JRG
Well-known
"I've seen those online and they look nice. I've also seen on ebay knockoffs of the Leica M-grip for $59 (the real one costs $200, as does Tom A's grip, while the photoequip one is $130). I wish there was a place I could go buy one and see them first to see what fits me best...these are expensive to buy without touching!"
Chris: PM me with a mailing address. I've got a spare PhotoEquip grip that I could loan you for a week or two to try out.
Chris: PM me with a mailing address. I've got a spare PhotoEquip grip that I could loan you for a week or two to try out.
Roger Hicks
Veteran
Absolutely, on both counts. But as I genuinely can't see how half cases and grips can make the camera more comfortable for anyone, and so, a bare camera is more practical too. My wife has very small hands and feels the same way. Her rheumatologist has huge hands and uses his Leica with no add-ons, too.
All that this tells you is that a question like this, which depends 100% on personal opinion and not even on hand size, is of limited usefulness in deciding what will suit you best.
Quite honestly, my advice to anyone who wants to plump out a small camera is, "Buy a bigger camera. Don't mess up a small one." But as I said, it's intensely personal.
Cheers,
R.
marke
Well-known
Well, I guess a couple of us have already answered that question.
I can understand the halfcase comfort also. But as I said, I don't use mine anymore, for another reason. Someone brought these items up in question and look what we already have...JRG is offereing to lend a grip to Chris for him to try out. You might call that "limited usefulness", but I don't think so. Seems to me like the question was worth it. When we ask questions like this, we also learn why some people might prefer one option over another.
As I have already said, this "plumping out" (as you call it), adds nothing beyond the thickness of even a collapsed Elmar 50, so please help me understand how this plumping out happens? And please explain how adding this extra piece is "messing up" the camera. The grip I have has had caused absolutely no damage to the camera, even though I use the camera everyday. The grip is easy to remove, if I ever care to.
I sure wouldn't advise someone to get a bigger camera when adding a very unobtrusive part such as a grip would do the trick. Choosing a different camera often carries much more profound changes, in it's operation alone, than adding such a small piece. Sorry, Roger, but I just don't get your logic.
back alley
IMAGES
let me show you how it's done...
what amazes me is that it amazes roger that some folks like these...
what amazes me is that it amazes roger that some folks like these...
mackigator
Well-known
I switched from shoulder straps to the Sling (the finger loop thingy). I like it. My favorite favorite is a Luigi half case + the sling.
fixbones
.......sometimes i thinks
I am still finding my comfort zone with the RFs but so far,
I'd rather have the camera over my neck or bandolier style to have my hands free (A&A and Domke Grippers). As when i need to hold the camera in hand, i just wrap the strap over my wrist.
With regards to Half Cases, they certainly make the camera much bulkier and easier to grip. However, switching between half case and naked, i've realized that i never missed the half case when my camera go naked.
I'd rather have the camera over my neck or bandolier style to have my hands free (A&A and Domke Grippers). As when i need to hold the camera in hand, i just wrap the strap over my wrist.
With regards to Half Cases, they certainly make the camera much bulkier and easier to grip. However, switching between half case and naked, i've realized that i never missed the half case when my camera go naked.
Bob Michaels
nobody special
Like underwear, it is a personal choice where something that works for one may not for another.
Personally, I have never been able to deal with bags or straps of any kind, preferring to carrying one camera in my right hand down below waist level. Pockets are for film, wallet and car keys.
My two ZI bodies have handgrips. I can carry them one handed by the grip all day with no distress. My CLE does not have a handgrip but after a few hours I end up carrying it one handed in such a manner that I do need use of my left hand to raise it to my eye to shoot. I carry my Mamiya 7 and ContaxG bodies one handed by the built in grip similar to the ZI.
robklurfield
eclipse
just got a gordy wrist strap in the mail today. it's great. nice and secure.
coelacanth
Ride, dive, shoot.
For my MP (only the real RF I have at the moment), I use this A&A's simple cloth strap (ACAM 102). it's quite short and very discrete. I can carry the camera with this strap on my shoulder, camera itself hidden behind my arm while I walk around. Or I can quickly wrap the strap around my hand in a specific way, and it will become a very secure wrist/hand strap that helps holing/shooting with one hand.
If this strap wears out or I get another RF body, I'll buy the exact same strap again. I'm planning to replace different A&A strap on my OM1 with this one, too.
If this strap wears out or I get another RF body, I'll buy the exact same strap again. I'm planning to replace different A&A strap on my OM1 with this one, too.
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Roger Hicks
Veteran
Dear Mark,
That's all right, I don't get yours either.
The thickness of a collapsed Elmar is completely irrelevant, as no-one holds the camera with their fingers across the lens. A case or grip plumps up the part you actually hold.
Messing up does not need to be permanent.
Grips are simply NOT unobtrusive as far as I am concerned, let alone 'very unobtrusive'. They're horrible great lumpy things. For me, grips and half cases are like a new filling in a tooth: even something quite tiny can feel like Mount Everest. I feel much the same way about soft releases -- sorry, Tom -- of which I have tried perhaps six or eight and own three or four.
I've been using Leicas for around 40 years. For the first 25-30 years I never heard anyone bemoan the lack of a grip, which leads me to suspect that they are a fairly recent fashion, much like a blind belief in frequent CLAs. Some, no doubt, find them useful. Others, I am equally sure, buy them because they can't resist bolt-on goodies, or just because they can't resist spending money.
I have nothing against bolt-on goodies. My MP has a Leicavit, my M2, one of Tom's rapid winders. Unlike some others on RFF, I am quite happy with accessory finders when they are needed. It's just that grips and half cases do less than nothing for me: they actually spoil the camera. In other words, I am as vehemently against them as others (including you) are for them. But as I said, it's totally personal.
Cheers,
R.
Al Kaplan
Veteran
I like the accessory finder on my Bessa L/15mm Heliar combo. I often shoot it one handed and the finder sometimes gets used as a finger hold. Trigger winders add weight and bulk and are no faster than my thumb. I've had a couple of 'vits. Also I prefer to "shoot the moment" rather than playing motor winder. Two or three well timed shots beat a dozen rapid random ones.
http://thepriceofsilver.blogspot.com
http://thepriceofsilver.blogspot.com
Roger Hicks
Veteran
Dear Al,
Another example of how personal it is. Point fully taken about the weight and bulk of Leicavits, but they are faster than my thumb, and (like a new filling) you get used to them...
I completely agree about the well timed shots. I have a motor that fits my M4-P and MP but I'm not even sure where it is, and my F36 drives were really a bit of a bad joke.
Cheers,
R.
Ezzie
E. D. Russell Roberts
My R-D1 has a self made hardwood handgrip. But will be uprated to a Bridge Handgrip soon. I have a Voigtlander neck strap which I wrap around my hand and wrist and hold the camera by the grip. Keeps the strap out of the way when shooting, and as a safety measure in case I loose hold of the grip. Allows one handed shooting if need be. Maybe a wrist strap would be better, but I like the neck strap too.
dacookieman
Cookie Monster
Did you get the standard length? I keep feeling that the standard length wrist strap i ordered may be too short? Just a feeling. Or maybe im wearing it wrong.
Btw, does anyone know if the leica goodies SLING is suitable for the OM1? Has anyone tried it before?
JRG
Well-known
"Two or three well timed shots beat a dozen rapid random ones."
Al: That pretty much says it!
I've never been able to work up any interest in a motor drive or rapid winder. If I were a sports photographer, say, I'd likely see things in a different light, so to speak. Fortunately, I'm not.
Al: That pretty much says it!
I've never been able to work up any interest in a motor drive or rapid winder. If I were a sports photographer, say, I'd likely see things in a different light, so to speak. Fortunately, I'm not.
JRG
Well-known
"Did you get the standard length? I keep feeling that the standard length wrist strap i ordered may be too short? Just a feeling. Or maybe im wearing it wrong."
That's mostly a matter of the size of your hand, I think. I've got three Gordy straps at the moment, all longer than standard length. But I'm pretty sure that the standard length would work just as well. I just like the longer length because it gives me a slightly better vertical hang with the bandolier strap that I use: The camera body nestles lens-deep in my left front pants pocket.
That's mostly a matter of the size of your hand, I think. I've got three Gordy straps at the moment, all longer than standard length. But I'm pretty sure that the standard length would work just as well. I just like the longer length because it gives me a slightly better vertical hang with the bandolier strap that I use: The camera body nestles lens-deep in my left front pants pocket.
kshapero
South Florida Man
For it to work the side lugs need to be not protruding towards the front.
SOSO
Newbie
Do yo guys know any A&A dealer in Europe? All i can find is in Japan or USA, and the shipping costs are too high for a simple strap.
Thank you.
Thank you.
marke
Well-known
Roger, we might be talking about two different things here. And you just prompted me to try something. If I am grabbing or holding the camera, but not in shooting position, the grip provides a more secure hold, as my fingers can now easily cup around the grip without nearly as much muscle tension as without a grip. Think of it like holding onto a stick.
Now, as I lift the camera into shooting position, I find that the grip becomes almost foreign to how I want to hold the camera. My entire hand now rotates foward a small amount. In addition, my shutter finger now goes from a completely flat, "pressing" position, into a more curled, pointed downwards position. Hmmm...this has got me thinking. I don't want to be using the tip of my finger to move the shutter button. I want the pad, with a flatter finger position.
It seems (to me at least), that the grip will provide a more secure way to hold the camera, even while shooting, but might also cause one to modify their hand position while shooting. Enough to cause a problem? Everyone has to try himself, I suppose. I would assume that much might also be dependant on not just the size of your hand, but how about the length of your fingers? Some people may have large hands, but short fingers. In such a case, I can easily see how a grip would be very uncomfortable. But I have fairly large hands and fairly long fingers. That might prove why, even though the grip compromises my shooting position a bit, it's not enough to cause any real problem. That "tooth filling" is very easy to adjust to and disappears almost immediately.
I have never seen a need for one. I have never had a problem with smoothly pressing a shutter button. As yous said, these are also very personal choices.
Rcent, yes. But I would still call them more than a fashion. Granted, some of them look pretty slick, but there are still practical reasons for them (for some of us).
I'm of the belief that if it's working properly, don't try to fix it. I picked up my 1958 M3 last spring. It was in great shape, both cosmetically and functionally. There are a couple date stickers inside the bottom plate, which I assume were CLA dates. The last one was performed 35 years ago. I've tested all shutter speeds against my MP, and they all match. Obviously, I should be considering a CLA.
My 1952 IIIf RD works just as well. I'm not messing with it.
See, now to me, that's messing up a fine camera! LOL :bang:
Yes.
Chris101
summicronia
I'm sure y'all are gonna crucify me for this, as it'll probably pull the eyelet out or something:
All my "light" cameras (Leica M4-P, OM-1n and Nikon N80) I use an extra long, thin, shoulder strap hooked to only one of the eyelets, so the camera hangs at waist level in the vertical position. This seems most natural for me to either grab it and bring it to my eye for quick composing, or to just shoot from the hip. That way the time spent fiddling around with the camera before shooting is minimized.
My heavier cameras, Nikon digitals, F5, FG or Mamiya medium formats I attach the strap to both eyelets. In the case of the digitals, I use a wristknot with the supplied strap, so it is secured to my wrist. A snatch-and-run thief would end up with my hand as well! But I am assured it won't hit the ground should I lose my grip! With the other cameras, I use a shorter strap. I like it to sit right above my stomach (which is ... supersized) so when I carry two cameras, they don't click together.
I do use a half-case (the bottom of an an old Olympus never-ready that screws into the tripod socket) with the OM-1n and the FG. It just makes grabbing such a small body easier! I am fond of the hand grip of modern Nikon slrs, but I can live without it. I prefer to grab RF cameras (well, I only have a Leica M4-P) with no accouterments. It seems to fit in my hands just fine as it is.
All my "light" cameras (Leica M4-P, OM-1n and Nikon N80) I use an extra long, thin, shoulder strap hooked to only one of the eyelets, so the camera hangs at waist level in the vertical position. This seems most natural for me to either grab it and bring it to my eye for quick composing, or to just shoot from the hip. That way the time spent fiddling around with the camera before shooting is minimized.
My heavier cameras, Nikon digitals, F5, FG or Mamiya medium formats I attach the strap to both eyelets. In the case of the digitals, I use a wristknot with the supplied strap, so it is secured to my wrist. A snatch-and-run thief would end up with my hand as well! But I am assured it won't hit the ground should I lose my grip! With the other cameras, I use a shorter strap. I like it to sit right above my stomach (which is ... supersized) so when I carry two cameras, they don't click together.
I do use a half-case (the bottom of an an old Olympus never-ready that screws into the tripod socket) with the OM-1n and the FG. It just makes grabbing such a small body easier! I am fond of the hand grip of modern Nikon slrs, but I can live without it. I prefer to grab RF cameras (well, I only have a Leica M4-P) with no accouterments. It seems to fit in my hands just fine as it is.