Teuthida
Well-known
buy the m9. just dont expect it to improve your work. it wont
M9 - buyer remorse? (currently looking to get one)
- Thread starter brokencivilian
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gdi
Veteran
I thought paying about $4500US for a Canon 1DMkII was more than I would ever spend again. But a few years later it was gone and I paid about the same for an M8. If I had waited for it, an M8.2 would have been $6000. When I bought my new M9 it cost less than a M8.2 new -about $5600.
The top of the line Canons and Nikons are close in price to the M9 - none are cheap, but there are ways a creative person can rationalize the expense!
Archiver
Veteran
My photography got worse after I bought the M9. Up until then, I used a DSLR mostly as a high-grade P&S, hardly ever bothering with managing shutter speed or aperture. Just roll the zoom dial, focus, recompose and shoot. A bit of exposure compensation here and there, but that was about it. I expected the M9 to meter like a DSLR, much to my detriment. For the first few weeks the M9 was an object of hair-tearing frustration and I wondered if I had made the right choice.
In time, I learned to meter correctly. I learned about things like the Sunny 16 rule, something I'd never had to bother with in a DSLR or P&S. My keeper rate went up and my hair started to grow back.
Being limited to primes was also a big shock. Coming from Canon zooms like the 24-105L, 16-35L and 70-200/4L, adjusting myself to one focal length at a time was very trying. Not to mention the inaccuracies of rangefinder VF framing! And the inability to focus closer than 70cm without arcane attachments! And that damn manual focus!
But I overcame these conditions, too. I learned to shoot with one to three primes and compensate for the imprecise framing. I learned hyperfocal and zone focus techniques and how to prefocus by feel. Even though I had a Zeiss Ikon and swag of lenses, I never shot with it enough to get this kind of feedback or frustration. As a tangent, shooting sporadically with an Ikon is in no way adequate preparation for a M9!
Within a few months after buying the M9, I took it to Japan with four lenses, including the ZM 21/28, CV 35/1.4, 50/2 Summicron and CV 75/2.5. I hardly used the 75. My most used lenses were the 21 and 35, with the 50 for more studied or 'short tele' work. And in that time I shot some of the best work I had done to that date.
The M9 didn't make my work better. It made me work much harder and learn many things that had been missing from my photographic education. You won't suddenly find your work transformed with a M9, but you may find it compels you to up your game until it appears like it has.
zauhar
Veteran
I guess everyone on rff buys their cars and houses for cash!
The OP should not worry too much about going into debt for the m9, provided he can handle the payments. The cost is comparable to a used car - hopefully it will have more significance for your future.
Randy
The OP should not worry too much about going into debt for the m9, provided he can handle the payments. The cost is comparable to a used car - hopefully it will have more significance for your future.
Randy
Araakii
Well-known
Your experience is shared by many, but all you need to "learn" is to get the most basic camera, say a M3. Then you will also learn all the film stuff that you missed out on. So a M9 is not necessary in this regard.
Richard G
Veteran
I caved in and bought an M9 yesterday. I am very happy with it. The biggest deficiency is the lousy resolution of the LCD on the back. But nailing focus is seldom an issue with a Leica so I suppose it doesn't really matter. Yes the cost hurts and I am not out of the woods of buyer's remorse in terms of should I have changed from film to this, and wouldn't my X100 have been enough or shouldn't I have just bought the X Pro 1 with all three lenses for a few thousand less... But I would still have been shooting a lot of film with my Leicas, which I hope I still will, still making the family wait for some precious shots, still explaining why it was black and white and still traipsing across town each week to buy film and get it developed.
The advantages are the instant digital, the quality of the files, the compact M experience and the 1/4000 shutter speed to make my fast lenses relevant in most lighting situations. The high ISO is not something I have fully explored yet of course, but it is better than me having 400 ISO as my usual maximum. With Light Room apparently one can set it up to get some good pictures even at 2500. I am looking forward to that.
Should I have held out for the M10? Maybe. But that will be dearer again, probably, and the core business offered by the M9 is enough for me and available now. An M10 ought to have a better LCD screen, and maybe a better sensor. But perhaps the sensor will only be different, better in some ways, and not better in others.
So, no remorse. Yet.
The advantages are the instant digital, the quality of the files, the compact M experience and the 1/4000 shutter speed to make my fast lenses relevant in most lighting situations. The high ISO is not something I have fully explored yet of course, but it is better than me having 400 ISO as my usual maximum. With Light Room apparently one can set it up to get some good pictures even at 2500. I am looking forward to that.
Should I have held out for the M10? Maybe. But that will be dearer again, probably, and the core business offered by the M9 is enough for me and available now. An M10 ought to have a better LCD screen, and maybe a better sensor. But perhaps the sensor will only be different, better in some ways, and not better in others.
So, no remorse. Yet.
Gabriel M.A.
My Red Dot Glows For You
Do people return their brand-new $20,000 motorcycle because it didn't drive like their used $2,000 Corolla? I guess there's no arguing with people's choices, unless those choices were based on some far-out logic.
If people are going to complain about the money paid for a brand, people shouldn't be paying money for a brand.
As useful as complaining about how much more expensive bottled water is compared to a can of Cherry Coke (there are more ingredients and surely the metal is far more expensive than the plastic!). Just don't buy it if it's not for you, and get some tap water. Or a Cherry Coke.
If people are going to complain about the money paid for a brand, people shouldn't be paying money for a brand.
As useful as complaining about how much more expensive bottled water is compared to a can of Cherry Coke (there are more ingredients and surely the metal is far more expensive than the plastic!). Just don't buy it if it's not for you, and get some tap water. Or a Cherry Coke.
braver
Well-known
What utter and complete nonsense. Unlike a straight debt for an item that will not last and will decrease in value immediately, a mortgage on a house can work out to be an investment while a car or a camera can only be an investment if you're in business to make money with them. In most cases you save to pay off a mortgage, and the interest on those savings will make sure that in the long run you'll have paid less for that house than you would if you'd payed with cash. If all goes well you can end up paying about halve the value of the house. Again, underlining my earlier point, if you don't have a lot of money, look to pay less for things not more.
It's not wise to buy a car on credit. Like cameras and other luxury items, buy the one you can afford. Let the ones with the money take the biggest hit of depreciation (you lose about 10% the minute you leave the showroom) and buy your car second hand. Same logic applies to other luxury items like cameras. Different logic applies to primary needs (do you get in debt for your groceries?) and to real estate.
It's moot to discuss this further however, I bet the OP has left this thread.
brokencivilian
Established
Cause I was trying to explain things - but not to get financial advise.
I don't expect it to.
THANK YOU. Someone that understands where I am coming from.
Pablito
coco frío
The photographer does that part, not the camera.
Vickko
Veteran
Welcome to the "club".
I haven't really weighed-in on this thread. Interesting thread though. Yeah, if one has high speed lenses, the faster shutter speed (oh I wonder where the 1/8000 went) and the lack of performance at high ISO is less important.
I've had my M9 over a year now. No remorse, although I still have a fridge full of film.
Enjoy the new camera.
...Vick
I haven't really weighed-in on this thread. Interesting thread though. Yeah, if one has high speed lenses, the faster shutter speed (oh I wonder where the 1/8000 went) and the lack of performance at high ISO is less important.
I've had my M9 over a year now. No remorse, although I still have a fridge full of film.
Enjoy the new camera.
...Vick
Cyriljay
Leica Like
I don't do any comments. but as I own M8.2u I guess M9 is better. But so far I am happy with M8 and I think I don't need a M9 as my photos are far more better than other photos I see done on a M9. You have to pay that price if you own a Leica and I already started from M6 and That is still my back up body for M8.
Richard G
Veteran
Thanks very much Vick.
I am still on a learning curve, shooting in A mode a lot but I did some manual at lunchtime today. The sensor is great and the shutter options are sensible. I particularly like the discreet mode. I haven't fully explored the higher ISOs and my minimum shutter speed. The real learning curve is more the digital workflow. I am trying out Lightroom, never having come to grips with Aperture, and being embarrassed by my continuing reliance on iPhoto. With the X100 I shoot JPEGs and have next to no processing required.
I quickly became confident with the X100 and was given great confidence from the many wonderful RFF posts by insightful experts. It seems now that the next step is to put myself through some training in software to get the most out of the M9 camera. That was always going to come at some point anyway I suppose.
Richard G
Veteran
Lunchtime today. ISO 160 (I think). 50mm C Sonnar.
L1000158.jpg by Richard GM2, on Flickr
This is not the look of remorse. Same lens, at f2
L1000183.jpg by Richard GM2, on Flickr
L1000158.jpg by Richard GM2, on Flickr
This is not the look of remorse. Same lens, at f2
L1000183.jpg by Richard GM2, on Flickr
crispy12
Well-known
I moved from iphoto to lightroom myself a few months ago. It's an amazingly powerful program, you won't regret it.
Lax Jought
Well-known
I have an M8.2 and have only one 35mm lens (for an approximately 50mm equivalent on the 1.3x crop). I've been photographing almost exclusively with just this for the better part of a year now and I've been really happy with this combination. Occasionally there have been times when I wished I had a telephoto.
If I had an 18mp full frame M9 with 50mm lens, I'd be quite content use that exclusively for the next couple of years.
Lax Jought
Well-known
Also, I had the cash when an M8.2 popped up on eBay. Could I have afforded to spend that kind of money on a Leica at the time? Probably not, but I had enough cash to buy that M8.2 and one Voigtlander 35mm f/1.4 lens and although I had buyer's remorse for a month, over time the remorse faded away as my photography has improved in leaps and bounds in a way that could never have happened with the Canon 7D and Panasonic LX5 which I already owned at the time.
I'll tell you what I would have regretted - if I had waited a few years until I really had enough cash to throw around (if indeed that was going to happen) and bought the Leica later. I'd have completely missed the fun, the education, the knowledge and everything else I've gained with having the Leica in the past year and now.
I'll tell you what I would have regretted - if I had waited a few years until I really had enough cash to throw around (if indeed that was going to happen) and bought the Leica later. I'd have completely missed the fun, the education, the knowledge and everything else I've gained with having the Leica in the past year and now.
jsrockit
Moderator
Haha, I was thinking the same thing. If it wasn't for paying over time, some people would never be able to buy anything.
zauhar
Veteran
Another thing - whenever I have extra cash, some emergency arises to snatch it away. Maybe better to buy a "non-essential" on short term credit even if you have the cash.
I will assume the OP has the M9, hope he is enjoying it.
Randy
Teuthida
Well-known
Or you could have bought a Pentax Spotmatic for $50 and learned the exact same lessons.
It amuses me when Leica cultists ascribe all sorts of mystical powers to their cameras. Anthropologists call it 'magical thinking.' whatever works to convince you the camera was worth the price you paid.
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