Thinking of Buying First M...Recommendations?

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I used to always say an M3. But these cameras are getting very old and nearly always need a full CLA, which is not cheap, so if it were me the oldest camera I'd get is an M6, which is in your budget. Nice to have an on camera meter too.

You definately want Leica lenses. I would get a Bessa R2 or R3 and get the Leica glass if money is tight before getting non Leica glass. It's all about the lenses, not the camera.
 
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M2. You can use 28mm lenses with some guesswork. There is very nice one in the classifieds right now.
 
I figure that I will try to shoot for a 50mm leica if I can. Wide angle leicas are just out of the question for my budget, they probably would be even if I went for a cheap body.
 
you can have it all

you can have it all

No one RF does it all well. Except maybe an M3 + CV minifinder.
 
KEH has BGN grade M4-P bodies for $665. Would it be safe to go with a BGN M4-P? I'm always uneasy about buying things in BGN condition, but KEH is a great company, and does do exchanges and returns.
 
Why not keep the 50 you have? If it's a Canon lens, you might find that you'd be hard pressed to find a better 50 for less than your total budget.

Otherwise, if I were to ever go for a M rather than my IIIf, I'd get a M2 and a nice Canon 35mm lens. The rest of the money would be spent on Tri-X & Ektar ;)

William
 
I have a CL and the Summicron 40, but some think it's not really an M. I like it. When I hit the lottery, I'll get an M2/M3/MP or whatever.
 
seems like keh is running low on leica gear. these caught my eye, though:

$1269 m5 (ex+)
$819 cl (ln-)

i would get a 35/1.4 nokton classic or 50/1.1 nokton for the m5, and a 40/1.4 nokton for the cl.

keh doesn't have one, but i'd also look for an m6 classic and a pre-asph 50mm summilux on ebay or rff.

sometimes, a nikon s3 2000 will go up for sale (~$1000) in mint or near mint condition. that plus a 50/1.5 c-sonnar in s-mount would be veeeeeeery nice. i'd get that over any meterless leica m.
 
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Creagerj said:
KEH has BGN grade M4-P bodies for $665. Would it be safe to go with a BGN M4-P? I'm always uneasy about buying things in BGN condition, but KEH is a great company, and does do exchanges and returns.
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I've got an M4-2 that I got from KEH like two years ago. It was in BGN condition when I got it, has since been used almost daily, picked up quite a few more scratches, but works perfectly fine.

It, along with a M2 and four lenses, is headed to Peru with me for the next 3 months. The M's will be used for a photojournalism project documenting the daily lives of the Quechua people living in the Andes.

As a user, I'm a big fan of the M4-2/P and wouldn't be afraid of one missing paint or with some minor dings.
 
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Are you sure you want a very used and several decades old camera?
Are you sure that brand will give more to your photographs?
Are you sure you want the cheapest bargain model from that brand?

Cheers,

Juan
 
Nobody has mentioned the 40mm Summicron or Rokkor? It just seems like more of a normal on a Leica than a 50mm, which feels long to me.

Not pitching the one I was selling, as it just sold. But a lot of people really love the 40/2 lenses - great bokeh, great in-between the 35 and 50.

I'd rather have a 50-yr old M than a new Bessa; you can hardly characterize any of the M-series as the cheapest bargain model ;-)
 
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Is the M4-P really that "cheap" of a camera? After all, it isn't a CL, and it is basically an M6 w/o metering. I'm not going to lie, I don't want a bessa, I know that. I have faith in the ruggedness of the Leica M, if they are anything like my old Nikon F3, buying used probably isn't a risk. I don't want to buy a new camera, I'll just hate to see it get beat up.
 
None of them are cheap, Juan is just passionate and doesn't buy into the cult. A Bessa will work fine until it dies and isn't worth repairing, but an M is usually worth repairing.

The compliant about the post-M4 bodies is that their steel gears feel a little less smooth than the older brass geared models. But they needed to switch to steel in order to use motorized winders. And, in every model since the first M3, they've simplified the finder and made things a little more assembly-line efficient than hand-made and custom fitted. The M3 and M2 have the best finders, but also the oldest ;-/

You'll be fine with any M, it depends more on the condition of the individual camera - even the "newer" M6s can be 25-plus years old and in need of a tune-up. Be patient and wait for a known seller who can tell you the history of the camera and favor ones with recent CLA.

Now about those 40mm -- you will feel (not so much see) a quality difference between VC and Leica glass, so why hang a Bessa lens in front of your Leica? But you can pick up a 40mm Summicron for >$400, which is the sleeper bargain of the line. And by bargain I don't mean cheap.
 
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robklurfield said:
M2 and a canon 35/2 and canon 50/1.4. You can do the whole kit for somewhere in the lower to middle end of your range and still have money left over for plenty of film.
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With your budget in mind, I think the above is very good advice. An M2 in good user condition can be had for under $600, leaving you w/ sufficient funds to spend on glass. The Canon 50s are outstanding, as are the CV 50s, and Frank P also has an excellent point about a 40. An M2 and a Nokton or Rokkor 40 would be a terrific kit, and would leave you money left over for film. If you prefer 50, I'd recommend either the Canon 50/1.4 mentioned by Rob, or the Canon 50/1.8, and get the lens CLA'd. The Nokton 50/1.5 is a terrific optic, but the lens itself is on the large size.

To answer another question: camera bodies rated BGN grade by KEH are worth the risk. KEH has a no questions asked return policy, so you can buy, test, and return if the item does not suit. My M2 was a BGN KEH buy (for under $550), and the only "problem" was a bit of missing vulcanite. The camera worked just fine. I've since had it recovered and CLA'd, and it is a thing of beauty.

One final note, looking forward: older Leica glass is often not expensive, and can be well worth the investment. Budget a CLA.

Good luck!!
 
speaking of new, there's a nib m4-2 on ebay. bin is $1490, which is a bit high, but they're taking offers. i imagine they'd be ok with $1250.
 
I'd be sure you do not want an internal meter before buying a M4-2/ or M4-P. You can get a mint, late serial M6 classic for about $1200-1400. I rate this as about the best user camera you can get in terms of utility and value. I have a M2 but you can run into issues with balsam separation etc. A late M6 from a shop with a warranty should be a low risk purchase with decades left in it. It would be my personal choice.
 
I have seen more threads on RFF on Leicas having problems than Bessas...

About price, they're the same... You can buy an R4M or an M2, M3 and M4 for the same money... About how long they will last, people tend to believe a Leica will last more, but that's including repairs and CLA's for Leicas... About photography, none is better. It just seemed to me that the OP showed more interest in a brand than in a camera.

Yet I believe that for a normal, the best camera is an R3M with 1:1 vision and a just computer designed fast 50 1.1 ready to shoot any situation. And two Leica stickers on them.

Cheers,

Juan
 
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