fixbones
.......sometimes i thinks
Hey guys,
Been using my MP for a while now. Kinda yearning for a camera with AE. Thus I am thinking of selling my MP and getting a M7.
Why? I think I can shoot faster with the M7. I am still a little slow with my MP. Thought I'd improve but still slow. Missing the AE of my Ikon (sold last year)
Anybody done the same?
Been using my MP for a while now. Kinda yearning for a camera with AE. Thus I am thinking of selling my MP and getting a M7.
Why? I think I can shoot faster with the M7. I am still a little slow with my MP. Thought I'd improve but still slow. Missing the AE of my Ikon (sold last year)
Anybody done the same?
Keith
The best camera is one that still works!
I've come to the conclusion that in camera metering whether it be AE capable or not can slow you down depending on the situation. I've had an M7 and to be honest I didn't really think much of it ... I'd be keeping the MP personally but it's your decision ultimately.
I seem to be drifting back towards un-metered cameras for reasons I can't really quantify, aside from the fact that my judgement of light seems to be better than the meters in most cameras I've used excluding the matrix type in the two digitals I own.
I seem to be drifting back towards un-metered cameras for reasons I can't really quantify, aside from the fact that my judgement of light seems to be better than the meters in most cameras I've used excluding the matrix type in the two digitals I own.
fixbones
.......sometimes i thinks
I am just kinda on the fence at the moment.
I am obviously still not confident enough with my light judgement and have missed a few photo moments......maybe an indication I need to bring it out more.
Never brought my camera to work.... but am thinking of starting it as a habit so I can use it more.
I am obviously still not confident enough with my light judgement and have missed a few photo moments......maybe an indication I need to bring it out more.
Never brought my camera to work.... but am thinking of starting it as a habit so I can use it more.
Keith
The best camera is one that still works!
I used to listen to people banging on about how much better it was to shoot without a meter here and generally thought they were talking out of their arses to be blunt!
It's not always the case but often you'll get lighting situations where a meter is a time wasting distraction and you're far better off trusting your own judgement ... and if you cock it up it will definitely stick in your mind for future reference.
It's not always the case but often you'll get lighting situations where a meter is a time wasting distraction and you're far better off trusting your own judgement ... and if you cock it up it will definitely stick in your mind for future reference.
back alley
IMAGES
unmetered cameras can be faster the those with built in or ae metering...can be...
you need to practice with the sunny 16 rule and make changes according to the light. not that hard if you practice...but i think some never get the hang of it till they relax.
i had an m4-p as my first leica and eventually sold it because it had no meter and i was so slow.
years later i bought an m3 and also a brace of canon p's...all used with handheld meters or no meters...lots of no meters...it just started to click...
but in the end, you need to go with what makes better images for you.
you need to practice with the sunny 16 rule and make changes according to the light. not that hard if you practice...but i think some never get the hang of it till they relax.
i had an m4-p as my first leica and eventually sold it because it had no meter and i was so slow.
years later i bought an m3 and also a brace of canon p's...all used with handheld meters or no meters...lots of no meters...it just started to click...
but in the end, you need to go with what makes better images for you.
Tim Gray
Well-known
I bought an M7 to compliment my M6. Haven't regretted it one bit. When I want AE (about 25% of the time), it's there. When I don't want it, I switch over to manual.
You've had an RF with AE. If you liked it and you find that you truly miss it, I think you know the answer to your question.
You've had an RF with AE. If you liked it and you find that you truly miss it, I think you know the answer to your question.
woodphoto
woodphoto
Dude, your going to miss shots regardless of the camera or its metering capability, it happens to everybody. Do you get mad when you miss a shot while reloading? Of course not, its just part of photography. I've missed shots while changing out memory cards. Practice with the MP, its a great camera. Eventually you won't care about the 1 or 2 missed shots because you know there will be plenty of good shots you did get.
loneranger
Well-known
I've had both an m6 and mp, but now cannot live without the m7, for night shots, the AE makes a huge difference, and the shutter feels quieter, it's so nice not to constantly have to think about the exposure, it frees you to think abou your picture, also the m7 feels much sturdier than Zeiss ikon,
Good luck
Good luck
Frank Petronio
Well-known
Seems like you'll have no problem finding people who want to get rid of their M7 for an MP....
Colin Corneau
Colin Corneau
Why would you trust any in-camera metering over an external meter?
I think it's entirely fair to want confirmation for exposure, but objectively speaking I suggest it's better to either hone your observation, or get a small external meter and learn to work with that.
You've got a fantastic camera that will work as long as you live (or longer, really)...use it.
I think it's entirely fair to want confirmation for exposure, but objectively speaking I suggest it's better to either hone your observation, or get a small external meter and learn to work with that.
You've got a fantastic camera that will work as long as you live (or longer, really)...use it.
Rob-F
Likes Leicas
There is a lot of wisdom to that. I think I have hosed up more exposures with AE than without it. I think the built-in meters in Leicas are excellent, but like any meter they must be used with judgment--whether AE or not.
This evening as I was rewinding the film in my M6TTL, my fingers slipped off the tiny rewind crank--not once, but three times. I thought, maybe I'll just keep my MPs and if I want to sell something, I will sell an M6 instead. And do I really want an M7? I tried one before and didn't keep it. What makes me think I want another?
Vincent.G
Well-known
You're probably going through a phase in rangefinder usage called "if-only-I-had-syndrome". Many of us probably have felt the same way as you do now. Photography is a very personal thing. If you have to think twice or thrice changing to another camera, you probably don't have to. If you really had to change to an M7, you would have done it straightaway without asking us. I believe you are hesitating probably because of something the MP can offer you that the M7 cannot.
bobby_novatron
Photon Collector
Many good responses here -- each has their own gem of wisdom.
FWIW, I cut my teeth on a Contax IIa (no meter), a bunch of FSU cameras (no meter), and finally a lovely M6. Learning the metering on the M6 took a while, but eventually I got the hang of it. I'd make a little game of it for myself -- I'd read the lighting situation, do a quick Sunny16 guess in my head, then check the meter. I learned to hone my guesses that way.
Recently, I bought an M7. It's a great camera. I love the AE. To be honest, I'm not nearly as fast in reading the light as the M7 is. I haven't had one 'bad' exposure -- the metering is very accurate, once you learn how it responds (similar to the M6 or MP, I would guess).
It's nice to not have to fiddle with one of the camera's controls (shutter speed or aperture) ... instead I can just focus and compose. It's definitely faster than using my M6.
Like others have said, ultimately the decision is up to you. If you owned a Zeiss Ikon before, then owning an M7 will be a very similar experience. Do you want to go back to that? Is it a net gain to you in terms of usefulness?
FWIW, I cut my teeth on a Contax IIa (no meter), a bunch of FSU cameras (no meter), and finally a lovely M6. Learning the metering on the M6 took a while, but eventually I got the hang of it. I'd make a little game of it for myself -- I'd read the lighting situation, do a quick Sunny16 guess in my head, then check the meter. I learned to hone my guesses that way.
Recently, I bought an M7. It's a great camera. I love the AE. To be honest, I'm not nearly as fast in reading the light as the M7 is. I haven't had one 'bad' exposure -- the metering is very accurate, once you learn how it responds (similar to the M6 or MP, I would guess).
It's nice to not have to fiddle with one of the camera's controls (shutter speed or aperture) ... instead I can just focus and compose. It's definitely faster than using my M6.
Like others have said, ultimately the decision is up to you. If you owned a Zeiss Ikon before, then owning an M7 will be a very similar experience. Do you want to go back to that? Is it a net gain to you in terms of usefulness?
DamenS
Well-known
No - but I wouldn't listen to anyone else either ... the Leica MP is higher on the "purist" (fanboy ?) ranking so I would think there will be a lot of people who would tell you not to do it.
You however, have a very clear reason for wanting to do so, and it seems an eminently reasonable reason - you believe you are currently missing photos that you would get with the M7 (and you have experience with another AE rangefinder to back that belief up).
Given all of this, I would say you'd be crazy NOT to make the change. Enjoy taking photos with your new M7 !!
You however, have a very clear reason for wanting to do so, and it seems an eminently reasonable reason - you believe you are currently missing photos that you would get with the M7 (and you have experience with another AE rangefinder to back that belief up).
Given all of this, I would say you'd be crazy NOT to make the change. Enjoy taking photos with your new M7 !!
maddoc
... likes film again.
I made that switch, not straight from MP to M7 but using some other cameras in-between. The MP is mechanical-precision mainly on the paper, mine spent over 50% of the time I had it at Leica to be brought into specs.
My M7 is also not trouble-free, three trips to Leica already, but when the camera works it is a fine machine and more reliable regarding exposure than the MP (or M6) due to AE and electronically governed shutter.
I would not switch back, as a mechanical only camera and second body every M4-2 or M4-P will do and M7 + one of these are as expensive as a single MP.
My M7 is also not trouble-free, three trips to Leica already, but when the camera works it is a fine machine and more reliable regarding exposure than the MP (or M6) due to AE and electronically governed shutter.
I would not switch back, as a mechanical only camera and second body every M4-2 or M4-P will do and M7 + one of these are as expensive as a single MP.
cambolt
Green Spotted Nose Turtle
If you shoot B+W usually you don't have to worry about metering accurately as much as people seem to think. Especially if you use a film with an extra wide exposure latitude such as Tri-x, which doesn't even seem to mind being underexposed 1 stop and being developed as normal. I use an M2, and a unmetered spotmatic before, and when outdoors I usually just remember my light meter reading for sun, open shade, etc. Really not that difficult. I'm starting to learn indoors now
LeicaFan
Well-known
Agreed. I think we all suffer from this at times.
Do you really think that the M7 will make you quicker? And if so, is it enough to make you switch cameras?
I would keep the MP simply because the prices are on the rise (especially since Leica has currently suspended production). If you decide to sell the M7 and go back to an MP, you'll probably lose quite a bit of money.
Vincent.G
Well-known
The M7 is a camera I would love to have because its AE is useful when photographing my kids and occasional street photography. I am saving up for one. Meanwhile my Nikon F3/T will do the job.
Personally I want a camera that suits my style of shooting and what I will use it for. I want to enjoy using that camera.
loneranger
Well-known
Gid
Well-known
Get the M7. I've had no problems with the exposures from mine. You just have to know when the meter is likely to be fooled, which is not often - this is not an M7 specific problem, it relates to most AE cameras. The MP is just an over priced M6 (I have had one so know what I'm talking about) albeit very pretty. You could just about get a used M6 and M7 for the price of a used MP. Can't understand why a used MP carries such a premium, Leica prices both the MP and M7 the same new.