kevin m
Veteran
I think the cropped sensor of the M8 eliminates a good deal of the horrible vignetting the Noctiliux has wide open.
venchka
Veteran
I've seen some very nice photos from a Noctilux stopped down well below 1.4. A most versatile lens.
Unless things have changed drastically, and this may account for the steep price increase, all Noctilae (or at least the optical elements) were made by a Canadian firm whose name escapes me at the moment.
Unless things have changed drastically, and this may account for the steep price increase, all Noctilae (or at least the optical elements) were made by a Canadian firm whose name escapes me at the moment.
Sonnar2
Well-known
There is one problem in the "ultra-exclusive niche strategy" for LEICA:
With a pricetag of 6k USD they may receive their actual production costs for a like-handmade series of few hundred Noctiluxes, plus some profit. But selling these few lenses will not bring enough money to spend some R&D effort for the next generation of highspeed lenses.
Design-wise, the actual 50/1.0 already is the oldest lens in LEICA's program: 32 years (15 years younger than the Canon 0.95). At prices of 6k USD some people who want it will look at the used market first...
With a pricetag of 6k USD they may receive their actual production costs for a like-handmade series of few hundred Noctiluxes, plus some profit. But selling these few lenses will not bring enough money to spend some R&D effort for the next generation of highspeed lenses.
Design-wise, the actual 50/1.0 already is the oldest lens in LEICA's program: 32 years (15 years younger than the Canon 0.95). At prices of 6k USD some people who want it will look at the used market first...
Krosya
Konicaze
ampguy said:
Hmmm, even IF so (and it's a big IF), people just realize that now? This lens has been around for a while but just within a year or so had gone up in price so much.
Olsen
Well-known
sitemistic said:
Again; this depends in what currency you have your salary paid in.
Remember Einstein? 'Everything is relative'. Remember?
I checked up the two large shops selling Leica here in Norway. Both offers the Noctilux for NOK 32.300 with 20% sales tax included. They have obviously fallen asleep and have forgotten to add the 5% Leica price increase- - Or have they just kept the prices as they are since NOK has increased with 'about' 5% compared to Euro's in the last 12 months anyway? A Noctilux has always cost around 30.000 NOK as far as I can remember. So, what price increase...?
Again; the price increase in USA is compensation for the dollar fall. Who to blame? The Leica managment cannot be blamed for that the value of the dollar is decimated within weeks. Not even Einstein could have told you who to blame. To blame George Bush or Greenspan is making things way too simple. Look up the face in the bathroom mirror every morning; that's the guy to blame. You are at least closer.
Sure, to give 6,000 $ for a lousy lense is absurd if you make 55,000 $ per year, which was a typical norwegian salary (qualified tech. teacher, lower government official, medium managment) back in early 2002. Today the same guy makes more than 100,000 $ - mostly due to the dollar fall. The Oslo Ford dealer advertised recently (I showed the link here earlier) for 'qualified car mechanics' and are willing to pay 50,000 NOK per month. - That's 100,000 $ per year too....
So, what price increase...?
etrigan63
Rangefinder Padawan
Krosya said:
Something similar happened in the US during the Prohibition. When denied access to some object/substance/service it's desirability increases. Supply and Demand. Cut the supply and the demand (and price) will go up dramatically. In this case, raise the price to make the object "unreachable" and more will strive to reach for it.
I just ordered a used Zeiss 50mm Planar f/2 LNIB + Hood for 1/10th the price.
Tuolumne
Veteran
Olsen: "Today the same guy makes more than 100,000 $ - mostly due to the dollar fall."
The market giveth and the market taketh away. I wouldn't go buying any investment real estate on the strength of that kind of salary.
/T
The market giveth and the market taketh away. I wouldn't go buying any investment real estate on the strength of that kind of salary.
/T
MikeL
Go Fish
sitemistic said:
I'd say it's a multipurpose lens, with the typical associated tradeoffs of multipurpose tools, but with a special purpose price. I'm not a big fan of all-in-one kinda tools- if I want a watch I don't buy one with a calculator on it too- but I've been surprised but everything the noctilux can do, and do pretty well. To my eye, images look very similar to pre-asph summilux from f1.4 and above- sharp enough (for me) on center, not too much contrast, flare resistant.
But you are right sitemistic in that you pay extra (weight and cost) for f1.4-f1, in which the lens is a whole different beast. The images from the noctilux wide open are distinct. I've looked at some of Chris Weeks images and ones where he used a noctilux wide open are pretty obvious. Improved film and sensors may decrease the need for f1, but for low light with the same film speed it can be handy. Not everyone wants/needs f1, and the "character" is definitely not for everyone (one could interchange "flaws" for "character" if they want). Not everyone likes Summar or Summitar images either, but since they don't cost much, they are not as polarizing or people feel less need to express their opinion.
I think it would be interesting if the noctilux cost the same as the CV 35mm nokton. Would it have the same appeal? Same with the Noct-Nikkor. Who uses it to shoot stars? The performance of the nokton is impressive and more consistent across apertures. It's lighter than the noctilux. I think CV should stop production on it, and watch the prices skyrocket on their remaining inventory.
Okay, my procrastination session is over.
I think the noctilux is impressive for what it does and I don't mind the weight. But if someone has a recent pre-asph summilux and $3600, send me a pm. I don't need the sharpness and contrast of the asph summilux either, so no offers there.
cmogi10
Bodhisattva
etrigan63 said:
and you're getting a completely different lens for 1/10th the price, not a better or worse lens, just a different one.
I don't see the relevence.
That being said, congrats on the lens, I've seen some great work from it.
kevin m
Veteran
You'll be pleased with that lens; I know I miss mine. Very nice imaging, as you mentioned, but it also handles very well. Not too big, and you can focus it by drawing your finger across the barrel. It's pretty sweet.
If I run out of patience with the infinity lock on the Canon 50/1.2, I might be trading up.
ampguy
Veteran
well...
well...
I just started using it and posting photos from this lens recently ...
well...
I just started using it and posting photos from this lens recently ...
Krosya said:
Hacker
黑客
venchka said:
Does Elcan or Raytheon ring a bell?
MikeL
Go Fish
kevin m said:If I run out of patience with the infinity lock on the Canon 50/1.2, I might be trading up.
Kevin, I just posted my Noctilux in the classifieds. I'll give you a discount since I know you've been jonesin' for one.
Nice photos by the way with the Canon.
etrigan63
Rangefinder Padawan
cmogi10 said:
Never said it was better or worse. I was looking for a nice 50 with good bokeh and have read excellent reports on this lens. It's a good lens, same focal length, couple stops slower, and 1/10 the price. Would I get a Nocti if I could afford it? Give me six winning lotto numbers and I'll get you one too Carl.
Buying this lens is a step up for me since my current arsenal is all CV glass and I would like Zeiss glass. Still the 40mm Nokton will be hard to beat with Zeiss glass. I don't see them making a 35mm f/1.5 anytime soon. Still I may sell off my CV 25mm and the Nokton for a Biogon 25mm and later pickup an 85mm for the long end.
Hacker
黑客
Tuolumne said:The market giveth and the market taketh away. I wouldn't go buying any investment real estate on the strength of that kind of salary.
/T
Leveraging on one's finances by paying only the downpayment for uncompleted real estate can be a possiblity.
Tuolumne
Veteran
Hacker said:
Say...have you heard about the housing bubble?
/T
kevin m
Veteran
Ha! Thanks Mike, and G/L with the sale.
cmogi10
Bodhisattva
etrigan63 said:Never said it was better or worse. I was looking for a nice 50 with good bokeh and have read excellent reports on this lens. It's a good lens, same focal length, couple stops slower, and 1/10 the price. Would I get a Nocti if I could afford it? Give me six winning lotto numbers and I'll get you one too Carl.
Buying this lens is a step up for me since my current arsenal is all CV glass and I would like Zeiss glass. Still the 40mm Nokton will be hard to beat with Zeiss glass. I don't see them making a 35mm f/1.5 anytime soon. Still I may sell off my CV 25mm and the Nokton for a Biogon 25mm and later pickup an 85mm for the long end.
Well your getting a nice 50, that's been on my radar for a while now.
I'm going to hold you to the noct
And the Zeiss 25mm gets rave reviews, if I was in your shoes I would sell the pair to get the Zeiss.
Hacker
黑客
Tuolumne said:Say...have you heard about the housing bubble?
/T
The adage holds true: Sell high, buy low. I think few people would have made a mistake engaging in the buying and selling of properties in the last 24 months (or stocks and shares).
I love housing bubbles. Maybe pick up a bargain or two to finance GAS attacks?
JohnTz
Member
I made up my mind, I want one of these f1 lenses. Don't want to debate if they are worth the price or not. Here is my question, is now the time to buy? Do these f1 babies go up and down in price? I have not been able to get much historical info on this. I have no problem paying the current 5K price for a used one, but just a year ago they were much less. Am I buying one at the top or are these lenses going to continue to go up in price? I haven't been around the Lieca camp long enough to have a feel for it.