Inexpensive MF system with interchangeable backs?

mcgrattan said:
Here in the UK the prices for some of the various Japanese MF cameras with interchangeable backs -- Bronicas and Mamiyas -- have dropped down now into a price range only fractionally above the price of a Kiev. So if I were buying now I'd be looking for a Mamiya RB.

That said, I have a Salyut [the earlier version of the Kiev] and it's been very good for me. Focusing screen not as good as on the Mamiya [I've borrowed one a few times] and I don't think the standard lens on the Salyut is quite as good as on the Mamiya, but the results from the Salyut are still really excellent.
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Mamiya RB is a great camera, but it's super huge and heavy. It's good for a studio, but not to carry around. I used to have one but sold it.
As far as focus screen on Kiev/Salut - well, original screen is a bit dim, but Kiev made some newer version, which for sure fits Kiev 88 ( as I have it), and will probably fit Salut. You can find them on ebay for about $40-50 USD. Here is a shot to show how bright a new screen is - at least as good as Mamiya or I think even brighter:
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I have a replacement screen in mine [the old one cracked]. Not sure if it's the brightest one available, I think it's just one of the standard split-image ones that Arax and others sell. If there are brighter screens out there, that's good to know.

The Mamiya RB screen was noticeably brighter [and sharper edge to edge]. The Salyut/Kiev is, as you say, much more compact and easy to carry. Mine fits in the same small case I'd carry a 35mm SLR in.
 
CameraQuest said:
the idea of interchangeable backs was to SAVE money by not having to buy another camera body.

that is no longer true as medium format roll film cameras are so incredibly cheap compared to their pre-digital days.

translation: buy whatever you want and then add more bodies if you still need an extra back -- only just turn it into an extra camera body instead.

Stephen
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Indeed, another C330 body wouldn't be much, but at the moment, the TLR format isn't the best for certain things, and it
s not a light camera at all. A SLR style MF camera with interchangeable backs and a waist-level finder that doesn't weigh a ton is what I'm shooting for now after having used the TLR for a while. For some things it's great, but it certainly has its downsides for a number of situations.
 
"hey, i shoot a leica so i do prefer the finer things in photography, but i have only seen a handful of shots taken on a hasselblad that would justify the extra cost. that's just my opinion based on my own observations."

Um...what? First of all, a Leica and a few lenses is easily as (or more) expensive than MF. I have a Leica and two MF systems: Mamiya 6 and Bronica S2. There is simply no comparison--they blow 35mm away.
 
katgut@earthlink.net said:
"hey, i shoot a leica so i do prefer the finer things in photography, but i have only seen a handful of shots taken on a hasselblad that would justify the extra cost. that's just my opinion based on my own observations."

Um...what? First of all, a Leica and a few lenses is easily as (or more) expensive than MF. I have a Leica and two MF systems: Mamiya 6 and Bronica S2. There is simply no comparison--they blow 35mm away.
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You're saying that a MF camera blows a Leica away?
 
Take a look at the Mamiya M645 Super...
Removable Back, Waist Level Finder and right now you can get great deals on glass

KEH has these and great prices...

I have a M645 1000s but wouldn't mind one of these as a back-up...
I haven't used the Super so I don't know how they feel or how well they're made...
 
nikon_sam said:
Take a look at the Mamiya M645 Super...
Removable Back, Waist Level Finder and right now you can get great deals on glass

KEH has these and great prices...

I have a M645 1000s but wouldn't mind one of these as a back-up...
I haven't used the Super so I don't know how they feel or how well they're made...
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Anything with a waist-level finder that's light and portable in the MF size you'd recommend?
 
guy-montag said:
You're saying that a MF camera blows a Leica away?
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Yes. I have shot with a Leica, a Hasselblad and a Mamiya 645 as well as the Mamiya C330. ALL of the medium formats completely blow away Leica, and any other 35mm. Leica's lenses are magnificent, but they still expose a tiny postage stamp sized film. Honestly, all the major medium format systems has sharp lenses and no 35mm comes close to any of them. Most Leicas are shot with grainy 400 speed films that don't show the detail those lenses cam capture anyway.
 
guy-montag said:
Anything with a waist-level finder that's light and portable in the MF size you'd recommend?
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You can get a waist level for the 645 Super. I wouldn't do it with any 645 camera though, to big a pain to shoot vertical photos. 645 needs a prism. You want waist level, get a Hasselblad, a Bronica SQ (or SQa or SQai), or a Rolleiflex.
 
Chriscrawfordphoto said:
You can get a waist level for the 645 Super. I wouldn't do it with any 645 camera though, to big a pain to shoot vertical photos. 645 needs a prism. You want waist level, get a Hasselblad, a Bronica SQ (or SQa or SQai), or a Rolleiflex.
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Is the Bronica SQ fairly lightweight? Being a college student, I don't quite have the $$ for a Hasselblad 🙁
 
guy-montag said:
Is the Bronica SQ fairly lightweight? Being a college student, I don't quite have the $$ for a Hasselblad 🙁
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Probably lighter than a Hasselblad. I have a Hasselblad that was a gift, I could never afford one either if I had to pay for it. I'm a grad student and single father, so i know how it is. It is heavy, more so than my old Mamiya 645 was. I think my Hasselblad weighs about what the Mamiya C330 does...just from memory.
 
If you were in Europe I'd suggest a couple of Pentacon Six SLR's, having 6x6 format and 220 capability (though that is less useful these days of course). They are a much higher build and design quality than the Kievs.

There are several sources for re-built and guaranteed cameras, and the Zeiss glass is both good and cheap. Obviously they don't have a changeable back, but the whole body costs about the same as a magazine-plus-insert and you don't get the bent/kinky film problem as the film path is pretty flat.

However, the waist finder is less comfortable in use than that of the C330, as it lets more light on to the screen, but there is a vertical magnifier which works very well indeed - also metered and un-metered prisms etc.

The question would be if the postage costs from the EU would outweigh the conveniences of the camera....
 
Chriscrawfordphoto said:
Probably lighter than a Hasselblad. I have a Hasselblad that was a gift, I could never afford one either if I had to pay for it. I'm a grad student and single father, so i know how it is. It is heavy, more so than my old Mamiya 645 was. I think my Hasselblad weighs about what the Mamiya C330 does...just from memory.
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Phew! Yeah, trekking through downtown Dallas with my C330 gives me a serious neck ache after a few hours, and I'm not a small person at all!
 
MartinP said:
If you were in Europe I'd suggest a couple of Pentacon Six SLR's, having 6x6 format and 220 capability (though that is less useful these days of course)
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I'm all over 220 heh. Given that it's only about $1.50 more than 120 to develop over here in Dallas, for twice the amount of frames, it's a steal 😀

One of the reasons I'm big on waist level finders is that it allows for street photography that isn't as blatant as sticking a big camera up to your face. If you're seated and looking down at a camera, people don't really notice you as much. Plus it allows for a more steady platform than holding a camera up by hand.
 
guy-montag said:
Is the Bronica SQ fairly lightweight? Being a college student, I don't quite have the $$ for a Hasselblad 🙁
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I once picked up one of those new high-dollar DSLRs with one of those high-zoot zoom lenses, and realized just how light my Bronica SQA was.

I carry the Bronica SQA in my hand when shooting. No bag, no grip, no strap; and it is comfortable for me to carry around. Pack a pants pocket full of film and a light meter in the other (if you feel you need one) and set out to photograph.
 
Bob Michaels said:
I once picked up one of those new high-dollar DSLRs with one of those high-zoot zoom lenses, and realized just how light my Bronica SQA was.

I carry the Bronica SQA in my hand when shooting. No bag, no grip, no strap; and it is comfortable for me to carry around. Pack a pants pocket full of film and a light meter in the other (if you feel you need one) and set out to photograph.
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That sounds like my style exactly 🙂

A Bronica sounds more and more like the best bet for the various qualities I'm after.
 
The Kiev 60 is a Russian version of the Pentacon 6. They can be had very cheaply these days. I used to think mine was quite big but not really compared to some of todays DSLR's. Lenses are inexpensive and usually quite good. Frame spacing is not great. Once you wind the Kiev 60 do not touch the wind lever again until it is time to wind on or you will screw up the frame spacing. Pentax 6x7 can be had cheaply now altho mine always seemed to eat batteries. Basic Hasselblad kits have fallen greatly in price and I always like the way a blad felt in my hand but I suspect the Bronicas are an even better value. Especially if you want more than just the standard lens. Good Luck, Joe.
 
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