Timmyjoe
Veteran
Get real, "anecdotal", did you read the snowflake's post. "I mostly shoot film" ipso facto, all millennials mostly shoot film, so they, and Gen Z, would not be interested in this digital camera. Corran seems to speak for not just one generation, but two.
And yes, I'm feeling quite curmudgeonly today! Thank you very much.
:angel:
Best,
-Tim
Pál_K
Cameras. I has it.
I’m pretty sure this is it:
http://www.mir.com.my/rb/photograph...ikkormat/fseries/ft3/images/f2dp11.inside.jpg
Aperture rings add complexity and cost to the lens during the manufacturing process. Canon hasn’t had aperture rings since the last FD lens in 1986. As much as I love aperture rings, I’m surprised it took Nikon so long to introduce the G lenses. When that happened, I knew that was the direction of all Nikon’s future lenses.
Putting my moderator hat on...
Beats me why everyone is getting so worked up about this camera, but please lets try and keep the conversation civil folks.
Retro styling...
... the target market for this camera is definitely not RFF members
Beats me why everyone is getting so worked up about this camera, but please lets try and keep the conversation civil folks.
The target market for this camera is not RFF members.
Retro styling...
... the target market for this camera is definitely not RFF members
gavinlg
Veteran
I think this point is where the dividing line on the subject sits. There is a group that sees the traditional dials as a 'retro' design choice - a case of function following form, and there is another group that sees the traditional dials as a functional advantage.
I myself am in the second group. I do like to see my 3 main control settings (shutter/aperture/ISO) 'at a glance' without needing the camera turned on. I also like pre-setting the exposure as i walk around without having to lift the camera (as I do on my film leica). The z50 style control layout doesn't allow this - the z50 must be lifted to the eye or one must use the rear lcd screen to view your main settings. In both instances the camera must be turned on. Functionally, this means a fumble of sorts every time one turns the camera on and sets up for a scene.
The higher end cameras like my Z6 have a top screen that shows major settings at a glance, but the settings can't be seen or adjusted unless the camera is on. For what it's worth, it forces me to use the Z6 differently to the way I used my fujii xt/xp cameras and my film leica.
Interestingly I see this divide split across my hobbies - in the car world there are constant internet wars over wether or not manual transmissions are better or worse than modern auto's, although I haven't seen the manual transmission referred to as a 'retro' transmission yet
Perhaps the term 'retro' means vastly different things to different people. 'Graceless' is a term I'd use to describe my fathers nikon d3300 with its single control dial, and no way to change the ISO without going into the menu - a thoroughly modern design that completely eschews control for the sake of simplicity. From his perspective it's probably far less intimidating.
Pál_K
Cameras. I has it.
As am I. This second group is form follows function, which I think is the more common phrase. Thus, functionality is paramount and the form (the styling) is a consequence of the function. Barnack Leicas are the perfect example.
…
Interestingly I see this divide split across my hobbies - in the car world there are constant internet wars over wether or not manual transmissions are better or worse than modern auto's, although I haven't seen the manual transmission referred to as a 'retro' transmission yet
…
Cars… that did it. But first:
Over on another photo site there’s some nitwit disparaging film cameras, film photography, and all users of film cameras. His thinking is “digital is superior in every way”. To him, it’s all about specs: higher ISO’s, higher resolution, and so on. To him, the highest resolution photo is the best photo. The latest equipment is always the best. He truly does not understand what makes an image worth looking at.
Same thing with cars. I have two nice mid-engine cars with manual transmissions. These are somewhat “old”, so I’m not driving something that looks like an iPhone inside. A co-worker was yapping at me at how quickly the automatic transmission could shift on his car compared to my manual transmission cars. I simply told him that it’s not about speed, it’s about enjoyment of the process, being involved with the car. Learning to double clutch downshift or do any number of things with a manual transmission gives you a sense of mastery and control that you’ll never have with an automatic or paddle-automatic transmission. I feel the same way about almost all new “features” being added to cars - many of which cater to and compensate for distracted drivers that don’t pay attention to what’s alongside them or in front of them. We don’t have drivers anymore, we don’t even have appliance operators, we have appliance owners. I don’t need a feature to tell me there’s a pedestrian in front of my car or that there’s a stop sign ahead. I could go on…
JeffS7444
Well-known
Olympus and Sony offer it on their higher-priced lenses, and likely Nikon could as well if they wanted to. It's all fly-by-wire and simply overrides any other control assigned to the function.
Corran
Well-known
Timmy seems to be following the trend of making stuff up to "trump up" false narratives. Give it a rest please.
gavinlg
Veteran
I couldn't agree more, in fact that entire passage could have come out of my mouth directly many times.
farlymac
PF McFarland
That's kind of what I thought. It reminded me of the images I used to get from my TZ-3, all smeared in the backgrounds. I think I'll pass it on when I upgrade my DX system camera.
PF
farlymac
PF McFarland
Hey! While you all have been getting your knickers in a wad about how everyone/no one will be using the Zfc, DP Review has their first impressions out.
I like what I'm seeing so far, even in the pre-production unit sample photos, but am disappointed they didn't upgrade the card slot from UHS-1 to 2. But, the 28mm lens that will be supplied initially as part of a kit (separately later on) is in fact an FX lens, so when you mount it on a Z5, 6, 7, or 9 it will be 28mm FX, not dumb-ed down to DX framing.
PF
I like what I'm seeing so far, even in the pre-production unit sample photos, but am disappointed they didn't upgrade the card slot from UHS-1 to 2. But, the 28mm lens that will be supplied initially as part of a kit (separately later on) is in fact an FX lens, so when you mount it on a Z5, 6, 7, or 9 it will be 28mm FX, not dumb-ed down to DX framing.
PF
gavinlg
Veteran
Some images I thought were interesting from dpreview's initial review -
This design was executed much better than the over-hyped Df of a few years ago.
Main problem for Nikon is the poor selection of DX lenses.
Main problem for Nikon is the poor selection of DX lenses.
agentlossing
Well-known
Overall, I don't hate it. I think Nikon has actually done a pretty good job of differentiating their own approach to retro styling, it really doesn't look Fuji, even though that's the knee-jerk comparison to make. I'm actually rather impressed with the somewhat odd choice of the tiny window for aperture. It addresses the need for quick acquisition of F-stop without having to commit to putting an aperture ring on the lenses, which they're obviously not going to do. Better than Fuji being inconsistent with the rings earlier on. However if it doesn't display the value when the camera is asleep or switched off, there's part of its utility gone.
This is really going head to head with the XE4, even down to the same 40mm equiv kit lens. Of course, it's 20mp Bayer compared to 26mp X-trans. Plus Fuji's hipster film sims. Tough call.
This is really going head to head with the XE4, even down to the same 40mm equiv kit lens. Of course, it's 20mp Bayer compared to 26mp X-trans. Plus Fuji's hipster film sims. Tough call.
Archiver
Veteran
I like the design a lot, as I like the handling and styling of cameras like the Pentax ME, Olympus OM etc. If only it was a full frame camera, I'd buy this in a heartbeat. I only just bought a Panasonic S5 to mainly use with manual lenses, but a full frame version of this would be spot on.
As an aps-c camera, i see this is a way for Nikon to develop the aps-c line. They likely have market research that suggests that the market for this camera is going to be okay with aps-c size sensors.
As an aps-c camera, i see this is a way for Nikon to develop the aps-c line. They likely have market research that suggests that the market for this camera is going to be okay with aps-c size sensors.
Pál_K
Cameras. I has it.
If Nikon profits from this camera and emerges healthier than they would have been without it, I’m happy. I want Nikon (and all other) camera manufacturers to survive in these tough economic conditions that exist today for cameras.
This new camera is not for me, as I have plenty of F-mount lenses and no desire to add Z lenses. The Df, however, is looking better all the time. Had my crystal ball told me Nikon would introduce the Df, I would not have bought a (lightly used) D700 six months earlier.
This new camera is not for me, as I have plenty of F-mount lenses and no desire to add Z lenses. The Df, however, is looking better all the time. Had my crystal ball told me Nikon would introduce the Df, I would not have bought a (lightly used) D700 six months earlier.
olakiril
Well-known
I wouldn't mind a Df looking like Dfc even if that meant an EVF instead of that lousy OVF that it came with.
I also hope this is a success for Nikon. Maybe it will drive them to make a FF model as well.
Highway 61
Revisited
Hey, if you go to DP Review you notice that the specs. are summarized in five points, and that among those five points there are two points :
- Burst shooting up to 11 fps with full AF (9 fps with 14-bit Raw)
- Oversampled UHD 4K video at up to 30p, using the sensor's full width
Archiver
Veteran
Hey, if you go to DP Review you notice that the specs. are summarized in five points, and that among those five points there are two points :It tells it all about what it is, what it is not, what the market target is, what the market target is not.
- Burst shooting up to 11 fps with full AF (9 fps with 14-bit Raw)
- Oversampled UHD 4K video at up to 30p, using the sensor's full width
It sounds right up my alley. Seriously. I'm all about rapid burst shooting, and regularly use video for personal and paid work. And I love the look of classic cameras of that era. Darn it, this thing is starting to look more attractive.
Disappointed_Horse
Well-known
I like what I see as well. I'm primarily a film shooter but I'm interested in a new digital camera for travel without worrying about film going through the new CT scanners. Also the FE is probably my favorite camera so this new model is right up my street. The fact that it weighs 25% less than my FE and has a collapsible lens adds to the attraction for this role.
Unfortunately I do think that by pairing the Zfc with a special edition full frame prime lens and announcing the development of the DX 18-140 Z lens at the same time, Nikon is effectively telling us to forget about any Z DX primes. If they were ever going to make any Z mount DX primes, this would have been the time to introduce them.
Unfortunately I do think that by pairing the Zfc with a special edition full frame prime lens and announcing the development of the DX 18-140 Z lens at the same time, Nikon is effectively telling us to forget about any Z DX primes. If they were ever going to make any Z mount DX primes, this would have been the time to introduce them.
gavinlg
Veteran
To be fair, all they need is a couple of f2 and f2.8 FX primes that are designed to be small, and it'll be good. An 18 or 20, a 24, (they have the 28 and 40), and a 58.