenses. I have 16/1.4, 23/1.4, 35/1.4, all of them are not only great optically, but also have nice rendering. 35/1.4 is really growing on me as having some sonnar traits. 23/1.4 is probably my favorite lens (I’m a 35mm guy). 16/1.4 has unbelievable IQ. But in addition to that, fuji has a couple of pancakes (18/2 is my usual default lens or part of 2-lens kit with 35/1.4). There is a so-called fuji-cron line with compact and technically very good lenses. I don’t personally like their rendering compared to f/1.4 line, but a lot of people like those lenses a lot.
There are couple sony lenses I would love to have, like zeiss sonnar 35/2.8, but fuji looks like a much better system for what I want.
keytarjunkie
no longer addicted
Get one of the Sony's if your focus is on image quality/output. Get one of the Fuji's if your focus is on the process of photography. None of them will produce a bad image, but obviously they are all quite different (there are three X-Pro's and nearly a dozen A7 variations).
For what it's worth, I have a Sony A7R II. I use it to scan my film. The sensor is amazing. I hate using it for photography and find it frustrating to operate. I owned a X100 when it first came out about 9 or 10 years ago...it was really fun to use but I wasn't satisfied with the sensor. They have improved a lot since then.
Part of the appeal of owning a mirrorless full-frame sensor camera was using RF lenses on it. But, the Sony sensor stack is actually not very useful for any wide angle lenses. If you're hanging around on this forum and you enjoy the RF experience, then you should just get a used M240. It is a better choice if you like rangefinders and have some older Leica (or Nikon) RF lenses to use.
For what it's worth, I have a Sony A7R II. I use it to scan my film. The sensor is amazing. I hate using it for photography and find it frustrating to operate. I owned a X100 when it first came out about 9 or 10 years ago...it was really fun to use but I wasn't satisfied with the sensor. They have improved a lot since then.
Part of the appeal of owning a mirrorless full-frame sensor camera was using RF lenses on it. But, the Sony sensor stack is actually not very useful for any wide angle lenses. If you're hanging around on this forum and you enjoy the RF experience, then you should just get a used M240. It is a better choice if you like rangefinders and have some older Leica (or Nikon) RF lenses to use.
Dogman
Veteran
Sony has EVF with no OVF option. Fuji has both OVF and EVF. I'm not an EVF fan so it's an easy decision for me.
Not sure about the practical optical quality superiority of Sony over Fuji. I shoot full frame Nikons and Fuji APS-C and they're pretty much the same when printed the same size.
Pick the one you like best. Both are good cameras.
Not sure about the practical optical quality superiority of Sony over Fuji. I shoot full frame Nikons and Fuji APS-C and they're pretty much the same when printed the same size.
Pick the one you like best. Both are good cameras.
paulfish4570
Veteran
A7c, yes. i'd edit the title if i could.
my lenses would a 50-ish equivalent, and a 28/35 equivalent.
as for native lenses: sony or fuji?
the fixed 23 on my x100 is superb.
i am a huge fan of the elmar 50/2.8, pentax M 50/14, and zuiko 25/1.8 on my om-d em-5. i still have the 50/1.4 on an ME. the elmar is decades gone with the m3 on which it was mounted. my nikkor 50/2 also is a favorite ...
my lenses would a 50-ish equivalent, and a 28/35 equivalent.
as for native lenses: sony or fuji?
the fixed 23 on my x100 is superb.
i am a huge fan of the elmar 50/2.8, pentax M 50/14, and zuiko 25/1.8 on my om-d em-5. i still have the 50/1.4 on an ME. the elmar is decades gone with the m3 on which it was mounted. my nikkor 50/2 also is a favorite ...
AlwaysOnAuto
Well-known
I have Sony's A7ii and A7iii. I most recently got a Sony 24-105 lens. It is an amazing lens. I started with a Sony Nex-7, using manual lenses with it. The desire to 'see' the lenses at their full focal length is what drove the A7ii purchase. The A7iii was a gift to myself for having put up with used camera's for as long as I have, so it was purchased new. It is a phenomenal camera, especially when paired with the 24-105 lens.
They both work well with my old Nikon lenses, the one Minolta lens and Leica lenses also, all via adapters of course. The Sony 28mm is a really sharp lens, as well as light weight.
I feel very fortunate to have these two cameras sitting on my desk.
I vote for Sony.
They both work well with my old Nikon lenses, the one Minolta lens and Leica lenses also, all via adapters of course. The Sony 28mm is a really sharp lens, as well as light weight.
I feel very fortunate to have these two cameras sitting on my desk.
I vote for Sony.
Ko.Fe.
Lenses 35/21 Gears 46/20
Sony A7c should have no issues with old 50mm lenses. And it will give no crap, sorry, crop factor.
With old manual lenses all I do on FF mirrorless is to set camera to AV, ISO to Auto and VF in MF mode with focus peaking. Here is really no need to do anything else. My camera screen is flipped to the back. EVF is superior to optical for this. No menus diving is needed. Just exposure compensation sometimes. And A7c has it.
Even more so, for LTM and M lenses, here is AF adapter for them on Sony
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1233758-REG/techart_pro_talmea7_leica_m_lens_to.html/overview
It means any old lens which will stick on M adapter will be autofocused. Including old Nikkor 🙂.
Range-rover
Veteran
To be honest, I had the Sony A7II, the camera size was nice but what's the point
when the lenses are bigger, and the crazy flash shoe, didn't like that and the menu's
are like the long and winding road. So I sold it all including my Nikon Stuff and went
for a X-pro2 and a few lenses and also went for a XT-1.
when the lenses are bigger, and the crazy flash shoe, didn't like that and the menu's
are like the long and winding road. So I sold it all including my Nikon Stuff and went
for a X-pro2 and a few lenses and also went for a XT-1.
ColSebastianMoran
( IRL Richard Karash )
Sony A6xxx cameras are terrific. Excellent focus aids make is great with manual focus lenses. I have the A6000 and A6500. And, the Sony/Zeiss lenses are excellent, 55 f/1.8 and 24 f/1.8. these are my go-to.
narsuitus
Well-known
I used the Fuji X-Pro1 and X-Pro2 rangefinder-style cameras until Leica made a rangefinder camera that I liked - the M10.
JeffS7444
Well-known
I think one consideration is whether you can get the lenses that you want, at a price, and with a size and weight which are agreeable!
I haven't had the opportunity to handle the A7C + SEL2860 compact zoom lens. But that lens intrigues me, and experience to date with original A7 and A7R IV has been very positive. The newer camera has great battery life in addition to a whole laundry list of improvements over the older, already good original A7.
As for Fujifilm, I don't really know: I'm sure I could rationalize the purchase of yet another camera system, but in that direction madness lies.
I haven't had the opportunity to handle the A7C + SEL2860 compact zoom lens. But that lens intrigues me, and experience to date with original A7 and A7R IV has been very positive. The newer camera has great battery life in addition to a whole laundry list of improvements over the older, already good original A7.
As for Fujifilm, I don't really know: I'm sure I could rationalize the purchase of yet another camera system, but in that direction madness lies.
Faintandfuzzy
Well-known
The Sony has horrible ergonomics and an awful EVF. The Fuji is a camera...the Sony is an appliance. And in any normal print size, you won’t see any difference between ALAC and so called full frame...ignore any crap comments
Archlich
Well-known
We'll have the X-E4 in like another month. Basically a X-Pro3 sans the OVF and all the titanium nonsense.
I'd much prefer that.
I'd much prefer that.
paulfish4570
Veteran
i have been out of touch with digital developments for several years. my x100, olympus 0m-d em-5, film cameras and smart phones have been sufficient. had no idea of the xe-3 and lens interchangebility. i do enjoy the form factor of the x100. thanks.
jsrockit
Moderator
Not entirely accurate...the X-E series, while cool...they just aren't built the same way and have smaller EVFs etc. Their are a lower end model in every sense. Still, not could be what the OP is looking for.
OP, you can't go wrong with whichever option you choose. I'd go for the X-Pro3 or the A7c. They are current and up to date. I agree with Dogman about the differences in IQ.
It really depends on if you are sensitive to haptics and ergonomics. Sony is the most digital of digital cameras in regards to feel. For RFF users, the X-Pro feels more familiar and closer to a camera in feel.
paulfish4570
Veteran
thank you, all.
Evergreen States
Francine Pierre Saget (they/them)
Do you plan on adapting lenses or using native lenses? I haven’t had good experiences adapting SLR lenses to my X-Pro1. Between the corner viewfinder placement and the extra length the adapters add, the balance feels unbearably awkward in a way that isn’t the case with cameras with central viewfinder placement.
I can’t speak on the Sony lenses, but if you go Fuji, I’d get a 1.4/35mm and pair it with either the 2/23mm or 2/18mm. The 1.4/35mm is a variation of the classic Double Gauss 50mm. The 1.4/35mm, 2/18mm and 2.4/60mm lenses are of the same generation and have a pleasing balance between sharpness and softness while the 2/23mm, 2/35mm, 2/50mm and 2.8/16mm are more contrasty with more abrupt focus transitions. So pick from the former if you like the Leica look and from the latter if you like the Zeiss look.
That said, I have no issues going back and forth between the 1.4/35mm and 2/23mm even within the same set.
The 2/18mm and 2/35mm both are software corrected for barrel distortion, while the 1.4/35mm and 2/23mm are both optically corrected for distortion. The 2/23mm does vignette heavily, however, and may cause noisier images after correction.
I’ve never used the 2/18mm save for trying it out in a camera shop.
You can also get the 7Artisans 1.2/35mm if you want a Sonnar 50mm equivalent.
I can’t speak on the Sony lenses, but if you go Fuji, I’d get a 1.4/35mm and pair it with either the 2/23mm or 2/18mm. The 1.4/35mm is a variation of the classic Double Gauss 50mm. The 1.4/35mm, 2/18mm and 2.4/60mm lenses are of the same generation and have a pleasing balance between sharpness and softness while the 2/23mm, 2/35mm, 2/50mm and 2.8/16mm are more contrasty with more abrupt focus transitions. So pick from the former if you like the Leica look and from the latter if you like the Zeiss look.
That said, I have no issues going back and forth between the 1.4/35mm and 2/23mm even within the same set.
The 2/18mm and 2/35mm both are software corrected for barrel distortion, while the 1.4/35mm and 2/23mm are both optically corrected for distortion. The 2/23mm does vignette heavily, however, and may cause noisier images after correction.
I’ve never used the 2/18mm save for trying it out in a camera shop.
You can also get the 7Artisans 1.2/35mm if you want a Sonnar 50mm equivalent.
michael_isaev
Newbie
Here’s a pdf brochure of all fuji x lenses and accessories. 35/1.4 looks more like sonnar, it doesn’t have much from double gauss.
nikon_sam
Shooter of Film...
You know I have the a6000 and I love it...bought it in late 2017 and I haven't bought another body since.
Don't let the Menu scare you...once your basic function buttons and other fine tuning is set you don't do too much in there...
I own one Sony lens and overall its pretty good...I would love a full frame Sony but that might not happen for a while...
I also have the Nikon, Tamron, Canon, Pentax K and Minolta adapters for manual focus lenses...
Don't let the Menu scare you...once your basic function buttons and other fine tuning is set you don't do too much in there...
I own one Sony lens and overall its pretty good...I would love a full frame Sony but that might not happen for a while...
I also have the Nikon, Tamron, Canon, Pentax K and Minolta adapters for manual focus lenses...
