Newbie: Head In The Cloud

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hssammy

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UPDATE 4/16:
THANKS FOR ALL THE CONSTRUCTIVE COMMENTS:

NOW
1) it seems like i should get my hands on M8 before getting it, anyone knows any good camera rental store in chicago area? n whats the pricing?

2) will CANON Ti? NIKON 5000D be a good replacement for M8?

3) n from all of you guyz, it sounds like using M8 required some skills...but i dun understand...isnt all you do is manual focus n shoot (in simple sense)? what makes it so difficult? sorry if it sounds offensive (i dun mean to be)..i am juz trying to understand..



UPDATE 4/9 (2):
Thanks Al Kaplan!

my thing is...i only have a budget to get either a M8.2 or the Noctilux len..(its not a happy world..uh)..n i m thinking to get a canon Canon EF 50mm f1.4 or 1.8 for the M8.2..or...........should i flip it around to get a canon DSLR n get a Noctilux?? what will get me closer to the style i want (sharp person n blur background in Noctilux style)..

n if there's any suggestions,is it possible to send me a link to the shopping site of the items that u guyz suggest? since i m a hard time finding those..

THANK AGAIN!



UPDATE 4/9:
THANK YOU EVERYONE FOR THE INFORMATION.
I am more and more interested in taking photo as days pass~

However, can anyone answer:
1) ok, i understand camera from one brand uses its own lens..but howcome
people are able to use canon lens for M8? (THE FLICKR LINK IN FIRST POST) By converter? If so, wuts the gds and bads..

2) also, if i am get a olympus e620, wut lens should i get in order to shoot the pictures style i want? (THE FLICKR LINK IN FIRST POST)



UPDATE 3/26:

Thank you for all the helps 🙂
i hv my questons answered...


umm.......or not? coz i have new questions!

1) it seems like DSLR is a gd option for me too, considering the price...but if DSLR can get the effects of RF..then y are ppl willing to pay more for RF? wut so unique abt RF?
2) can a DSLR use a RF type of lens?? for example..Canon EF 50mm f/1.8 II? how fast is fast? and what is those 50mm,38mm...etc?
3) the combination i hv now in my mind...a) Olympus E620 + Canon EF 50mm f/1.8 II. b) M8 (actually does it matter if i get a M8 or M8.2???) + Canon EF 50mm f/1.8 II. WHAT DO U GUYS THINK!
4) any good website to buy a camera? (amazon, newegg...etc???)






Hi everyone in RFF. I am 23 year old male who are recently interested in learning/getting better photo-shooting. I owned a leica d-lux3 for couple yrs. However I couldnt get the kind of effect I want with it. And now I would like to step-up to a DSLR/RF.

I am most interested in 3 models, Olympus E620 (the different modes seem great), M8 and Epson RD1x (only have 6megapix??seems low). After comparing the effect on flickr, I found myself addicted with couple photo on flickr and would like to shoot something like it.

(photo in link:http://www.flickr.com/photos/moaan/2863106926/in/set-72157594388332602/) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/moaan/2844128345/in/set-72157594388332602/) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/moaan/2595101787/in/set-72157594388332602/). In conclusion, I love taking photo of people with a blurry background. I do have limited budgets, but not restricted (as I work). My question is:





1) what should i get? DSLR VS RF
2) how hard is using a RF? is it impossible to skip from point and shoot to RF?
3) what lens to get for RF?
$) what else to think/decide about?




I will update my process as much as possible~
THANK YOU EVERY RF EXPERTS ON THIS SITE!
 
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If you have any kind of limited budget, then you're going to get a LOT more for the money by buying a DSLR and a fast lens for it. You could set yourself up with a nice beginner's rig plus a good fast lens for those shallow depth of field portraits for less than a grand, or spend as much as you want on nicer kit and get a lot more features than the digital RFs offer.

The prices on the couple models of available digital rangefinders is at best usury in the case of the limited run and feature limited Epson RD, and mostly lives somewhere south of exorbitant blackmail with the M8. As Hans Voralberg noted above, Leica also asks thousands of dollars for the Noctilux lens alone.

All boils down to how much you're willing to spend and how badly you want an RF.
 
It might well be that you end up with an M8, but I suspect that you might want divert before getting there. A second hand, older make of dSLR comes by very cheap, and would give you some training and more of a basis for deciding.

You sound seriously interested in pursuing a certain style, and for that the most important is really practice. I think most photographers work themselves through a lot of gear before finding what works for them, and the best way to do that is to start with picking up something cheap. Then you can keep it if it work, or sell it off and buy something new to explore. Buying new is for keeps really, as you will never get back more than a fraction of what you bought it for these days...

(You might even consider experimenting with film perhaps, and if so there are really good packages out there in the lesser brands.)
 
UPDATE 3/26:

Thank you for all the helps 🙂
i hv my questons answered...


umm.......or not? coz i have new questions!

1) it seems like DSLR is a gd option for me too, considering the price...but if DSLR can get the effects of RF..then y are ppl willing to pay more for RF? wut so unique abt RF?
2) can a DSLR use a RF type of lens?? for example..Canon EF 50mm f/1.8 II? how fast is fast? and what is those 50mm,38mm...etc?
3) the combination i hv now in my mind...a) Olympus E620 + Canon EF 50mm f/1.8 II. b) M8 (actually does it matter if i get a M8 or M8.2???) + Canon EF 50mm f/1.8 II. WHAT DO U GUYS THINK!
4) any good website to buy a camera? (amazon, newegg...etc???)
 
1) I think you may have a bit of a skewed notion of exactly what effect on your final picture the style of camera has. While SLRs and RF's have different strengths and weaknesses, much of that is in the handling/shooting experience. If you try to shoot the same picture with an RF and an SLR with both using comparable lenses with the same settings, the images are going to look pretty much alike with the differences boiling down to the design of the lenses rather than the cameras.

2) Again, I think you have some misguided notions. The Canon EF 50mm f1.8 II would count as a fast lens, but it's for EOS-mount Canon SLRs, not rangefinders. In any case, you identify a lens by what type of lens mount it's made for. Whether the lens mount falls into the world of rangefinders or SLRs is really unimportant because once you know which mount, then you know where it stands. It is possible to use adapters between different mounts, but I personally don't think it's worthwhile in the majority of cases.

3) As mentioned in 2, the combos in your mind are not viable. If you buy an Olympus DSLR, you want to look for Olympus Zuiko-compatible lenses. If you buy an M8, you want to Leica M-compatible lenses. There is no universal lens mount that all camera makers follow, and nor could there be really.

4) B&H and Adorama are reliable vendors among others, but... it seems obvious you're not ready to buy given you were hoping to match a Canon EF lens to any and all of your potential camera choices. Time for a bit more homework so you have a better understanding of what the options mean.
 
Get a Canon EOS 450d (Digital Rebel XsomethingI, XTI I think now? or XFI?) with a fast 50mm lens and practice with that, especially firing in aperture-priority mode (Av). Once you've done that for awhile see if you can play with an M8 and see how it goes.
I migrated from my 400d to my M8 in a similar manner. A nice cheap entry-level DSLR is a good toy to play with and to learn more advanced photography techniques on, I think.
As to why RF over DSLR? Like many others, for me it's partially because the M8 is such a compact camera compared to a DSLR (and because Leica lenses are just wonderful). The M8 is also a joy to use, very "instant" unlike my 400d I found.
 
A lot of us went straight to rangefinder cameras back before what we now call "point 'n shoots" existed. It's possible to learn to use a meterless rangefinder camera, then buy a meter later and learn to use that. Actually you'll learn a lot more by doing it that way. You'll learn more about light and about what you can do with a camera.

There is also a lot to be said about starting out with a film camera. Costs favor film cameras. There are tons of used ones out there at beggars' prices and film isn't all that expensive. You won't spend as much on computer stuff, or spend as much time staring at the screen. DSLR is only a set of four letters, not a prescription for performing magic.
 
hssammy said:
2) can a DSLR use a RF type of lens?? for example..Canon EF 50mm f/1.8 II? how fast is fast? and what is those 50mm,38mm...etc?
3) the combination i hv now in my mind...a) Olympus E620 + Canon EF 50mm f/1.8 II. b) M8 (actually does it matter if i get a M8 or M8.2???) + Canon EF 50mm f/1.8 II. WHAT DO U GUYS THINK!
Click to expand...

2) nope.
3) those combinations won't work...i don't think.

what's your budget?
 
dfoo said:
As a first or only lens 50mm on a rebel is terrible, way too long.
Click to expand...

Stock 18-55 that comes with the EOS is fine, but if he wants the DOF shots then he'd need the fast 50mm... although that said, I do agree with you, as an only lens it's probably not the way to go.
 
The OP is winding you all up.

Don't you realize this?

Later, ppl 😎😎😱😱😱😕
 
THANK YOU EVERYONE FOR THE INFORMATION.
I am more and more interested in taking photo as days pass~

However, can anyone answer:
1) ok, i understand camera from one brand uses its own lens..but howcome
people are able to use canon lens for M8? (THE FLICKR LINK IN FIRST POST) By converter? If so, wuts the gds and bads..

2) also, if i am get a olympus e620, wut lens should i get in order to shoot the pictures style i want? (THE FLICKR LINK IN FIRST POST)
 
To answer your first question, the M8 has a standard Leica M bayonet mount. When Leica switched from thread mount to the bayonet mount when they introduced the M3 they made the body one millimeter thinner so they could make an adapter to put the thread mount lenses on the bayonet bodies. Canon started out by making rangefinder camaras with the Leica thread mount. These can be used on the Leica M8 with a bayonet adapter. Nikon also made Leica thread mount lenses.

Sorry, I have no idea what an Olympus e620 is.
 
Thanks Al Kaplan!

my thing is...i only have a budget to get either a M8.2 or the Noctilux len..(its not a happy world..uh)..n i m thinking to get a canon Canon EF 50mm f1.4 or 1.8 for the M8.2..or...........should i flip it around to get a canon DSLR n get a Noctilux?? what will get me closer to the style i want (sharp person n blur background in Noctilux style)..

n if there's any suggestions,is it possible to send me a link to the shopping site of the items that u guyz suggest? since i m a hard time finding those..

THANKSS AGAIN!
 
nah i wuz kddng.

The lens you mention won't work very well. For one, it will not be rangefinder coupled. and of course you realize it won't auto focus. For some reason after Al just explained that the Canon lens you hear about for Leica is a lens that was made (back in the olden days) especially for a Leica, you went right back to talking about a modern Canon SLR lens. Forget about it. If you are serious about getting a Leica then you will need to get a lens that works on the Leica. And that pretty much limits you to lenses by Leica, Voigtländer, and Zeiss, as well as some Russian lenses. If you are clever about searching for rarities, then you might be able to find those old Canon and Nikon made-for-Leica lenses.

On the other hand, the Olympus you are lookiing at sounds like an exciting, radically modern dslr. I wouldn't mind shooting around with one of those for a while.
 
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